DBWI: A Muslim Constantinople

So I was looking through various alt-hists, and I've seen one where Constantinople, of all cities, was taken over by some Muslim Turks?

It's far out, I tell you, it's like the Roman Empire went and whimpered.
 
Well, you have to remember that the Empire was not constantly on the up and up-a lot of what we think today is just long-held propaganda. It had several very close calls, particularly back during the early period, when the Emperor had absolute power. It meant that one bad emperor could undo the work of five good ones (much like Rome-in-the-West). Thankfully, during the really tight spots (the Sassanid wars, the Arab conquests, the Mongol wars, etc), they had brilliant, or at least competent Emperors.

The only time I could see this being feasible is when the Europeans were trying to break the Silk Road monopoly (and succeeded in some cases). The whole Mediterranean economy went downhill, and the Empire itself was somewhat impoverished. Military cuts were inevitable. If a strong enough enemy, perhaps one of the turkic groups, had managed to unite, they could have blown through the Eastern defenses and stormed across Anatolia.

Whether they could have taken Constantinople itself, though, is another matter. Pre-explosives, the city was nigh-invincible.
 
I think the problem is not in the equipments or weapons, but HOW to maintain a naval superiority over the Roman navy operating at Bosphorus strait...
Even the possibility that the Turks can reach Constantinople itself sounds really ASB to me, let alone acquire the ability to manufacturing guns and cannons...
 
Well, you have to remember that the Empire was not constantly on the up and up-a lot of what we think today is just long-held propaganda. It had several very close calls, particularly back during the early period, when the Emperor had absolute power. It meant that one bad emperor could undo the work of five good ones (much like Rome-in-the-West). Thankfully, during the really tight spots (the Sassanid wars, the Arab conquests, the Mongol wars, etc), they had brilliant, or at least competent Emperors.

The only time I could see this being feasible is when the Europeans were trying to break the Silk Road monopoly (and succeeded in some cases). The whole Mediterranean economy went downhill, and the Empire itself was somewhat impoverished. Military cuts were inevitable. If a strong enough enemy, perhaps one of the turkic groups, had managed to unite, they could have blown through the Eastern defenses and stormed across Anatolia.

Whether they could have taken Constantinople itself, though, is another matter. Pre-explosives, the city was nigh-invincible.

Yeah, it seems strange that the Walls of Theodosius fell to simple bombards.

I think the problem is not in the equipments or weapons, but HOW to maintain a naval superiority over the Roman navy operating at Bosphorus strait...
Even the possibility that the Turks can reach Constantinople itself sounds really ASB to me, let alone acquire the ability to manufacturing guns and cannons...

Yeah, I suspect the Imperial Navy was bribed or something.
 
Well, if that had happened, East Rome (what we now know as Byzant) would have not survived. We could end with an earlier Noth Rome.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
It's fairly probable though. You would simply need a POD during the Byzantine-Arab wars, and have one of the sieges won by the arabs, and then when the Seljuks or the Timurids come knocking maybe have one of their successor states take over the now partially muslim Constantinople.

Or maybe have a leader from kara Koyunlu take over somehow.

Basically any POD before the Byzantine draw at Manzikert, since after that most of the anatolian turks converted to the greek orthodox church. It would probably also butterfly away the "Kilikyan" turkish patriarchate.
 
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Well, if that had happened, East Rome (what we now know as Byzant) would have not survived. We could end with an earlier Noth Rome.

Honestly, I've lost track of all these Romes. Why does your culture feel the need to call every important city the new 'Rome'? It gets very confusing after a while.
 
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Well, they're not all called Rome anymore, we stopped calling them that once we realized the Empire was not a single centralized political entity anymore.
 
Wait, which Turks are you talking about? The Salchuks in Egypt, or the Osamans in North Persia? You'd need a fairly early POD in order to get both these groups Muslim, as the former are Christian, and the latter Zoroastrian.
 
Yeah, I suspect the Imperial Navy was bribed or something.

Ah...but from where on earth would those Turks get their money...?
I agree with archaeogeek, the only non-ASBish way for this to happen is to make the Arabs captured Constantinople during their 7th-8th century first-wave invasions...and then those Turkish mercenaries overthrowned their Arab masters...
IMO this scenario is more "acceptable" than a TL where the Turks somehow defeat the Imperial Army, bribe the Imperial Navy, and knock the walls of Constantinople with stolen bombards...
 
I could see Turkish. Simply replicate the Turkic peoples' state-formation in Central asia further to the west. They were pretty adept at assimilating government structures and such. It's Islamic I have a problem with. If history teaches us anything, it is thst Turks are always the biggest headache to their co-religionists. To my mind, it's a lot more likely that a Christian Turkic state would attack Constantinople. The Serbs, Bulgars and Rus all tried, didn't they? as others have pointed out, there is nothing inherently implausible about the City falling to a siege in a period of weakness.

Maybe a later conversion by a Turkic dynasty? The Wei and Xia claimed imperial titles, why not a Turkish ruler at the other end of asia?
 
Very true, and don't forget the Mongols (though for the most part they went further north or south, and didn't get quite as far as Anatolia, thankfully). Though if there had been a weaker caliphate, or dynastic disorganization in Khoresan (pretty common) they could have potentially rolled right through the region, like they did over Central Asia. I could see them rolling right into the Atlas mountains. Whether they'd be able to get past that point is another question.
 
Wait a minute The OP said Muslim Turks? Considering what the Turks did to the Muslims when they tried to expand beyond the Arabian peninsula in the late 600s, what sort of POD would be required for any Turkic group to be Muslim, much less powerful enough to conquer Constantinople?
 
Maybe these are a bunch of transplanted Uighurs? Those guys are Muslims, Turkish, and an incredible military force. They've been propping up the various Southern Empires of China for sometime now.
 
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