Days Like These: A Late 80s Labour Timeline
- Thread starter Time Enough
- Start date
The five points don’t mention the Unions or One Member, One Vote for that reason as Gould knows not to piss off the Unions. Much of the rhetoric is about decentralising the party structure (to win over the folks who were angry that Kinnock centralised power) and also allowing for CLP’s to be able to deselect PPC’s/MPs to win over the Grassroots/democracy crowd prominent in Labour CLP’s. Much of the rhetoric with the Unions will be different and more based upon other ideas.
A little bit of an error on my point, will change but it’s mainly meant to signal that Gould will continue the Anti-Militant campaign that Kinnock started. Mainly signalling that Gould is Left Wing but not a slave to Militant.
This is mainly because that bit is for winning over the people who Gould needs to win first, the young activists, the Labour Left (not Bennite Left but generally Left) and the various different organisations representing the various ethnic, feminist and LGBT groups present in the party. If Gould tries to fight a campaign on solely winning over the Socially Conservative crowd he’ll lose hard to John Smith because that’s Smith’s whole deal.
Essentially Gould’s campaign is about winning over the Labour Left and Centre whilst Smith is about winning the Right. Given how the Left of the Labour Party is often most prominent in CLP’s the campaign will be fought on winning over as many CLP’s and also MP’s as possible. The Trade Unions will be important but Gould doesn’t have advantages there unlike Smith who was very much the Union man.
David Flin
Gone Fishin'
The Unions at the time were very powerful within the Labour Party. And they were very touchy about encroachment onto those powers. Back in the 1970s, they were as important in setting Labour policy as any other group bar none.
Gould might try not to piss off the Unions, but at this period, the Unions were easily pissed off. It's going to be an interesting balancing act Gould needs to do; he needs the Union's money, voters still remember and shudder at the 1970s, expanding democracy within the Labour Party - however phrased and packaged - is going to be seen as taking power away from the Block Vote. Emphasising the need for members to express an opinion without being bullied or marginalised is going to come into conflict with Union leadership, which had endemic issues with bullying and marginalising dissenting opinion from that of the leadership.
I saw a fair amount of the Unions in the 1980s, and there were some less-than-attractive aspects. For example, in 1984, a couple of striking miners dropped concrete blocks from a motorway bridge on cars driving to mines in Nottingham, killing miners who had given up on the strike. The Closed Shop was still legal in the UK, and intimidation to maintain that took place.
Steering a path between democratisation of the Labour Party in the period, avoiding issues with Militant, keeping the Unions on side: Good luck.
That's where the issue between winning leadership of the Labour Party and winning an election are difficult. By and large, the activists will be in favour of such moves. However, the "traditional Labour voter", not much interested in politics but having a vote, are going to be less impressed. For example, the sexuality issue will be made more complex by the ongoing AIDs issue - which was largely labelled a "gay disease" at the time. Today, this is seen as flawed, but at the time, you would have an uphill struggle, and the attack lines that would have been used: "Labour supporting the spread of AIDs" write themselves.
It should be noted that the Trade Unions were actually rather split on the progression of the Labour Party in the late 80s. One side you had the 'Conservatives' the old school of Trade Unions who were dominate in the 1970s and were the ones who initially hated the Block Vote and then grew to love it because it gave them more power, these were the ones who didn't like the idea of One Member, One Vote in principal. Then there were the 'Modernisers', these were the ones who Gould would be winning over, a lot of them were Left Wing (not Bennite Left but what we would call the Soft Left) were more open to ideas of increasing party democracy in different ways. A lot of these people would later join the Blair camp, like Tom Sawyer, the Deputy of the NUPE who repeatedly pushed Gould to run for leadership (due Kinnock suffering from depression). These are the people that Gould will be trying to win over, which can be helped with his ideas around Industrial Democracy and increased Trade Union/Business participation with Government.
Gould's attempts to win over the Unions and the difficultly of it will be shown.
