DBWI: Axis Japan, Allied USSR

Another thing worth noting about the post-war world is how Eastern Europe's railroad network was affected.

After the war, many nations, most notably Slovakia and Poland, had locomotive fleets consiting almost completely of machines sent to them by the occupying forces. The Germans sent many of the 'Kriegslok' 2-10-0s there. The Hungarians cloned their famous 4-8-0s for use in Slovakia especially. The USSR also sent many standard gauge versions of their locomotive designs to Poland like the FD Class 2-10-2s and IS Class 2-8-4s. Lastly, British and American war locomotives came in droves to Slovakia and Poland when the USSR finally fell.
 
What would the alternate version of the Osaka Conference be like, which was one about who gets control over what when the war ends?
 
Anyone else remember Package for Mr. Orwell. The 1987 film with John Hurt?

I was about the Indian-based Eric Blair, and how he would smuggle Muslim locals in danger of being murdered by the Nazis and Soviets out across the battlefield to Allied territory. Today, he's still called the "Schindler of the East", and considered one of the icons of anti-Soviet resistance in Central Asia.
 
By the way, one has to wonder if Germany would be split up they way the former USSR was after the war. If the USSR were Allied, I could see Germany being split into east and west. Unlike OTL where Russia was split into five occupational zones. One for the USA, France, China, UK, and Japan each.

Since we're still on the subject, one wonders if Korea would end up being split in a similar way to how Italy had been ever since the death of Mussolini in 1951 until 1981.'

For that matter, I can imagine that the attacks on New York on September 11, 1981 might have been done by someone other than the Sandinistas we had previously supported against the UK and Brazil.
 
For that matter, I can imagine that the attacks on New York on September 11, 1981 might have been done by someone other than the Sandinistas we had previously supported against the UK and Brazil.
It would be them or no one. Terrible as it is, and as much as the war on terror destroyed our powerbase in SA until 96, the attack was genius- turning a plane into a warhead.

But I think the biggest impact is that it was proof of concept for the Westminster Attacks in 2001 by the insurgent "Young Europa"
 
It would be them or no one. Terrible as it is, and as much as the war on terror destroyed our powerbase in SA until 96, the attack was genius- turning a plane into a warhead.

But I think the biggest impact is that it was proof of concept for the Westminster Attacks in 2001 by the insurgent "Young Europa"
I wouldn't be quick to blame just the War on Terror for losing as much of our powerbase there to the Monarchist bloc as we did. Mind you, virtually every country in South America played a role in eliminating the Sandinistas. Some even went above and beyond the end goal of eliminating Socialist extremism for better (the electoral defeat of Hugo Chavez in Venezuela), or for worse (the brutal crackdown and mass-assassination of Argentine Communists).

I think part of the greater issue is that France still hadn't forgiven us for considering sending support to the Viet Cong. It certainly would explained why they tried warming up to Britain and Japan later on. Not to mention how even beyond that, they usually turn to China if they need military assistance nowadays. As for the US itself, I do suppose that without it, we might not have gotten an Amtrak that became larger to enough to be first split up into several regions, then privatized much like what Japan did to its railways.
 
The Sun, Sickle, and Stars TL by WaterproofPotatoes actually led to an interesting question I felt ought to be bought up.

Would Ishii have any place in a fanatical, Axis-aligned IJA? IOTL, the bastard was quickly fired because the Emperor considered him one of the possible candidates for people bound to ruin the IJA's reputation during its rule of Manchuko.

But considering some of the ideas he raised, the idea of him sticking around makes me shiver.
 
Would Ishii have any place in a fanatical, Axis-aligned IJA? IOTL, the bastard was quickly fired because the Emperor considered him one of the possible candidates for people bound to ruin the IJA's reputation during its rule of Manchuko
Come on, it was basically a miscommunication about possible use of plague-weapon to end USSR in a single stroke... Yes it was horrifying and Dr. Shiro Ishii was fired from unit 731 because of his gaffe, but he still ended up working in civilian medical research and managed to redeem himself in the end by making important discoveries about bacterial antibiotic resistance and subsequent ways to minimize said risk, to the point that when he got 1957 Nobel Prize in Medicine, he said about how he finally redeemed himself from that horrifying lapse of judgement and thanked the Emperor for his guidance.

Unit 731 is still the Medical-Biological Research that discovered important breakthrough of antibiotic-resistency and while their plan of weaponization against USSR is definitely their lowest point, their research still ended up invaluable for medical breakthrough and safeguarding the rest of the world from potential pandemic.

