DBWI: German Reunification Talks successful?

IC: As A dutchy I can't say it really matters to me if the Germanies are once again becoming one. And as to the 'fear' about population transfers, while the Germans may be 'colonizing' their former territories again, allongside a small but recurring nationalism in the Germanies and Austria, well, the Dutch and Flemish are working hard to make Brussels 'Dutch/Flemish' again as well as Nord Pas du Calais, and it's working Lille once again has got a Dutch language plurality.

Even the Italians and Swedes are 'colonizing' 'former territories' again... That's just a part of the open border policies. That the French, Polish and Russians in Kalingrad have got a negative population growth does not mean other people shouldn't move there.

The primary reason for the Dutch to move south and east is because the Dutch taxes are very high and Belgium, France and Germany have lower taxes. Even british 'colonies' can be found in France, Germany and Spain...

This 'colonization problem' is not German, it is a general problem of the European community as a whole. So it is not a good argument for preventing Reunification of the Germanies.
 
Comments ITT are dumb, if the Germans wanted to conquer the world they (the West) would have started already; they already have Europes largest economy pretty much (might be close second, I don't remember, but losing Scotland greatly crippled the UKs) and de-facto lead the EU.

In fact, the FRG hardly needs the DRG to be a great power.
 
Every year or so, this question gets drug up again. And my answer is still the same: There is no way German reunification in the context of the 1990's could have lasted. After 50 years of living under radically different econonies and political systems, there is no way East and West Germans could have formed a stable country under one system. The best that could have been hoped for is some sort of lose association of the two Germanies - perhaps sharing a common foreign policy and representation in international organizations - but retaining distinct economies and perhaps even political systems. Also, in any conveivable federal union, East Germany would be the weaker and poorer party. I don't see how West Germans would abide simply expanding the federal republic to incorporate the poor economic basket cases represented by the eastern states. Then there is the whole question of how the WW2 victors would react to a unilateral reunification of Germany. The only thing that has kept Europe stable over the past 50 years is the fact that Germany was been divided and each part has been part of a competing alliance structure and economic union. Would a united Germany (presumably one dominated by the former west Germany and going through massive changes as east and west are merged) even want to remain in NATO or the EU? Under any probable unification scenario, Europe would be economically dominated by an unstable Germany, whose eventual form and policies can't be predicted. The FGR already dominated the EU - and a united Germany would have even more power and influence. No. It is much better that there are now two fully independent Germanies, both democratic and stable. One closely aligned with the EU and NATO and the other a model for demcratization and economic growth in the old Warsaw Pact.
 
What all these people crying about German Nationalism don't seem to realise, is that keeping our country divided, is the only Reason German nationalism is rising. Mitterands infamous "the partition is punishment for Auschwitz" speech, the almost collapse of the DDR, the mass Exodus to West Germany and Poland. The reflex like sabotage of West german help by the UK and France. Is a NPD with 20% votes in the East really that surprising?

If the reunification talks would have been successfull most of that could have been avoided.
 
What would a united Germany even be like? Of the two nation's which political party system would dominate? Obviously not the East German communist party, but could any of the Eastern political parties have been competitive in a united Germany?
 
What all these people crying about German Nationalism don't seem to realise, is that keeping our country divided, is the only Reason German nationalism is rising. Mitterands infamous "the partition is punishment for Auschwitz" speech, the almost collapse of the DDR, the mass Exodus to West Germany and Poland. The reflex like sabotage of West german help by the UK and France. Is a NPD with 20% votes in the East really that surprising?

If the reunification talks would have been successfull most of that could have been avoided.

Hell combine that with the mass exodus of east Germans to the Netherlands, and now the Netherlands wants to unify with the other Germans. I say this as a native dutch man that I wouldn't be opposed to re-embracing our Germanic ancestor provided or language isn't forcibly changed to German. I hear its much of the same in Austria as well.
 
All things considered, East Germany has managed to do surprisingly well for itself. In 1991, its per capita income was 33% of the Bundesrepublik - currently, it's something like 70%. Here's how the two compare economically:

Population: 67,228,352 (W. Germany), 14,571,248 (E. Germany)
GDP Per Capita (PPP): $39,059 (17th ,W. Germany), $27,341 (33rd, E. Germany)
GDP (PPP): $2.6 Trillion (5th ,W. Germany), $383 Billion (34th, E. Germany)

Really, the whole 'would Germany be better off if it was reunified?' question is moot. Both are members of NATO and the Eurozone (including the Schengen Area), so they're pretty much reunified as is. After stumbling out of the gate, East Germany has managed to grow and modernize in an unprecedented manner, unmatched by any of its other Eastern Bloc peers.

Half Empty of Half Full? East Germany two decades later.
Property investors look to East Germany
Why East Germany is slow to change. (The title of the article is a bit of a misnomer, it mostly discusses the demographic differences between the two states)

OOC: I operated under the assumption that East Germany developed much as it did when it was reintegrated into Germany, and these articles give good details on why (former) East Germany is in the situation its in today.
 
Neoliberal Business magazines aren't really neutral sources.



OOC: East Germany this timeline only has 6 million inhabitants and suffered a famine in 1998
 
Neoliberal Business magazines aren't really neutral sources.



OOC: East Germany this timeline only has 6 million inhabitants and suffered a famine in 1998

OOC: Wait, what?! :eek: *reads* How'd I miss that? Ugh, that's what I get for posting something at four o' clock in the morning...
 
OOC: This is nonsense. There is no way East Germany could survive as a separate state after losing 70% of her population. No nation could.

OOC: Yep, but this would have realistic happend if the reunification would not have happened.

I mean the wall was there for a reason, you know :rolleyes:
 
Top