Decent German intelligence services in WW2

  • Thread starter Deleted member 1487
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That is another way of looking at it of course. I think it was an intelligence failure because the Communist party and the intelligence services had grown so tight they where one and the same and more importantly, intellignece are collected and processed for a reason (well, multiple) and evaluated against that goal, they failed.
 
I agree with Wiking. The Nazi state was so closely identified with extreme German nationalism that it could never have developed a substantial network of non-German sympathizers (willing to risk their lives) in positions of responsibility in other countries the way the British, Americans, and Soviets did.

There were a few exceptions, specifically right-wingers who thought Hitler was Europe's best bet against Russia, and people in countries that feared Russian invasion. But Nazi Germany as such just didn't have the universal appeal of its main rivals.
 
People spy for four reasons apparantly: MICE: Money, Ideology, Compromised, and I belive Ego. They could still pay people, photograph them in bed with somebody not their wife and just seduce them trough normal spy tricks.
 
well, heck, don't forget that the ABWHER did pull off some spectacular intel coups as it was OTL- such as the Venlo incident in 1939 which essentially was a very successful sting operation against MI5 in the Netherlands, that made British intelligence VERY wary of any subsequent purported overtures from German anti-Nazi resistance movements), and the ENGLANDSPIEL in 1943 where German intelligence in the Netherlands duped SOE for so long thru a compromised network, resulting in the loss of dozens of agents and large quantities of arms...
 
Intelligence is a very tricky thing.

The accepted version is that French military intelligence was compromised at least as early as 1936 when it reported that German military strength was superior to the Allies in quality and quantity when the opposite was the case. British intelligence was incompetent when it accepted the French report without independent analysis. However, as far as I am aware there is no proof of this version apart from a construct of likely or believeable events. It could be that British intelligence was compromised and the French misled.

In any event my point is that intelligence is of paramount importance in military and political and economic decision making. Nothing is as powerful as information and nothing is as effective as knowing where the enemy is weak or where it is going to strike.
 
And even then believing Enigma is broken is a whole other issue.
Actually, the Germans were perfectly willing to believe it could be broken (which runs a bit contrary to the myth & the fantastic numbers of how hard it would be), but (in line with said numbers) found it too improbable any enemy would (or could, I'm not sure from memory) make the enormous effort required. When the issue came up, as it did a couple of times during the war, BdU tended to blame spies (& there were plenty of those...)
 
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