DBWI/DBAHC: Make this map real

Deleted member 97083

How could a "Empire of the French" like this arise?

Europe_in_1812.PNG
 
How could a "Empire of the French" like this arise?

Europe_in_1812.PNG

Is the Empire of French borders the only requirement, or do all the states have to be depicted in the way they are on the map? Because honestly; The Ionian Isles in the hands of Great Britain? What on earth are they doing there?

Also, is the Napoleon in question Napolyon Pasha, the Corsican-gone-military adviser as part of the Franco-Ottoman alliance as an artillery drillmaster? Because that's the only Napoleon I can even think of.
 
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A King of France decides to give himself an imperial title because .... reasons
And then also adopts popular sovereignty because reasons...

Sorry, I really can't make this work.
 

Deleted member 97083

A King of France decides to give himself an imperial title because .... reasons
And then also adopts popular sovereignty because reasons...

Sorry, I really can't make this work.
Maybe he was elected HRE?
 
How could a "Empire of the French" like this arise?

Europe_in_1812.PNG

Hmm.....well, this map is from Jackson Mitchell's classic "Timeline 21" Alternate History series(honestly a favorite work of mine, but not the most plausible TL, either), but it's unclear if it was ever satisfactorily explained how this came to ITTL.

For one, why would France take over portions of Italy anyway? The French Republic and most of the Italian states(save Sardinia) had good relations pretty early on, in this particular era IOTL.
 

Deleted member 97083

Hmm.....well, this map is from Jackson Mitchell's classic "Timeline 21" Alternate History series(honestly a favorite work of mine, but not the most plausible TL, either), but it's unclear if it was ever satisfactorily explained how this came to ITTL.

For one, why would France take over portions of Italy anyway? The French Republic and most of the Italian states(save Sardinia) had good relations pretty early on, in this particular era IOTL.
I haven't read Timeline 21 so I'm not sure of the background to this scenario.

By the French Republic, are you referring to the French Principate or the French Dominate?
 
Maybe he was elected HRE?
That still doesn't explain why it's called the Empire of the French rather than the Empire of France.
Here's a possible explanation, the French Dominate gets into a war with the HRE and to emphasize the superiority of their system, the Consuls declare that their country is an Empire of the people rather than the Empire of one man.
 

Deleted member 97083

Empire of the French? What on earth do you mean by that? That must be a gramatical error.
Before 1938, Frankreich used to be called France, and the Franks were called Frenchmen.

You haven't heard of the French Deluge?
 
I haven't read Timeline 21 so I'm not sure of the background to this scenario.

By the French Republic, are you referring to the French Principate or the French Dominate?

I'm talking about the original Bonapartist Republic. Yes, it's true that it only lasted from 1797 to 1880(I'm surprised anyone else remembers the Principate, as it was very short lived, as this Tikipedia article shows), before the Dominationist government took over for almost two decades(a real shame, that.).

Also, what is this reference to "Frankreich" for? Sure, that was the old German name for the country, but it was considered highly offensive by most Frenchmen for a long while post-Great War, and still is considered rude by some older folks today. Just FYI.
 

Deleted member 97083

Also, what is this reference to "Frankreich" for? Sure, that was the old German name for the country, but it was considered highly offensive by most Frenchmen for a long while post-Great War, and still is considered rude by some older folks today. Just FYI.
Yeah, that’s pretty shitty. It’s like if you called Korea Mainland Japan, or Yucatán Mexican.
Sorry guys, I had no idea that "Frankreich" had that connotation. I won't say it again.

Alright, but stil, an empire of the people. Preposterous. I mean we don't speak of the Empire of the Romans.
Oh, I thought you weren't familiar with the word French since you live behind the Iron Curtain (Vijfherenlanden, Netherlands).
 
That still doesn't explain why it's called the Empire of the French rather than the Empire of France.
Here's a possible explanation, the French Dominate gets into a war with the HRE and to emphasize the superiority of their system, the Consuls declare that their country is an Empire of the people rather than the Empire of one man.

Off the top of my head, what if the Emperor takes on "The French" as one of his titles, embodying some kind of "National-Papism" or other such thing? I could see this in a kind Gaulist Catholicism theocracy, with the French Emperor placing his title as leader of the French church over his secular title as King of France (as a country) on the grounds of the supremacy of his religion. That could even explain the extended borders, as the French church converts some other territories which come under the High Priest (Whatever his title would be)-King's perveiw.

