DBWI WI we lived in West-dominated world?

Even if they had managed to become united and stay united, would the people of Fulang have developed the ships and skills to become good enough sailors to discover and colonise the Eastern Continent? Perhaps they would have kept to the coasts and inland seas, maybe gaining a foothold in Fei*?

*Africa (according to Wikipedia).

That's seems more likely than their going to Yingzhou(1). They were in factmuch closer. But, were they strong enough to beat the Hui (2), who held then the North of Fei? Maybe if the plague had hit them hard instead of the Fulangi...

(1) North America, in Times of rice and salt
(2) Muslim
 
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Who could imagine a world without the Ch'in dominion of Fu Sang (i.e. Chinese California) or the Republic of Sarasvati (an Indianised analogue to the US, covering OTL's Brazil- in TTL the Amazon is named Sarasvati after a legendary lost Indian river)

Yes, it's hard to imagine, but interesting, though:cool:

And that, in turn, would mean one less spur to the development of Bharat- whith less trade to and from Ch'in going on, the maritime kingdoms of Kerala, Ceylon, Srivijaya and so on would be less prosperous and be less well equipped to make the voyages into the Western Ocean.

That, in turn, would mean that the Ch'in would have less incentive to find a different path to Africa for rhinoceros horn and other rarities and Kaw Shan Long would never have tried to sail East across the Great Ocean.

Yes, and with less trade with Tianxia, the kindoms of Bharat might have had less incentives to colonize Fei's coast, in order to supply our demand of Fei's products.:eek:

(Fei= Africa)
 
(Written in Esperanto by a person from Fadong who claimed to be educated by a Hui scholar, this message was discovered in the western deserts. Obviously the writer did not know that the person who produced the theory of the western advancement had been dead for around 35 years at the estimated date of the writing of this letter. The whereabouts of the westerner are still unknown, though some of the locals told rumors of an educated man who spoke of travelling far to the icy northwest, to try to make contact with a little-understood peoples who call themselves the "Polski." This message has been translated by my friend and political associate, Mao Tse Toung)

Bellow is the only part of the message that has been so far recovered. The papyrus the message was written on appears to be torn about 3/5 down the page, but a strange symbol in the shape of a circle with a cross in the middle of if seems to have been hastily scratched onto the back with a piece of coal, as well as the following word:

YC ELT IAID

The meaning of this inscription is yet unclear, but the handwritting seems to be from the same person that produced the message. The quality of the writing material is of a noticibly lesser quality than the well-crafted penmanship used on the reverse side. The word on the back does not seem to be from the Esperanto language as currently understood.


If the peoples of <<Europe>> had dominated the world instead of the east, then their lust for wealth could have led them to ruthlessly conquer <<Africa>> and the Eastern Continent. They could have even established Dominion over <<India>> and even <<China>>. But your point about Rogel Bacon is very interesting. My location of birth was near the ancient city of Paris, and I have before examined some of Bacon's works. As it turns out, he derived some of his empirical methods of deduction from peopled ostensibly named "Aristotia" and "Plado." The location or time period of these men is currently unknown, but they supposedly came from a region known to the natives as Hellas. If this information proves to be in fact correct, then it adds creedence to your theory about the cultural and intelllectual advancement of the ancient peoples from the far West.

The following message seems to have been written some time later, and samples from the paper lead to the suspicion that it was written in a much colder climate.

Currently, I am seeking a strage people who call themselves the Polski. They are rumored to live in a region known as <<Siberia>>, even though their <<Slavic>> relatives currently reside in <<Europe>>. What drew me to their search were rumors of a large sky god which came down from the sky around 6 years ago. Evidently this object was likely a large piece of rock from space impacting on the surface of the Earth. What is more interesting is that a few years after the blast, strange reports began circulating around the tribespeople north of the Mongol regions about rumors coming from the Polski people, rumors of strange beasts that stalked hunters in the night while they were alone. Physical reports from the hunters describe the beings as having 6 glowing golden eyes, grayish skin, large, pointed teeth, and being somewhat taller than the average person. Strangely enough, these rumors all seem to radiate out from the region where the space rock is said to have impacted the Earth. Tomorrow, I will investigate further into Polski territory and see if I can locate the source of these strange reports.

The following entry is dated several weeks later.

I have found the source of the reports. The local Polski people call them the <<angry night>>, and more sightings are reported everyday through the villages. Just two days ago, a village was found abandoned. The only thing of note that I found was the word "Y Celtiaid" written in blood on the ground in front of one of the dwellings. I have asked a hunter from the village to help me penetrate further into the taiga around the crash sight............... ..............attack........................
.............mutated........... .................terrestrial............................
............infect and the process takes several............................................................... hunter I was with has been infected...................................bit last night by a strange creatu[re?]........................................sick...........back at village...................................eyes have turned gold.........................................increased musculature..............................skull numb..........................feel so hot....................................................kill............kill......kill.........


This is where the message ends. Our sources predict that the writer of the message was infected and apparently converted into one of the beings described in the message. We do not know of his current whereabouts or of those of the "Y Celtiaid" peoples. Further investigation is required.
 
To prevent this going ASB I think we need the Roman Empire to survive. After all Rome had an advanced civilization for its time. If Justinian can reunite the empire you potentially have a formidable empire once again.
 
