DBWI: The Aurochs goes extinct

[Mort the Reaper]

I recently got back from a trip to Poland. Lovely country. Saw a lot of the famous places:
Krakow Old Town, Muskau Park, and Białowieża Forest. While I was in Białowieża Forest, I saw an Aurochs up close.

Seeing one in the flesh reminded me that they'd almost gone extinct once upon a time. But like the American Bison, they were brought back from the brink. Still, I can't help but wonder: what if they had died out?

 

[Dolan]

It's a good thing that The Auroch Bull is The Polish Royal Symbol since High Medieval time, and Historically only The King or The Crown Prince of Poland was permitted to slaughter only one for Christmas feast, and another one for Easter feast, further maintaining their presence there even as they were extinct everywhere else.

Sure, nowadays, the rule has been somewhat relaxed due to wild herd population already numbered in the 500000, and regular culling is required to maintain their environment, those are still firmly under the direction of Polish Royal Guards though.

Maybe have Poland either somehow subjugated by foreign powers, or undergone Republican Revolution at 19th century, and the "Royal Herd" would be quickly poached to extinction by vengeful peasants. It was a known story during 18 and 19th century, that a noble who killed an Auroch would be executed for treason, and a peasant who killed an auroch will have his immediate family exterminated. Aurochs may be popular as Preserved Species now, but during the Communist rebellions, they were deliberately hunted by rebels as those are symbols of Royal Authority.

 

[SeaCambrian]

Without his zoological expedition to Poland to study the aurochs in captivity of the Royal Polish Menagerie, Francis Willughby wouldn't have written the bestseller Ye Noble Aurochs And Ye Domeſtication Of Ye Cowes. That was one of Bonaparte's main inspirations, so Bonaparte probably wouldn't have studied animal domestication and formulated the theory of evolution.

 

[Dolan]

That was one of Bonaparte's main inspirations, so Bonaparte probably wouldn't have studied animal domestication and formulated the theory of evolution.

Yeah, Napoleon Bonaparte's "Origin of Species" is basically the cornerstone of modern biology, especially when combined with Gregor Mendel's theory of heredity.

It has been said that Bonaparte actually wanted to become military officer, but looking at Aurochs in Royal French Menagerie gave him another ideas...

 

[KaiserWilhelm]

Yeah, Napoleon Bonaparte's "Origin of Species" is basically the cornerstone of modern biology, especially when combined with Gregor Mendel's theory of heredity.

It has been said that Bonaparte actually wanted to become military officer, but looking at Aurochs in Royal French Menagerie gave him another ideas...

The sound of a million butterflies suddenly silenced

 

[Simeon]

The sound of a million butterflies suddenly silenced

Year, that was quite a great book by him, no doubt. But knowing whether he’s as good in the field as he’s at chess is quite moot and academic, however; we will never know for sure.

He will be a great loss to science, though, and the Social Wars may have become more violent without him opposing Social Napoleonicism.

 

[KaiserWilhelm]

Year, that was quite a great book by him, no doubt. But knowing whether he’s as good in the field as he’s at chess is quite moot and academic, however; we will never know for sure.

He will be a great loss to science, though, and the Social Wars may have become more violent without him opposing Social Napoleonicism.

Ah, you must be British. I’ve only heard the theory be referred to as Bonapartism.

 

[Whiteshore]

It has been said that Bonaparte actually wanted to become military officer, but looking at Aurochs in Royal French Menagerie gave him another ideas...

I wonder how the development of the French Republic would have been changed if this had occured as the Republic of France eventually stabilized under Sieyes' Consulate historically.

 

[Simeon]

I wonder how the development of the French Republic would have been changed if this had occured as the Republic of France eventually stabilized under Sieyes' Consulate historically.

Well, that last treatise of politics he made is admittedly serious about his erstwhile wet dreams of strategizing for a United Europe. A Great War would have started early, though I doubt it would be as ugly as it got IOTL.

Ah, you must be British. I’ve only heard the theory be referred to as Bonapartism.

