DBWI: The Difference Engine - Retrospective

Makemakean

OOC: Inspired by this thread.

Well, it's now less than a week left to the Series Finale of the BBC's Difference Engine, and... well it feels like the end of an era really, it truly made alternate history a thing there in the public mind, like science fiction and fantasy. I certainly can attest that it was through it that I learned about AH... Who would have thought back in 1999 that this show would last for 13 whole years? Even Gibson and Sterling who wrote the original novel (which is covered plot-wise in the first half of the first season of the TV series) said that they were amazed by the success.

While some would say that they might hope it returns in the future, I kind of disagree. To me it really feels like they have told a full story by now and anything more would just be lacklustre. I mean, they have explored everything by now: Steampunk British Empire, Second Empire France, the Balkanized America, Meiji Japan-on-steroids, revolutionary India... etc., etc. Plus, I'm kind of curious what Stephen Moffat has in mind for the future. Alledgedly, he's in talks about reviving Doctor Who.

So, I'm starting this thread partly as a retrospect: What did you think of their choice of making Laurence Oliphant, imperial agent of the Special Branch, the main character? What did you think of the writers decision to involve characters from other 19th century fiction such as Captain Nemo and Mycroft Holmes into the story? What characters did you like, which ones didn't you? Which was your favourite arc, etc., etc?

And partly as a discussion: What do you think will happen next Friday?

The forum is opened! :D
 
unclepatrick

unclepatrick

Makemakean said:
OOC: Inspired by this thread.

Well, it's now less than a week left to the Series Finale of the BBC's Difference Engine, and... well it feels like the end of an era really, it truly made alternate history a thing there in the public mind, like science fiction and fantasy. I certainly can attest that it was through it that I learned about AH... Who would have thought back in 1999 that this show would last for 13 whole years? Even Gibson and Sterling who wrote the original novel (which is covered plot-wise in the first half of the first season of the TV series) said that they were amazed by the success.

While some would say that they might hope it returns in the future, I kind of disagree. To me it really feels like they have told a full story by now and anything more would just be lacklustre. I mean, they have explored everything by now: Steampunk British Empire, Second Empire France, the Balkanized America, Meiji Japan-on-steroids, revolutionary India... etc., etc. Plus, I'm kind of curious what Stephen Moffat has in mind for the future. Alledgedly, he's in talks about reviving Doctor Who.

So, I'm starting this thread partly as a retrospect: What did you think of their choice of making Laurence Oliphant, imperial agent of the Special Branch, the main character? What did you think of the writers decision to involve characters from other 19th century fiction such as Captain Nemo and Mycroft Holmes into the story? What characters did you like, which ones didn't you? Which was your favourite arc, etc., etc?

And partly as a discussion: What do you think will happen next Friday?

The forum is opened! :D
Click to expand...

If Mofit is doing The Difference Engine, than who producing Doctor Who?
Who do you see as the Cast?
 

Strategos' Risk

The Manhattan Commune episodes with Daniel Day-Lewis as Kommissar Cutting had some of the best guest performances I've ever seen on television.
 
Petike

Petike

It's one of the best SF&F series of this generation. Though I thought it was getting kind of stale by the end... Especially the last two or so seasons were quite boring and not all that worthwhile. I tuned in a few times, but... Yeah, it wasn't that amazing. The finale was quite good, though. Gave you a nice sence of nostalgia, but also closure. It's good they ended TDE on a high note. :) I've always loved the third season inclusion of captain Nemo. Though this will in the long run probably prevent any kind of big-screen adaptation of Moore's League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, I don't mind. And Mycroft becoming a stable part of the character cast was not bad either.

On the flip side, the steampunk craze caused by the series nearly killed steampunk as an interesting retro-futuristic aesthetic. And the copycats, my God, the copycats ! Worst of all, several very good steampunk works in other media were really threatened by the attempts of some lunkheads at cash-ins. Remember the two horrendous Wild Wild West sequels ?! *puke* Did anybody think Chris Rock and Nicolas Cage would be the ideal replacements for Smith and Cline ? And then there was the godawful direct-to-DVD sequels and mockbusters. Make it stop ! It's telling that only the original 60s show has survived with any dignity among the steampunk fandom.

Worst of all, the fourth Thief game (made in 2007) nearly wasted the series, since it was made by a completely different developer who didn't give two sh*ts about the originals and tried to make the whole thing into a godawful "younger, kewler, hipper" Phinneas Steel ripoff - oh the irony, a ripoff of a poor American TV ripoff of the Beeb's TDE we're talking about. Then they tried to make a live-action series... Jesus ! But, thankfully, the original devs regained the rights, treat the fourth installment as non-canon and have started working on a true sequel. The recently started and dev-approved animated series made for Nickelodeon by Paul Dini's team gets more amazing with every episode. Even if you aren't familiar with the games, I suggest you watch it, it's a perfect retelling of the whole Thief mythos. And it's been getting some rave reviews, so I hope its success only grows. :) Shame Nick had to cancel that other animated show they were planning, a kind of Asian fantasy with steampunk elements. It sounded interesting, so it really is a pity it got cancelled. But the two guys who pitched the idea are now among the Thief : TAS screenwriters and I really like what I'm seeing on their part. :cool:

Oh, and about Who: Not gonna happen... Moffat is a talent, but I doubt he could really revive it. The 1996 movie with McGann was ultimately disappointing and the reviving of Who after a whopping 23 years seems... unlikely. Audience tastes have probably changed, even though the good Doctor has become a part of British popculture. Though steampunk Daleks would be cool. No, make that... dieselpunk Daleks !!! :cool: And put them into Prohibition era Manhattan, hiding among mobsters in speakeasies - awesome ! :D
 
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Strategos' Risk

Nowadays, steampunk is about as tired as cyberpunk in just about any medium. Arcanum III: Clockwork Curio even ended with the setting moving into (post-)modernity at the end, with the Unified Kingdom becoming a weird techno-magic direct democracy and Cumbria becoming a constitutional monarchy, and dwarves leaving Arcanum to colonize the stars. It seems like people everywhere are tired of steampunk- ever notice all of Sterling and Gibson's recent novels are set in the modern day War on Horror?

I do hope The Baroque Cycle's adaptation, though. They're saying that David Benioff and D. B. Weiss have been in extensive talks at HBO since 2007. It's not quite steampunk, but it's superficially close enough that most viewers would be able to adjust to the setting. It's just a shame that Neal Stephenson is more interested in pursuing his video game/augmented reality pipe dreams with CLACK, rather than bringing his works to life.
 

prosper o

I just wish I knew what the ending of the series meant...
OOC: I just wish I knew what the ending of the book meant...
 

Strategos' Risk

OOC: Dumb singularity BS that was pulled out of nowhere. Basically the punch cards that are so important to the plot solve Godel's Incompleteness Theorem early on, causing AI to be invented, and by the year 1991 London is a huge cybernetic megacomplex and all of the events of the book is essentially a history simulation run by it. Maybe I should have had my Arcanum III story allude to it.

Given that all of this is described in only a paragraph, I ignore it.

What I really want to know is- was the prostitute right and was Ada Lovelace, being related to Lord Byron, really a kinky trousers-chaser and the female equivalent of a player (what with her 'paladins')? Or was the whore just talking trash?
 

SPJ

I'm especialy glad of the choice to cast Naseeruddin Shah as Captain Nemo. His preformance has now made it common knowledge that the character in Verne's novel was Indian unlike in all other movie adaptations and the charater is now even more popular for it. If a movie version of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen is ever made he should be the first and only choice. Hell his preformance could carry the whole film if they let him!

Strategos' Risk said:
OOC: Dumb singularity BS that was pulled out of nowhere. Basically the punch cards that are so important to the plot solve Godel's Incompleteness Theorem early on, causing AI to be invented, and by the year 1991 London is a huge cybernetic megacomplex and all of the events of the book is essentially a history simulation run by it. Maybe I should have had my Arcanum III story allude to it.

Given that all of this is described in only a paragraph, I ignore it.

What I really want to know is- was the prostitute right and was Ada Lovelace, being related to Lord Byron, really a kinky trousers-chaser and the female equivalent of a player (what with her 'paladins')? Or was the whore just talking trash?
Click to expand...
OOC: What did the part mean about people having 'paper faces' or something?
 

Strategos' Risk

OOC: I think there's different interpretations everywhere about the ending. Here's one:

Surging humanity, all meaningless to the computer-thing that watches them, the computer-thing that gains sentience. I take to meant that their once great Engines, hailed as progress, the future, science, the epitome of knowledge and reason has somewhat turned against them and they become like pieces of a machine to the new consciousness, useful only in their time, life surging meaninglessly past them in their busy circles.
Click to expand...
 
unclepatrick

unclepatrick

I was not impressed with Alan Moore episode. But I loved Both of Neil Gaiman episodes. Two of the series best. Paul Cornel was the only writer to do at least one episode for every season. Kevin J Anderson provided the H G Well two parter. Some fan claim that the Nemo plot owns alot to Anderson novel Captain Nemo.
 

Kissinger

Banned
unclepatrick said:
It should be darker than the Classic series. Looking forward to it.
Click to expand...

Hope they don't make the Doctor the destroyer of worlds or something, just watched a series with that and it ruined it. The lesson is that the Brits can make time travel while the Japanese can't alon with the Americans, (Sliders!)
 

Richter10

Kissinger said:
Hope they don't make the Doctor the destroyer of worlds or something, just watched a series with that and it ruined it. The lesson is that the Brits can make time travel while the Japanese can't alon with the Americans, (Sliders!)
Click to expand...

But of course the japanse can make time travel stories! Just check the shojo juggernaut "The Quantum-Leaping Girl" (nine light novels, an anime with six seasons and a feature-length movie! - No wonder people calls it "the Sailor Moon of Science Fiction") and, of course, the J-drama "Steins;Gate".
 
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