At the time of their height they were about equal in power. Easy? No, but there best shot.

Yes but you're all mad thinking that those lesser men could have a shot at surpassing us no less our Emperor. Now excuse me, I should get back to work in setting up the quarantine system for the newest space shuttle the Ishimura.
 
Us "Franks" as you like to call us, or Europeans as we call ourselves, are simply different politically, not intellectually. Also we don't make fun of your diversities, how would you like it if we thought all of you Chinese were Manchus?

It should be noted that we subjugated much of Arabia, Persia, and North Africa before being driven back. Europe possessed the largest *and still does* natural resource cache in the world, and for its time had for projection capabilities.

Also for such a modern age many here seem to be very much in the dark about the history of Europe, you are all examining texts of ours like its impossible to use Schizou or Josean search services to find out more about them!

For those of you so lazy and unwilling to look up the history, here is a brief series of maps of Europe before the plague started:

The less intelligent or thoughtful of you, preaching the superiority of neglect to mention the effects of European science. I mean you use European Temperatures, Weights, and other forms of standard measurement!

Also, what is this load of bollocks that we would go out and conquer the world for greed? You mean we would do exactly what you did? We would march into Tripoli, rather then having the Calphiate settle Italia, or we would wipe out huge portions of the Aborigionist Empires in the New World and take all of their gold?

How about European inventions in the aftermath of our population revival? Your "turtle ships" that the Koreans love to parade around as evidence of their great naval history are far outpaced chronologically by our "Ironclads".

Lets compound this all with wiping YOUR population out by about 80% during a time of great cultural revival, and see how you do!

Some of the racism seen here in such a modern age when we are trying to conquer the surface of Luna is astounding!
 
Us "Franks" as you like to call us, or Europeans as we call ourselves, are simply different politically, not intellectually. Also we don't make fun of your diversities, how would you like it if we thought all of you Chinese were Manchus?

It should be noted that we subjugated much of Arabia, Persia, and North Africa before being driven back. Europe possessed the largest *and still does* natural resource cache in the world, and for its time had for projection capabilities.

Also for such a modern age many here seem to be very much in the dark about the history of Europe, you are all examining texts of ours like its impossible to use Schizou or Josean search services to find out more about them!

For those of you so lazy and unwilling to look up the history, here is a brief series of maps of Europe before the plague started:

The less intelligent or thoughtful of you, preaching the superiority of neglect to mention the effects of European science. I mean you use European Temperatures, Weights, and other forms of standard measurement!

Also, what is this load of bollocks that we would go out and conquer the world for greed? You mean we would do exactly what you did? We would march into Tripoli, rather then having the Calphiate settle Italia, or we would wipe out huge portions of the Aborigionist Empires in the New World and take all of their gold?

How about European inventions in the aftermath of our population revival? Your "turtle ships" that the Koreans love to parade around as evidence of their great naval history are far outpaced chronologically by our "Ironclads".

Lets compound this all with wiping YOUR population out by about 80% during a time of great cultural revival, and see how you do!

Some of the racism seen here in such a modern age when we are trying to conquer the surface of Luna is astounding!

Bah! The Aborigines should be grateful we gave them a real civilization and allowed to be part of our empire! OOC: This thread makes it sound like we are talking about a highly arrogant and imperialistic empire so I am going along with that theme.
 
And their odd religions? Especially this one about this poor man who gets killed on a cross and then turns into a zombie and resurrects! How ridiculously stupid!
 
Im just glad that your "Great Empire" is too busy fighting insurgencies in Java, Borneo, and all across India to deal with Europe.

Im also Thankful that you only sacked a handful of our great cities before you were halted. DIE WACHT AM RHEIN !

OOC : I'm thinking a sort of Scenario were Muslim powers expand into Europe, China toys with the idea but gets halted on the Rhine in some huge battle overdone in importance like Tours, and then leaves.
 
And their odd religions? Especially this one about this poor man who gets killed on a cross and then turns into a zombie and resurrects! How ridiculously stupid!

Well, the idea of there being only one god is silly. Is there only one man? Is there only one nation or planet or virtually anything else? Why would there be only one god?
 
While most of us Europeans take religion with a bit of laugh and do not care, it was a METAPHOR.

The idea was that we were all apart of one existence, embodied in that omnipotent being who sent his embodiment of what the perfect man should be *Virtuous, Selfless, Humble, ect...* to remind the world of what made Humanity great.

The idea with his "resurrection" was that the thing that truly lives on is a man's legacy and memory, its not as if though he rose from the dead and conquered the Roman Empire!
 
Well we could say the same thing.

"if something is truly omnipresent why would there need to be multiple manifestations of it if all it is preaching is one central set of tenets"
 
Well we could say the same thing.

"if something is truly omnipresent why would there need to be multiple manifestations of it if all it is preaching is one central set of tenets"

Where did you get the idea that all the gods are omnipresent?
 
In our language, Latin, the very word "god" means omnipresent. I suppose in our language you would be worshiping a combination of "gods" and "saints".

However if the saints derive their power from another god, there is little point in worshiping them isn't there?
 
Its all quite a moot point anyway, most Europeans believe in the power of sheer human determination, not some mythical unhelping god.
 
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