Yeah, fuck the Napoleonicists. No matter how they vehemently denied, they were the principal proponent of class struggle that at least twice plunged Europe and the World into war, not the Obrists* that they frequently used as a scapegoat.

Anyways, would one want to turn this into the official biological thread of the site? Or will we continue talking about that biologist’s wet dream?

Anyways, I can think its extinction would precipitate to less awareness on the preservation* efforts on cattle and other significant animals IOTL. I doubt the American Bison will be as plentiful as it is today if it’s hunting was not limited to the natives; and the Aryavartan states would have their mouths frothing to any of its nations slaughtering cattle.

*from Spanish Obra & Obrero

 

[Dolan]

Anyway, the recent Auroch Population "census" has been done and their numbers turned out to be at 650000, confirming the suspicion of why the Royal Sanctuary grass didn't recover properly in recent times, and making some environmentalists concerned about potential damage the Royal Herd will done further to the Royal Snctuary (their ideal numbers, according to study is around 300000-400000).

There are proposals ranging from just rounding up the excess population and slaughter them en-masse for gigantic Christmas Feast in Poland, to moving the living surplus population to other sanctuaries who also tried to have sustainable Auroch population (but none are as successful as Polish ones).

King Wladislav has jokingly said that maybe everyone got special Christmas meal this year, so it seems that the mass culling for meat option is seriously considered, much to the dismay of Hindu states (who actually willing to pay for transport of living aurochs). Which one do you actually prefers in your opinion though?

 

[KaiserWilhelm]

I think discussion of that belongs in chat.

 

[Dolan]

I think discussion of that belongs in chat.

That's more about Species and environmental preservations though, in alternate timeline which Aurochs go extinct, there will never be Royal Polish Barbecue ever again. But yeah, maybe you're right, that was indeed related to Aryavartan religious belief.

It's a pity the previously gifted herd of Aurochs failed to properly sustain themselves in their Aryavartan sanctuaries despite best efforts. Maybe Polish Aurochs ironically already acclimatized to the relatively colder and dryer Eastern European climate compared to whatever breed they have thousands of years ago back in Hindustani?

 

[GeographyDude]

. . . It was a known story during 18 and 19th century, that a noble who killed an Auroch would be executed for treason, and a peasant who killed an auroch will have his immediate family exterminated. . .

This law was actually on the books for some 70 years, giving an all-time example for civic textbooks that poor people really were punished more harshly than rich people.

Actually, such a jarring example that I think it’s one of many factors which led to cleaner, more open government.

But a bunch of other factors like English businessman Jeremy Bentham, who also wrote on public policy, and who argued that punishment deters, not by its severity, but rather by its likelihood. He had an easy, fluid writing style which convinced a lot of people, and reform of criminal justice probably isn’t even among the top 5 of his achievements.

 

[Dolan]

This law was actually on the books for some 70 years, giving an all-time example for civic textbooks that poor people really were punished more harshly than rich people.

To be fair, it was also cited as the earliest known laws who comprehensively dealt with Environmental protection and Natural Sanctuary.

Yes, the punishments are definitely over-the-top and in many ways unfair to our modern standards, but considering they were written in either 12 or 13th Century...

ADD: I checked The Cyber-Encyclopedia again and confirmed that there are still harsh punishments for poachers who entering Royal Sanctuary without permission though, but at least minimum of 5 years in Prison is far more reasonable than death penalty.

 

[teg]

Anyway, the recent Auroch Population "census" has been done and their numbers turned out to be at 650000, confirming the suspicion of why the Royal Sanctuary grass didn't recover properly in recent times, and making some environmentalists concerned about potential damage the Royal Herd will done further to the Royal Snctuary (their ideal numbers, according to study is around 300000-400000).

There are proposals ranging from just rounding up the excess population and slaughter them en-masse for gigantic Christmas Feast in Poland, to moving the living surplus population to other sanctuaries who also tried to have sustainable Auroch population (but none are as successful as Polish ones).

