DBWI: No Super China

We all know that the Brits helped China westernize in 1865 hoping to bring them into their sphere of influence, that backfired and now China dominates Asia and the Pacific. Could this be avoided?
 
Maybe it can be delayed, but it seems inevitable that China will eventually become a major world power. However, you could push it back to the late 20th century if you keep the Qing Dynasty in power. Maybe if the Yong hadn't taken power in 1882, Japan and Britain might still have colonies in Asia. In fact, it's possible that the Sino-American alliance wouldn't have been signed at all, which would have major impacts on the Great War (if this ATL 1920s even has a war at all).

OOC: I'm assuming that the UK tried to help the Qing Dynasty, but unintentionally sparked a massive anti-Manchu uprising that led to the establishment of a new dynasty. Also, "westernize" and "sphere of influence"? Somebody's been playing Victoria II.
 
Maybe it can be delayed, but it seems inevitable that China will eventually become a major world power. However, you could push it back to the late 20th century if you keep the Qing Dynasty in power. Maybe if the Yong hadn't taken power in 1882, Japan and Britain might still have colonies in Asia. In fact, it's possible that the Sino-American alliance wouldn't have been signed at all, which would have major impacts on the Great War (if this ATL 1920s even has a war at all).

OOC: I'm assuming that the UK tried to help the Qing Dynasty, but unintentionally sparked a massive anti-Manchu uprising that led to the establishment of a new dynasty. Also, "westernize" and "sphere of influence"? Somebody's been playing Victoria II.

OOC:Yes, they tried but the Boxer Rebellion broke out in the 1930's and sparked the Great War between Quig China, UK, and France vs Germany, Russia, Austria-Hungar Federation.
I have clocked 200 hours of Vicky 2
 
China is an incredibly populous country and it has existed in some form for thousands of years. I think it's kind of inevitable that it would become a major world power.
 
Worst case scenario (for China) would either be several completing countries all claiming to be the true succesor to China (sorta like the tail end of western roman empire collapse), or 'merely' be delaying China's Ascent for some 50-100 years.
 
You're going to need a china screw until some other nation can effectively claim power over the region. Maybe having the Taipeng rebellion fail but cause massive destruction, or maybe with the introduction of ideas like Technocracy and anarchism be more radical.
Candidates for establishing power in the vacuum are really limited to 3, The USA, Mexico, Gran Columbia, or if you delay it enough India.
 
You're going to need a china screw until some other nation can effectively claim power over the region. Maybe having the Taipeng rebellion fail but cause massive destruction, or maybe with the introduction of ideas like Technocracy and anarchism be more radical.
Candidates for establishing power in the vacuum are really limited to 3, The USA, Mexico, Gran Columbia, or if you delay it enough India.

Mexico is pretty much impossible, since they lost Texas and Mexico to the US back in 1848. The US is more or less guaranteed to be a major power after it survived the Cold War.

If the Taiping Rebellion goes on longer, it might butterfly away the reunification of Gran Colombia too.
 
Given that at this point in time Japan seemed to be on the bring of a major civil war, couldn't we have someone strong and smart in charge instead of the faltering Tokugawa Shogunate?
 
Given that at this point in time Japan seemed to be on the bring of a major civil war, couldn't we have someone strong and smart in charge instead of the faltering Tokugawa Shogunate?

Possibly. Even with better leadership, I can't see Japan ever posing a serious threat to a nation as large as China. Remember, the Japanese "Empire" only consisted of one island, Taiwan, which Japan wouldn't have even gotten in the first place if Britain hadn't sold it.
 
Possibly. Even with better leadership, I can't see Japan ever posing a serious threat to a nation as large as China. Remember, the Japanese "Empire" only consisted of one island, Taiwan, which Japan wouldn't have even gotten in the first place if Britain hadn't sold it.

I agree fully. The ineptitude against the Kingdom of Korea is a prime example of why the Japanese navy would always be second class. It stranded its own armies in Korea because it couldn't maintain supply routes to Korea.
 
Or a more aggressive Russia. If the Russian Empire had remained autocratic and expansionist, conflict with China would be almost inevitable.
I doubt they could have won. Russian transportation systems were notoriously poor until Tsar Mikhail II instituted new infrastructure laws.
 
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