DBWI: Hamilton Duels Burr

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Amadeus, Sep 10, 2019 at 7:26 AM.

  1. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    In 1804, Vice-President Aaron Burr challenged Alexander Hamilton to a duel. Burr was furious over Hamilton's support of a rival Republican over him for Governor of New York, in addition to Hamilton's personal attacks on Burr's character. Hamilton considered accepting Burr's offer, but reluctantly declined.

    What if Hamilton had agreed to duel Aaron Burr? Who would've won? How might this have impacted American history?
     
  2. Dolan Lookin fer Gooby

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    There might be no Burr Presidency if he ends up heavily injuring, or killing Hamilton, and dead or crippled Burr will never be the President either.

    But it could've been nothing different if Both decide to just satisfy honor and shoot to miss
     
  3. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    If Hamilton had died, he wouldn't have been the Federalist candidate for President in 1808. With both Burr and Hamilton out of the running that year, who might've succeeded Jefferson in 1809?
     
  4. KingOnTheEdge Vive La Revolucion

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    Didn't Jefferson consider running? That could have repercussions- no way in hell he'd buy Louisiana. Too much of a federal and executive power grab in his eyes, denounced Burr for it OTL. Maybe he just takes New Orleans per the OG plan?
     
  5. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    OOC: Dude, the Louisiana Purchase happened in 1803, five years before the 1808 election - and a year before Hamilton's death!
     
  6. KingOnTheEdge Vive La Revolucion

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    OOC: sorry, my bad. ignore that
     
  7. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    Well if Burr hadn't become President, Madison might've been elected instead. I very much doubt that the War of 1812 would've occurred under a statesman like Madison.
     
  8. Dolan Lookin fer Gooby

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    Without the War of 1812, there will be no Liberation of North America, which see the remnants of British North American holdings (and Quebec) being incorporated into the United States of America.

    This is the reason why Aaron Burr's face was sculpted into Mount Rushmore just behind Washington. His politics might be controversial at times, but he sure does know how to lead the Military to victory, so much that he was later nicknamed "Burr the Liberator" at the end of his tenure.
     
  9. KingOnTheEdge Vive La Revolucion

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    Similarly, the Federal power got a massive upscale, same with the house of Reps. This could mean the civil war is later on. OTL, the nationalism spurred success of the canadian war and the south's grumbling for a balanced senate led to a war with mexico within the decade. This however, led to tensions as many in the north felt that the south's whining was unfair, as they'd had a better reason for the canadian war. Tensions rose with abolitionism and war broke out by the 1850s. Thankfully though, Virginia barely stayed loyal and the better armed and more numerous Union soldiers were led to success after success by general and future president Robert E Lee. Abolition became law in the early 1860s
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019 at 1:10 AM
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  10. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    But not under Lee, who was a slave owner. It was under his successor, William Seward, that abolition came to pass.
     
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  11. KingOnTheEdge Vive La Revolucion

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    OOC: wasn't lee an abolitionist otl, just loyal to virginia first?
     
  12. Dolan Lookin fer Gooby

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    Amusingly, the abolition, while putting in federal law by Seward, it was Lee, who outright manumission and insistence that of all his substantial, inherited family slaves should be citizens of Virginia and thus the United States earned him the moniker as "The Philemon" from Reverend John Brown, after the Biblical slaveowner.

    Nowadays, it was sadly said that what Lee has done is NOT ENOUGH, but it was Arguably what was the most progressive thing that day. Sure, Lee (and Seaward), worked that newly manumission ADULT MALE Slaves and existing Freemen would be granted State and US Citizenship, leaving unmarried Black Women in limbo as while they aren't slaves anymore, they aren't citizen either, causing the interesting case of some "enterprising" Black Men taking multiple wives just because the women are desperate enough for any sort of protection.

    Now, there are jokes about being African-American and being a Polygamists all around, but that time, it was seen as necessity.
     
  13. KingOnTheEdge Vive La Revolucion

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    Eh, i'd say that was Seward's policy of dismantling every slave estate and giving every resident but the original owner and his wife (so any sons or daughters as well as the freedmen) some acreage. Granted none of the land of the women stayed with them due to how marriage worked, but it certainly helped with some of the more egregious legal abuses women suffered. And the freemen by themselves made both Virginia and Texas swing states, which got President Booker Washington his office in 1900, and his policies of strong worker's rights and tax incentives to buisnesses who went above and beyond Federal and State legislatures; in turn paving the way for Sinclair's more outright socialistic policies in the 10s.

    Whole lot of butterflies right there.

    Similarly i don't think america would partake in the scramble for africa if not for some more imperially minded african-american intellectuals wanting to 'share the bounty of an empire of liberty' due to growing up in a period where african american political-power was at a then historical peak, and continued to expand.
     
  14. JuliantheUnknown Unknown Member

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    I doubt Burr wins this duel. As Burr would himself confess, his fellow soldiers would tell you he's a terrible shot whereas Hamilton was often said to be a man on a mission, a soldier with a marksman's ability.

    On an unrelated note, would this have affected Lin-Manuel Miranda's tony-winning musical Madison? Probably not - if Miranda is even born in this timeline.
     
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  15. frustrated progressive Insert Witticism Here

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    Nope, that’s complete revisionism.
    He wasn’t ideologically supportive of slavery, but he was happy enough to own slaves and treat them rather badly even by contemporary standards.
     
  16. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    OOC: Thanks for shining a light of truth onto this subject. No abolitionist would violate his oath to the U.S. Constitution to lead a war with the expressed purpose of preserving slavery.
     
  17. Chrispi Byzantine Logothete

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    It was the Federalists’ absolutely idiotic nomination of Alexander Hamilton, famous son of Saint Kitts and Nevis, that killed their party. The Natural-born-citizen Clause was written with Hamilton precisely in mind!
     
  18. Dolan Lookin fer Gooby

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    Also, if either of them ended up killed, there will be no reconciliation between them.

    Burr actually appoint Hamilton to govern the newly conquered territory of Ontario, which centered on the Town who accidentally named "Hamilton" because Ottawa was completely burned to the ground. The fact that the Southern part of the Former Ontario was made into State of Hamilton is definite proof of their reconciliation.
     
  19. Amadeus Well-Known Member

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    Hamilton was legally eligible to be President because he was a citizen at the time the Constitution was ratified. In fact, he and all other Founding Fathers were born as British subjects - Hamilton was different only in that he was born outside of what today is the US. But that said his birthplace and illegitimacy were attacked by the Republicans, and no doubt helped cause his defeat.
     
  20. Dolan Lookin fer Gooby

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    It's too bad that Britain pulled dishonorable, undeclared assault to destroy all American Navy Ships at Miami and New York during the opening phase of The First Great War.

    If USA avoids being crippled in the Naval Department early on, Cuba and the Caribbean Islands would be liberated as American States instead of continuing under British Jackboots.