King Wladislav has jokingly said that maybe everyone got special Christmas meal this year, so it seems that the mass culling for meat option is seriously considered, much to the dismay of Hindu states (who actually willing to pay for transport of living aurochs). Which one do you actually prefers in your opinion though?

I think there is also talk of reintroducing them into Britain. I went to the Wild Place*, which part of Bristol Zoo, and they've just opened their Ancient British Woodland exhibit which includes aurochs and they spend quite a bit of time talking about the benefits of 'rewilding'.


OOC: *The Wild Place is a real zoo near Bristol and is well worth a visit incidentally.

 

[Peg Leg Pom]

Anyway, the recent Auroch Population "census" has been done and their numbers turned out to be at 650000, confirming the suspicion of why the Royal Sanctuary grass didn't recover properly in recent times, and making some environmentalists concerned about potential damage the Royal Herd will done further to the Royal Snctuary (their ideal numbers, according to study is around 300000-400000).

There are proposals ranging from just rounding up the excess population and slaughter them en-masse for gigantic Christmas Feast in Poland, to moving the living surplus population to other sanctuaries who also tried to have sustainable Auroch population (but none are as successful as Polish ones).

King Wladislav has jokingly said that maybe everyone got special Christmas meal this year, so it seems that the mass culling for meat option is seriously considered, much to the dismay of Hindu states (who actually willing to pay for transport of living aurochs). Which one do you actually prefers in your opinion though?

There is that proposal to move some of them to the Chernobyl Reservation now the radiation levels are reaching safe levels. I've also heard that some US, Canadian and Argentine ranchers want to try farming them.

 

[KaiserWilhelm]

There is that proposal to move some of them to the Chernobyl Reservation now the radiation levels are reaching safe levels. I've also heard that some US, Canadian and Argentine ranchers want to try farming them.

What would be the difference between farming aurochs and farming cattle?

 

[GeographyDude]

To be fair, it was also cited as the earliest known laws who comprehensively dealt with Environmental protection and Natural Sanctuary. . .

And I will accept it in that spirit.

Another early experiment was Transylvania passing, and keeping, laws in favor of religious freedom. And then following this up in the late 1700s with laws in which they granted recallable corporate charters to build and maintain water systems. And with both announced and unannounced inspections, they ended up really meaning the recallable portion. Arguably, these were the first modern public health laws, at least those which were effective.

 

[Dolan]

And then following this up in the late 1700s with laws in which they granted recallable corporate charters to build and maintain water systems. And with both announced and unannounced inspections, they ended up really meaning the recallable portion. Arguably, these were the first modern public health laws, at least those which were effective.

Yeah, those laws are reasons why Central and Eastern Europe are one of the most verdant, environmentally preserved Kingdoms on Earth, despite still having very considerable industrial and mining activities going on.

Apparently, threatening every workers involved in any pollution case revealed by Royal inspection with burning at the stake (with nobility being permitted to pay still very hefty fine instead) was a very effective method to alleviate the worst of Industrial Revolution. Even if now, we know the irony that burning people at the stake will only pollute the air, lol.

Without those laws, I fear there might be ecological collapse, just like what happened in the old British Islands.

 

[jackson3]

Yeah, those laws are reasons why Central and Eastern Europe are one of the most verdant, environmentally preserved Kingdoms on Earth, despite still having very considerable industrial and mining activities going on.

Apparently, threatening every workers involved in any pollution case revealed by Royal inspection with burning at the stake (with nobility being permitted to pay still very hefty fine instead) was a very effective method to alleviate the worst of Industrial Revolution. Even if now, we know the irony that burning people at the stake will only pollute the air, lol.

Without those laws, I fear there might be ecological collapse, just like what happened in the old British Islands.

Ah the collapse wasn’t that bad, when Royals realised just what was happening they immediately set about developing projects to mitigate the worst of the issues. Heck the importation of wildlife from the various preserves on the continent has sent us into a period of unmitigated growth for our nation. The Royal London preserve harbours some of the densest ecologies in the Western Hemisphere. I will admit they went a little far in their panic though, I don’t think porting in wolves and other predators was such a good idea.