OOC (out of character for those who are new): DB means 'double-blind' where we ask a question which actually occurred in our timeline (OTL) from the perspective of someone in another TL where this happened differently. Anyway, gunpowder was thought to have been accidentally developed by the Chinese while in the pursuit of the elixir of life. Obviously, the ramifications of not having gunpowder are huge, with colonialism and even the fall of the City of The World's Desire being all dependent on a few Chinese alchemists in the 9th century. Although nowadays, traditional gunpowder is not widely used having being replaced by smokeless gunpowder soon after the Industrial Revolution.

IC (in character):

I've wondered with the recent development of projectile-based weapons well after the Industrial Revolution if there was any way that such devastating weapons could be put into the hands of our bloodthirsty, near-genocidal ancestors?

A scientific study has claimed to have synthesised a compound that could have been made centuries ago, a mixture of sulfur, charcoal and potassium nitrate (gunpowder) but many critics have asked, "Who in God's name would think to put these together during the most volatile period of human history?"

The interior of Africa is still a dark and hostile place, largely forgotten by the developed world, who have long renounced their expansive growing pains. Was this inevitable? After the loss of thousands in pointless expeditions of the Dark Continent, the Baghdad Conference (with all the major European & Middle Eastern powers as well as China) decided that conquering Africa was not in the interests of the civilisation since it was simply too costly in terms of money and lives as well as public opinion of course. Of course, native African civilisations are industrialising and are being major powers in their own right, such as the Sokoto Caliphate and the Zulu Empire - maybe because the Europeans, Arabs & Chinese decided to cut their losses and trade with the 'civilised savages' and let them keep their land. Now that I think of it, they only really have a presence on and near the coasts of South America and Africa, perhaps except for the more temperate zones.

Of course, city walls have been known to be near impenetrable and have saved countless cities from marauding armies and millions from slaughter. A popular Chinese proverb that "Walls are only built once" looks like it might be under threat, despite the standing and expansion of the Great Wall of China to make China impenetrable by all except God. I wonder just how much the world would be different if those scientists were correct, what if gunpowder compound was discovered centuries ago?
 
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How powerful is this nitrate? If it can shoot through plate armour then it would change warfare so much it wouldn't be recognizable.
 
How powerful is this nitrate? If it can shoot through plate armour then it would change warfare so much it wouldn't be recognizable.

Research indicates that it can piece through even the most advanced iron armour available, and has the potential to kill a human from a couple of hundred metres... I fear to even think about how our ancestors would have abused such power. The largest projectiles have been already used to tear down parts of the Great Wall of China by rebels chafing under the rule of the Emperor. The royal court is in absolute shock, the country is in turmoil over the news and Abrahamic religions see it as a sign of the end times. China truly has lost the Mandate of Heaven.
 
Imagine, the Nations of Hesperidia[OTL Americas] might all get conquered by gunpowder wielding Europeans instead of surviving to the present day. I shudder at the thought of Qusqu being a mere ruin, or millions being enslaved, slaughtered,conquered, and exploited by a handful of gunpowder-wielding gold-hungry adventurers. The Tawantinsuyu have not been doing well, especially with the pretender Tupac Amaru claiming the title of Sapa Inka, as well as facing disastrous flu epidemics, but what could transpire would be far, far worse than the current crisis.
 
what could transpire would be far, far worse than the current crisis.

Surely such collapse of a grand empire would be impossible, even by the gun-wielding, near-genocidal Europeans. The city of Qusqu stands as a city higher than all others, and the splendour of Tenochtitlan rivals the City of the World's Desire, Constantinople. It would have been completely impractical to conquer an empire thousands of miles across an ocean. No human could be willing to make so many suffer for their own benefit... surely.

Slavery was a short-lived, distasteful concept, being outlawed for its complete lack of profitability and slaves by the mid-1600s. It might be a far stretch, but some theorise that with such weapons, Africa could have been depopulated to fuel this abhorrent trade, lasting centuries and enslaving millions. Historians on the very extreme fringe even believe that Europeans would have been able to carve up Africa amongst themselves after this depopulation, but the logistics and the tropical diseases would have made that just too costly.
 
Surely such collapse of a grand empire would be impossible, even by the gun-wielding, near-genocidal Europeans. The city of Qusqu stands as a city higher than all others, and the splendour of Tenochtitlan rivals the City of the World's Desire, Constantinople. It would have been completely impractical to conquer an empire thousands of miles across an ocean. No human could be willing to make so many suffer for their own benefit... surely.

Slavery was a short-lived, distasteful concept, being outlawed for its complete lack of profitability and slaves by the mid-1600s. It might be a far stretch, but some theorise that with such weapons, Africa could have been depopulated to fuel this abhorrent trade, lasting centuries and enslaving millions. Historians on the very extreme fringe even believe that Europeans would have been able to carve up Africa amongst themselves after this depopulation, but the logistics and the tropical diseases would have made that just too costly.

The Tawantinsuyu began to recover from the disastrous smallpox epidemics only in the mid-1600s, and their population didn't recover until the late 1700s, under the competent leadership of Sayri Tupac IV. Before that, Qusqu’s population had been severely diminished by recurrent smallpox epidemics during the 1500s and early 1600s, and the empire had been severely weakened. Similar things also happened to Tenochtitlan, leading to a general retrenchment of Triple Alliance power for some time. Also, if the Spanish can establish a heavier presence in Quisqueya[OTL Hispaniola] and Cuba, then they can launch expeditions from there and not directly from Europe, allowing for a much easier potential conquest. Not to forget that potential conquerors might even play off the native states against one another. Of course, conquest would still be very, very difficult, but not totally ASB.
 
Why are people assuming that if gunpowder gets discovered by Europeans, the Tawantinsuyo or Cemanahuac (IOTL Mexico) wouldn't get their hands on it very soon after contact? These two nations have proved time and again to be very adaptable, there's a reason they remain superpowers in the current cold war.
 
Whatever expeditions are sent will likely have relatively little gunpowder, and it would be much harder to produce and adopt effectively. It will take some time to sort out the exact process of production and even more time to establish production facilities that can supply the substances needed for gunpowder, and yet even more time to properly incorporate it into their armies. And they have to do all this while facing deadly smallpox outbreaks, resurgent native opponents, and internal conflict. Also, if the Excan Tlatoloyan[OTL Aztecs] and the Tawantinsuyu get their hands on gunpowder, their native enemies will surely also get their hands on it as well. Yes these two powers have been adaptable, most famously when the Tawantinsuyu dug trapping pits covered with grass during the Battle of Tumbez to stop the Spanish cavalry charge, but even they have their limits.
 
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