I think comparing the actions of the NUM and the Miners Strike to the problems and aspirations of the Trade Unions that Gould is winning over isn't the best road to take. Also the NUM was under the leadership of the more militant Arthur Scargill. Whilst I'm not denying bullying and similar actions, not all trade unions were the same.
It can be done, it'll be hard, but can be done. I think it would help that Gould would probably have the support of the two major unions (TGWU and NUPE) who were very much of the Left Wing Moderniser sprit and were some of the most ardent Kinnock defenders. As for Militant, well that will be coming up later.
Gould knows this, his entire schtick was around using Media and focusing on winning over people who voted for Thatcher and were wobbly on Labour, over to Labour. A lot of his ideas were proto-triangulation in some ways and Gould understood how he had to win over people and who he would win over. He was also friends with Philip Gould, one of the masterminds of the New Labour model of Focus Groups and Polling (alongside there media campaign) so the two of them would probably be finding ways of threading the knot of Wining over the Activists/'Rainbow Coalition' and Winning Over the Classic Labour Voter
Also expect David Blunkett to be making airs about this, because he thought that trying to win over the 'Rainbow Coalition' as it were was a foolish idea, so expect some arguments over that.
David Flin
Gone Fishin'
Indeed, they varied. 1986, of course, saw the Wapping Dispute, Over 500 hospitalisations later, the dispute between the old Fleet Street Unions, News International, and the new print Unions came to an end. Unions varied; I can't see the Unions taking a different course of action over moves that would limit their power than they did in OTL.
At a TUC Policy Forum, Professor Andrew Thorne (Professor of Modern British History and Associate Dean of Research and Knowledge Transfer, University of Exeter) said in response to a question:
In selecting MPs, is there a place for the 'darkest arts' to ensure that 'one of ours' (TU) got it?
AT In the days when unions had a large chunk of the constituency votes, those dark arts were a specialism of union political officers, and they had considerable success. It used to involve deals between rival unions and their candidates, with all the major unions having their 'spheres of influence' - so there were 'mining seats', 'railway seats' and so on. This continued up until the introduction of One Member, One Vote in 1993.
In some ways yes, but also it should be mentioned that Gould’s proposals whilst being OMOV in nature, also included a number of ideas for increasing the say and representation on Trade Unions in the Party and in Britain at large, something many of the more Moderniser Unions wanted to pursue instead of just abusing the block vote. The dream of the Left Unions had always been Industrial Democracy and that was one of Gould’s aspirations.
Of course for Gould to get anywhere near power, he would have to convince the Unions he won’t smash them to pieces and feast on the remains. Now much of what he does and how convinces the Unions will be appearing at a later date so I really don’t want to be playing my hand until then that much.
Chapter 4: “A Party That Works For You”
Chapter 4: “A Party That Works For You”
15th of January 1989, Edinburgh
Peter felt incredibly awkward in the hastily created meeting space in the three star Edinburgh hotel. John had decided to organise a meeting with Gordon in an effort to parlay. It was mainly an attempt to unite the disparate forces of Scottish Labour that would be needed to smash the Gould attempt. The problem was neither would really budge.
John wasn’t going to step aside for the Young Turk that was Brown, whilst Brown wasn’t going to step aside for the wheezing giant of Scottish Labour.
“It’s the man who is too late, meeting the man who is too early.” one aide would joke as the meeting was organised. Peter had told him off, but both knew that it was pretty accurate.
Gordon awkwardly leaned back on the sofa he’d been told to sit on, the coffee table in front of him strewn with a variety of filled tea cups, biscuits and sugar. Across from him sat the ever grumpy visage of Peter and next to him, squeezed into the tiny armchair, was John Smith, the affable bank manager who had been deemed the chosen leader by the Right of the party if the unfortunate instance of heart problems hadn’t caused him to become left behind.
“Now Gordon, you probably know why we’ve come here today,” John said with a twinkle in his eye.
