DBWI: What if Thomas Jefferson had survived the Revolution?

So, as we all learned in school, it took the death of Thomas Jefferson to finally win the American Revolution in 1781. Surprised by British raiders at his estate in Virginia on a hot June day, what happened next has been endlessly debated since then. Was his death accidental? A deliberate execution? Whatever the case, the martyrdom of the author of the Declaration of Independence was the impetus for Washington to finally move south.

Putting aside what would have happened otherwise - because as we all know, the Continental Army would still be huddled outside New York today - what would have a post-war Governor Jefferson done with his life? I really don't think much. Some folks have their one moment in history and the Revolution was his. But aside from wading back into the morass that was Virginia politics, the endless tussles with the legislature, maybe he would have made something of himself as an early naturalist?
 
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I would imagine he would've ended up a lot like Thomas Paine. An 'ideas man' who everyone thought was brilliant for giving voice to discontent with British rule, but post-Revolution would've been considered too politically radical to really get anywhere. Granted, Jefferson didn't go nearly as far as Thomas Paine, but he still had pretty revolutionary (pun intended) ideas of how a country should operate. If he does go into federal politics, he's probably an earlier version of John Randolph of Roanoke, and maybe gets a cabinet spot in the Burr Administration.
 
Oh, I think its entirely possible that he could end up as President. Much of Jefferson's popularity today comes from his martyrdom, this much is true - but one shouldn't read his current status as the favorite Founding Father of Communards and other radicals, back into the past. Jefferson was very popular during his time, and he had a large influence on the Virginia Dynasty of OTL (both intellectually, and personally. Its sometimes easy to forget just how interrelated many of the leaders of the Revolution were with one another. It was a small world in many ways). I'd suspect that he would likely be a shoe-in as Governor of Virginia and would have certainly found a position in Washington's cabinet had he lived.

Now, of course, all of this is assuming that the Americans win the Revolution without Jefferson's martyrdom (which I think is certainly a strong possibility.) and decide to scrap the Articles of Confederacy as well (once again, a pretty strong possibility. The AoC were just too cumbersome and couldn't have worked in the long term as a national government). But, lets say that Jefferson ends up in Jefferson's cabinet. I could totally see him butting heads with Hamilton almost immediately and though I'm sure he would gravitate into the Adams circle due to their personal friendship, I just have a feeling that the Adams-Jefferson clique won't be enough to counteract Hamilton and his power grabs.

So, Jefferson leaves the cabinet and runs for Governor of Virginia where he'd be a shoe-in. He's now a former cabinet member, the governor of one of the two most populous states in the nation, and would be in a good position for him and Adams to help try to throw out the Hamilton cabal once Washington steps down after his second six-year term. Now, I'm not sure if it would be Jefferson in the top spot of Adams in this scenario, but lets say its Jefferson.

Now, how would Jefferson deal with the problems that beset the early Republic? Even in OTL he proved himself a strong supporter of the French enlightenment, and I could see him easily seeking to maintain the alliance between the US and France once the French Revolution happens. Does this drag the US into a second war with Great Britain, so much earlier than OTL and could the US even etch out a win in that situation?
 
I think the us might have expanded further if Jefferson had survived. He was the kind of guy who would definitely push for the us to gain as much territory as possible for farming. I wonder how Jefferson surviving would have affected slavery.
 
I think the us might have expanded further if Jefferson had survived. He was the kind of guy who would definitely push for the us to gain as much territory as possible for farming. I wonder how Jefferson surviving would have affected slavery.

Depends on which Jefferson we're talking about-if the person who survives is "Jefferson the Politician" from Professor Woodrow Wilson's "Revolutionary Fathers", we might see this plan to gain territory result in an America which is initially more rural and less focused on trade and industrialization. I think that means less popular agitation against slavery in the north, since there's less factory-and-mining proles who see slave labor as a threat to their livelihood. As a result, I think Jefferson's legacy would be completely at odds with OTL's view of him as "father of the Communards", and he would be known for entrenching slavery in the country.

On the other hand, we might be facing "Jefferson the Idealist". I know that it's now the fashion on the board to bash Communard historical views, but I think @The Lethargic Lett has the right idea. Jefferson the Idealist might not push for the expansion of slave-owning territory, and might free his slaves on his death and alienate himself from the slave-owning aristocracy. This Jefferson the Idealist may want to expand the US westward too, but is likely to self-sabotage in this plan due to his idealism. IIRC, the last scenario is actually discussed in a book of Athenian critique of Communard history which delves into counterfactuals-I want to say the author was a German fellow? Leon Bronstein, I think?
 
Depends on which Jefferson we're talking about-if the person who survives is "Jefferson the Politician" from Professor Woodrow Wilson's "Revolutionary Fathers", we might see this plan to gain territory result in an America which is initially more rural and less focused on trade and industrialization. I think that means less popular agitation against slavery in the north, since there's less factory-and-mining proles who see slave labor as a threat to their livelihood. As a result, I think Jefferson's legacy would be completely at odds with OTL's view of him as "father of the Communards", and he would be known for entrenching slavery in the country.

On the other hand, we might be facing "Jefferson the Idealist". I know that it's now the fashion on the board to bash Communard historical views, but I think @The Lethargic Lett has the right idea. Jefferson the Idealist might not push for the expansion of slave-owning territory, and might free his slaves on his death and alienate himself from the slave-owning aristocracy. This Jefferson the Idealist may want to expand the US westward too, but is likely to self-sabotage in this plan due to his idealism. IIRC, the last scenario is actually discussed in a book of Athenian critique of Communard history which delves into counterfactuals-I want to say the author was a German fellow? Leon Bronstein, I think?

The German you've referenced was named Leonhard Bronstein, the famous left-liberal academic who died in New York in 1960. And yes, Bronstein was a noted defender of the American Revolution in history, a position that was rather unusual in Germany until after the end of the Global War and the overthrow of the old Empire in 1939(though he was exiled on the personal orders of Wilhelm III in 1932, so there's that to consider).
 
Are you sure he'll even want to gain Louisiana, IOTL President Hamilton joined the Napoleonic wars and was able to take all French lands in North America, would Jefferson block such a move. Would he even run for president.
 
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