For comparison, The Caliphate of Osmangula is, strictly speaking, the direct translation of the name of the country the English speaking world often calls the Ottoman Empire, due to the Caliph's duel religious-secular nature.
 
No prob. Germany’s cyber warfare is the shit. I used to think that the Brazilians were the root of all evil and that that wingnut in Nejd was the good guy.

But as for the map, Napoleon is pretty crafty and had a serious mental issue, so I could see him being Emperor. But... why is Italy French. The best I could see is if he went full Schiclegruber on Europe and we as setting up puppet states in Europe for world domination, but 1812 is too early. Maybe in his old age, or a hypothetical Napoleon Junior, but not Pasha.
 

Deleted member 97083

The best I could see is if he went full Schiclegruber on Europe and we as setting up puppet states in Europe for world domination, but 1812 is too early. Maybe in his old age, or a hypothetical Napoleon Junior, but not Pasha.
Tikipedia says that Roman von Schiclegruber mainly relied on the anarchy of Russia and China to set up his Mongolia and Xinjiang puppet states. Would that really be possible in Europe, where there was no warlord era?
 
Sorry guys, I had no idea that "Frankreich" had that connotation. I won't say it again.

No problem, really, as it's not as offensive these days as it was in the 1950s.

No prob. Germany’s cyber warfare is the shit. I used to think that the Brazilians were the root of all evil and that that wingnut in Nejd was the good guy.

Sorry to hear that. As it turns out, though, the Brazilian Caudilho Soares, while a bit insane, wasn't actually quite the awful supervillain that many in the other South American countries in particular thought he was; certainly not all that close to Jurgens in Germany, who actually did deliberately approve of the Holy German Empire's commissioning of awful war crimes in France, Switzerland, and elsewhere, like in Ruthenia for instance(assisted by the Byelorusian nationalists and the Ukrainian Tsarists in that case).....whereas Soares tried to keep a lighter hand in Uruguay, the Guianas and eastern Bolivia, and was overruled by more radical reactionary elements in his government.

(And yes, seconded about Germany's excellent cyber ops, too. We Americans have learned a fair bit from the Germany Federal Republic in recent years. Good thing, too, considering that the Second Ottoman Empire is ramping up their aggression, having recently tried to take out that nuclear plant near Seattle in Feb. this year)

Tikipedia says that Roman von Schiclegruber mainly relied on the anarchy of Russia and China to set up his Mongolia and Xinjiang puppet states. Would that really be possible in Europe, where there was no warlord era?

Von Schiklegruber? That nutjob?
 
(And yes, seconded about Germany's excellent cyber ops, too. We Americans have learned a fair bit from the Germany Federal Republic in recent years. Good thing, too, considering that the Second Ottoman Empire is ramping up their aggression, having recently tried to take out that nuclear plant near Seattle in Feb. this year)

I'm sorry, but I have to defend my country here; its not our fault that a couple of Bedouin Wahabbist heretics got crazy in recent years. Caliph Mehmed IX came out less than 24 hours after the attack to officially condemn it. We've certainly had a... rocky history with your morally Crusading government, but this isen't the 40's anymore.
 
I'm sorry, but I have to defend my country here; its not our fault that a couple of Bedouin Wahabbist heretics got crazy in recent years. Caliph Mehmed IX came out less than 24 hours after the attack to officially condemn it. We've certainly had a... rocky history with your morally Crusading government, but this isen't the 40's anymore.

Mehmed IX isn't so bad, really. It's the Prime Minister, Ahmet Boztepe, that's been causing the trouble, and there is some real reason to worry as of late(mainly thanks to all the protests from), that he may not only throw the country under martial law, but possibly have Mehmed IX tossed out in favor of his insane younger brother Abdulhamid, not to mention that his rhetoric is becoming increasingly Jurgensian(which is concerning for the safety of ethnic Greeks and Alevis in particular). Hopefully, Greece and Romania are keeping a close eye on this whole mess.....

Speaking of which, by the way, how would an Imperial France deal with Greek independence, if it becomes a thing ITTL?(Remember, the French Republic was majorly in favor of the Greek nationalists IOTL.)

OOC: Okay, Boztepe is basically a Turkish Putin of a sort, with a heap of Erdogan and a bit of Kim Jong-Un mixed in.
 
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