Even if Japan ended up being "Evil", there are some lines they won't cross, and said biological weapon plan would be something that they will never cross, considering the potential to go wrong...
 
Come on, it was basically a miscommunication about possible use of plague-weapon to end USSR in a single stroke... Yes it was horrifying and Dr. Shiro Ishii was fired from unit 731 because of his gaffe, but he still ended up working in civilian medical research and managed to redeem himself in the end by making important discoveries about bacterial antibiotic resistance and subsequent ways to minimize said risk, to the point that when he got 1957 Nobel Prize in Medicine, he said about how he finally redeemed himself from that horrifying lapse of judgement and thanked the Emperor for his guidance.

Unit 731 is still the Medical-Biological Research that discovered important breakthrough of antibiotic-resistency and while their plan of weaponization against USSR is definitely their lowest point, their research still ended up invaluable for medical breakthrough and safeguarding the rest of the world from potential pandemic.

Even if Japan ended up being "Evil", there are some lines they won't cross, and said biological weapon plan would be something that they will never cross, considering the potential to go wrong...
I see your point. Though some of the ideas he had raised at certain times are still pretty disturbing. Even if they ultimately had nothing on what the USSR did to Japanese POWs; to say nothing of Dr. Mengele's atrocities.
 
I see your point. Though some of the ideas he had raised at certain times are still pretty disturbing. Even if they ultimately had nothing on what the USSR did to Japanese POWs; to say nothing of Dr. Mengele's atrocities.
That US ended up Nuclear-bombed USSR made the discussion of such use of Biological weapon to force USSR into surrender moot. But yeah, what USSR did to Japanese POWs caused extremely bad blood between Japanese and Russians in general, that only mended very recently.

I do wonder about the potential of the "White Cherry Blossom" if it was done in an alternate timeline where Japan is the one going full-on militaristic and "Evil", breeding Black Plague strain that is specifically tailored to be spread by human-to-human contact and immune to Antibiotics, before delivering them to densely-packed enemy urban areas halfway across the globe... It was said to be potential world-ending, and in some ways, even worse than Feynman's Cobalt Bomb proposal...
 
That US ended up Nuclear-bombed USSR made the discussion of such use of Biological weapon to force USSR into surrender moot. But yeah, what USSR did to Japanese POWs caused extremely bad blood between Japanese and Russians in general, that only mended very recently.

I do wonder about the potential of the "White Cherry Blossom" if it was done in an alternate timeline where Japan is the one going full-on militaristic and "Evil", breeding Black Plague strain that is specifically tailored to be spread by human-to-human contact and immune to Antibiotics, before delivering them to densely-packed enemy urban areas halfway across the globe... It was said to be potential world-ending, and in some ways, even worse than Feynman's Cobalt Bomb proposal...
As I understand it, it was developed mostly as a defensive means to incapacitate the leadership, and the IJA was interested in getting a cure and vaccine for it developed before the plug was pulled, so I doubt a weaponization would be fly even in an axis japan, simply because the developers wouldnt allow it
 
As I understand it, it was developed mostly as a defensive means to incapacitate the leadership, and the IJA was interested in getting a cure and vaccine for it developed before the plug was pulled, so I doubt a weaponization would be fly even in an axis japan, simply because the developers wouldnt allow it
And as far as we knew, there is no possible vaccine against such antibiotic-immune, hyper-infectious strain of the Black Plague if that kind of bioweapon was done "horrifyingly right". A strain that specifically targets human Leucocyte would mean that the chance of humans developing immune systems to that is practically nill.

That was the chief reason why those kinds of bioweapon being popular as background in "Post-Apocalyptic" movies and literature.
 
Some more photos I found:

The RoC forces often found themselves reliant on their Japanese allies in the early days of the War. As you can see from their uniforms in this shot from the Battle of Shanghai. By the end of the war however, most of their supplies were American in origin.


IJN soldiers pass several impoverished civilians during the Shanghai Campaign. Many of the most brutal campaigns for Japanese forces were those that took place in late 1941 and 1942: the period between the Fall of Harbin and when the US forces first entered Hong Kong to aid in the defense of the beleaguered city.
 
Let's also bring up the Soviet attacks that led the US into the war in the first place.

Frankly, I'd say most of the blame should be laid on the Navy for what happened. For years, experts warned that the USSR's Pacific Fleet was growing faster and faster. What did the Navy say?

