DBWI: Could We Have Won In Iraq?

schnitzel

Banned
Is it possible that we could have prevented the breakup of Iraq after we invaded it in 2003? Of course when President Kerry withdrew the troops in 2006, civil war was pretty much inevitable. But at the same time how could a 150,000 or so troops keep order when the US couldn't in Vietnam with half a million. Still we had said "Never again!" but once again like the Bosnians and the Tutsi the Sunnis were slaughtered by the tens of thousands and the rest expelled. :(
 
Your best bet is to not throw out the entire Iraqi´s army, just with that you eliminate 80% of the insurgency and could keep the country without an horrible civil war ...
 
Is it possible that we could have prevented the breakup of Iraq after we invaded it in 2003? Of course when President Kerry withdrew the troops in 2006, civil war was pretty much inevitable. But at the same time how could a 150,000 or so troops keep order when the US couldn't in Vietnam with half a million. Still we had said "Never again!" but once again like the Bosnians and the Tutsi the Sunnis were slaughtered by the tens of thousands and the rest expelled. :(


The answer is simple - yes! Had Kerry not been so quick reverse course or so resolute in his determination to be "not like Bush", then yes, I believe that we could have. Given the foreign policy disasters of the Kerry Administration (North Korea, Pakistan, Afgahnistan & Colombia) and his diplomatic faux pas following the earthquake & tsunami in Japan, and not to mention the economic meltdown in '08, it would have been better for the nation had Kerry not defeated Bush in '04. Thankfully Romney won in '08 and is working had to restore America's reputation abroad.
 
the whole nation was held together with gum and bailing wire as is one good push and it all came apart, sure I guess there were some times we could of done but I can't really see a way that they country wouldn't become ground zero for every Islamic terror movement or how it wouldn't become a huge proxy war for Iran and Saudi Arabia, and the Kurds would never stay in Iraq if they had the chance to leave and I can't see Turkey not reacting to Kurdistan the way they did their occupation is still ongoing and as bloody as ever even 5 years in, Iraqi non-Muslims have more or less been wiped out and the civil war still rages with the ugliest war crimes on both sides, Turkey is fighting a war that makes Viet Nam look like a day at the park, all in all the only way I see for this not to have happened is NO WAR AT ALL, and GOP neo-cons crying about human rights in Iraq is a joke :rolleyes:
 
Kerry threw the baby out with the bathwater when it came to Bush's policies. Bush's War on Terror policies were pretty committed to stamping out terrorism in Iraq and up until the big change in policy Kerry implemented were keeping the situation from boiling over.

With Muqtada Al-Sadr's Mahdi Army taking prominence in Shia Iraq the Sunnis really had nowhere to go but into the arms of Zarqawi's branch of Al-Queida. The first thing those monsters did was purge and intimidate the moderates of both sides. The Civil War / Proxy War was inevitable at that point.

Honestly, at this point the best thing that could happen for Iraq is for Riyadh and Tehran to use their shiny new nukes against each other... But I don't think anyone worldwide cares anymore as long as the oil keeps flowing, something that will happen since both sides need the dough same as Qadaffy, Mubarak and the rest are spending oil for guns fighting the 'Arab Revolution'
 
The answer is simple - yes! Had Kerry not been so quick reverse course or so resolute in his determination to be "not like Bush", then yes, I believe that we could have. Given the foreign policy disasters of the Kerry Administration (North Korea, Pakistan, Afgahnistan & Colombia) and his diplomatic faux pas following the earthquake & tsunami in Japan, and not to mention the economic meltdown in '08, it would have been better for the nation had Kerry not defeated Bush in '04. Thankfully Romney won in '08 and is working had to restore America's reputation abroad.

OOC: wut? dude, The earthquake and tsunami happened in 2011, in your timeline, that's under President Romney.
 

Zeus

Banned
Honestly, at this point the best thing that could happen for Iraq is for Riyadh and Tehran to use their shiny new nukes against each other... But I don't think anyone worldwide cares anymore as long as the oil keeps flowing, something that will happen since both sides need the dough same as Qadaffy, Mubarak and the rest are spending oil for guns fighting the 'Arab Revolution'

I seriously doubt Saudi Arabia and Iran would have been able to build nukes by this point in time.
 

Warsie

Banned
Let the kurds get their own nation. The world hasnt had a major shakedown and balkanization in a while; arab spring doesn't count :p
 
Honestly, I have one name for you: General Eric Shinseki.

Bush sacked him after he told congress (as the head of the Army at the time) that they'd need to commit 300K - 400K troops for occupation. The next day the civvies at the DoD said that he was incorrect, and he was forced to retire before his term was up.

President Kerry didn't treat him any better, though. After he asked Shinseki to come out of retirement to lead CENTCOM, he completely ignored his suggestion for a "Swell" of troops up to the levels he had originally suggested... and in fact, did the complete opposite.

You'd think that a former military guy who actually served in Vietnam would have listened to another guy who did... but that's politics for ya.
 
Nah, we probably just would have given a bunch of shipping containers full of 100 dollar bills to warlords to shut them up (temporarily, I'm sure it would ultimately work out as well as supporting the Taliban did), and then ethnic cleansing would have quieted things down a lot when whatever faction killed most of the rest. Although even then we might not have left until 2010. I can't imagine it being such a disaster that we'd still be there now. At least it might have kept us out of Libya.
 

Cook

Banned
Of course when President Kerry withdrew the troops in 2006, civil war was pretty much inevitable.

It was stupid of us to invade in the first place and there was never any chance of a result other than a complete bloodbath and permanent failed state. It’s inevitable with countries in that part of the world; all they have going for them is the oil and as soon as the strong man in power is knocked off their throne the place falls to pieces with every man and his dog fighting it out to see who is going to be next to rake in the money.

Kerry just saved American lives by pulling out, nothing more.
 
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