“Yes.” Gordon said, monosyllabic.
“Well I thought we would have a little…” John paused to take a sip of tea (not his usual beverage of choice) “chat, you know Gordon, to...clear the air” he finished with a smirk. John main strength was his charm; many years of working in parliament had given him the ability to charm riches out of any uppity businessman. It’s why he was made Shadow Chancellor when Hattersley threw in the towel.
The problem with being charming is that it tends to work with people who could be charmed and Gordon had a habit of acting on occasion more like a computer than a living, breathing person. It was going to be an awkward meeting.
“Now, Gordon, I’m thinking that we finish this whole, Young Turk routine, it’s unbecoming of you really and it distracts from what I would much rather prefer you be doing.” John grinned as Gordon leaned forward, intrigued by what John had to say. Peter just sipped tea and kept his mouth shut and hoped John could carry the day.
“Well, Gordon, if I become leader, I want a fellow Scot by my side and I was thinking a young radical like you could be best suited to the Chancellorship role maybe..?” John finished, laying his offer out there. Gordon considered this deal with a devil for a few moments.
“But John, you’re someone who seems pretty welded to the more...old fashioned ideas of economics,” Gordon said, trying to avoid biting the hand that feeds. John chuckled.
“I can set aside my principles Gordon if it means I can gain your support.” he continued, before sipping his tea. It went down the wrong way and John’s response was to start violently coughing. Everyone scrambled as they came to make sure John was okay, a look of panic on each face.
“I’m fine, I’m fine...just gone down the wrong throat.” John said looking a bit bemused. Peter looked to Gordon who looked at John with a hint of concern.
“John’s fine Gordon, he’s completely fine,” Peter said through gritted teeth. As if broken from a spell Gordon looked at Peter.
“Is he now?” Gordon said before he got up from the sofa.
“It was pleasure seeing you John, I’ll let you know what I think soon.” he continued before he started heading out of the room. Peter hastily got out of his chair.
“We’d like to know now Gordon, this isn’t something you can sit on,” he hissed as he pointed at Gordon “this is something we have to do here, otherwise what’s the point?”
Gordon turned around and stared at Peter. Through his rather opaque stare, Peter got a flash of defiance. Gordon wasn’t going to budge.
“I’ll let you know John, say hello to Elizabeth for me.” he said, before he left the room.
Peter turned to look at John who was staring at him. John, never usually a man quick to anger, looked furious.
“Peter, if this ends up ending my chances of being leader, you know what I’ll do to you.” he said before he grinned.
Peter felt like he had just swallowed a lead weight as he nodded slowly.
--//--
20th of January 1989, London
Benn was going to fling himself into the leadership contest.
Again.
The wheezing remains of the Socialist Campaign Group, gutted by Benn’s last attempt, knew this. But after having some discussions with Gould, Ken had decided that it was for the best if the Group decided to endorse Gould instead. Though neither really knew it, the meeting to decide who the Socialist Campaign Group was going to nominate was going to become a battle ground between the forces of Bennism and the new force of whatever Livingstone was preaching.
You could tell who supported who by how the room was divided.
On one side, the dusty old Bennites, ranging from the ever fiery Dennis Skinner, to the meek appearance of Jeremy Corbyn, and on the other side, Ken was flanked by mainly a gaggle of London Labour MPs like Tony Banks and Diana Abbott, as well as some rather more random individuals like Bob McTaggart, who had supported Prescott during the last contest for Deputy. In between there ranged a smorgasbord of Trots, Crackpots, and the fusty old remains of Labour’s past.
There were two items on the agenda: one was to see if the Campaign Group would be nominating Benn for the leadership contest, and the other item is if not Benn, who would they be nominating from the current roster.
“Okay, so first item, will the Campaign Group be nominating Anthony Wedgewood Benn for the leadership?” the chair grumbled, “Raise your hand For the nomination.” About athird of the room raised their hands. The chair counted the hands and wrote down the number.