"Don't worry about them, Japan's a bigger concern for us!" Despite the fact the the UK and Japan were clear that they had no intentions to pick on the US. Worse still, the US Pacific Fleet continued to be based mainly in the South Pacific even after it became clear that the Royal Navy and IJN wanted to work with the US instead of against them. No wonder the attack on Adak Harbor became such a blood bath, and I doubt Wake Island would have lasted if the IJN hadn't so conveniently intercepted the Soviet bombers and forwarded the warning.
 
What about the state of Eastern European refugees? IOTL, a ton of Russians fleeing completely destroyed cities and subsequent lack of jobs wound up in refugee camps in western Europe because China, the UK, and the USA refused to take them. Eventually, some got visas, but there are these odd little shantytown-looking groups of Russians and Poles in France, northern Italy, and western Germany to this day. What happens to all of those people if the Allies are willing to take them, or more likely, does this happen with Japanese civilians?
 
What about the state of Eastern European refugees? IOTL, a ton of Russians fleeing completely destroyed cities and subsequent lack of jobs wound up in refugee camps in western Europe because China, the UK, and the USA refused to take them. Eventually, some got visas, but there are these odd little shantytown-looking groups of Russians and Poles in France, northern Italy, and western Germany to this day. What happens to all of those people if the Allies are willing to take them, or more likely, does this happen with Japanese civilians?
I'll say off the bat that China was definitely wary about Russians in general after the war. For good reason too, so I think the US and UK would be more likely to take them in.

Japan, OTOH, is one I can see being rebuilt by the Allies after the war. Especially since the USSR would be freer to fund the PLA, and it would make the US and UK need an ally in Asia and the Pacific.
 
As is the case with all other parts of history in the 20th Century, one thing I always find compelling is how railroad infrastructure is affected by the war. Especially when it comes to locomotives and operations...


This photo depicts two of the Soviet Railway's FD Class 2-10-2s in the yards at Magadan. These engines were used heavily across the Soviet rail system, but especially on the line to Uelen, which began construction in 1931 under Stalin's watch. In addition there were older designs dating from the time of the Czar and German war machines.


The MAV 424 Class 4-8-0s were basically the Hungarian counterparts to the German 2-10-0 Kriegslok. Several clones, like the one seen above, were built for use by the USSR on both their own trackage and PLA territory in China. Later on, several of these engines could still be found as late as 1983 on mixed-traffic duties in the Republic of China.


The E Class 0-10-0s were also common across the Soviet rail network. Indeed, the need for a quick, light-weight line when building to Uelek led to most of these engines operating over that line until the eventual war came. This example survived the bombing of Magadan and is displayed at the war museum there today.


This is a celebration of the line to Magadan's opening on February 13, 1938. Only a good three years later, this part of the line would be over-run by US forces pushing as far into Russia as they physically could.
 
Now for the Allied side of wartime railroading...

The USATC built 2-10-0s like the ones pictured here as their answer to the German Kriegslok. While the vast majority of them, like this type found in Poland, wound up in Eastern Europe after the war, there were other examples that would eventually go to work in Manchukuo and Korea well into the 1980s.


In addition to all the British and American built 2-8-0s used by the Allied Powers, various locomotive builders in Japan were commisioned to replicate the D51 Mikados for use in Manchukuo and Korea. Some were even ordered by the US for use in the Phillippines.


In the war's early days, the War Department would often acquire older engines from Britain's railways for use on military trains. One of these was the LMS Johnson 3F, seen here prior to the war's beginning.


As the Republic of China set about rebuilding its network, it found that re-gauged South African Railways 19D Class 4-8-2 proved to be might fine mixed-traffic designs.
 
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Hey everyone, it's been a while since I last posted, but here are some thoughts I recently had.

1) Manchuria remaining part of Japan was not entirely a case of Japan simply refusing to give China something back. A vast majority in the province much preferred the rule of foreigners who at least were somewhat in touch with them to Chiang's corruption and despotism. Indeed, this fact was cited by the UK early on in the Cold War.
2) Had Italy indeed joined the axis, there might not have been its division into North Italy and the Two Sicilies. Long story short, Italy's Fascist Party felt its influence slip, and civil war came soon after that split the country between a monarchy in its north and a republic in its south.
3) French and Chinese collaborations in Indochina during the 60s came from French suspicion that the US would support rebels there instead of them.
 
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