“Raise your hands if your against the nomination,” about a third of the room raised their hands. The chair counted the hands and wrote down the number and let out a sigh.
“Any abstentions?” he grumbled. The same as before was repeated as a few nervous people raised their hands.
“Bugger, well paper ballots it is then.” he said as pieces of paper were passed around. Everyone hastily scrawled there answer, folded the paper and passed it to the counter. Everyone would natter as the votes are counted.
“Well it seems that Against has won by 3 votes.” the chair grumbled. Ken smirked as the plan started in earnest; he knew that the weight of Benn would scare some of the members, so he told them to push it to a paper ballot. Benn looked mildly annoyed, but said nothing.
“Okay, we shall now come to the second motion. Which candidates declared so far we shall be supporting. The list compromises of Gordon Brown, Bryan Gould, and John Smith” the Chair rattled through with the energy of a man who was done with everything.
“I nominate Bryan Gould,” Ken said, as he put up his hand, this would be seconded by Diane. Tony Benn stared at him.
“I nominate John Smith.” Tony said as he continued to give Ken the evil eye. Dennis would second it.
A few moments of silence came as no one put forward Gordon.
“Well, put up your hand if you believe that the Socialist Campaign Group should nominate Bryan Gould?” the chair asked, and a surprising number of hands shot up in response.
“Do the same if you think the group should nominate John Smith?” he continued, yet again, selections of hands were raised. But it wouldn’t be enough.
“It seems that Bryan Gould will be receiving the nomination and support of the Socialist Campaign Group” he huffed, before rapidly leaving the table, the siren call of a well earned pint beckoned to him. The group mingled slightly after, some heading off to do errands and other’s staying to chat.
Tony walked up to Ken and looked at him in a betrayed fashion but tried to hide it very poorly.
“So then, Ken was your thirty pieces of silver enough?” he asked.
“I believe it’s enough for me to buy a cuppa for you Tony” Ken said with a smirk. Tony smiled in response, but his eyes showed to Ken his sense of betrayal. It was a sense of betrayal that only a close friend could provide.
--//--
21st of January 1989, London
Bryan had wanted to have an evening swim, but the January weather defeated that option. Instead, Bryan was sitting in a comfy armchair, flipping through the polling and focus group information that Philip had prepared for him. His ‘Cousin’ had compiled a selection of them at the start of the leadership campaign and had informed the leadership team he was compiling more. Bryan wanted to make sure he knew all the in’s and outs of the graphs, diagrams and transcripts sent to him.
Shame this is all incredibly tedious, he thought, as he closed the dossier and leaned back in his chair. He begun to close his eyes but was interrupted by a blue mug appearing in his vision.
“I made you a tea, decaf of course.” Gill smiled as she handed him the mug, Bryan gripping it gingerly.
“Thank you dear” he grinned before trying to sip it, deciding otherwise as the boiling hot liquid nearly went to his mouth. He placed it on the table beside.
“Now Bryan, I want to ask you something - and don’t take this the wrong way,” Gill said her smile becoming a more sombre expression.
“Of course dear,” Bryan softly.
“Well it’s just-” she started to say before pausing, wondering how to tell her husband her thoughts, “I think that if you become leader dear, and I will support you, I know that’s not the point,” she continued awkwardly, her words tumbling out “I think that you should be...careful.” she finally finished, looking rather uncomfortable.
There was reason to be, the lingering air of Bryan’s bout of Hodgkin Disease that had hit just over two years ago had stayed with the pair. Even with his constant X-Ray’s and checkups which were telling Bryan he was fine, there was a small part that didn’t feel fine.
“I will be dear...you can count on that.” he said, trying to smile.
“Bryan, I want you to promise me, if you do succeed...which I hope you do, that you don’t stay in office for more than ten years dear,” Gill demanded.
Bryan looked at her shocked for a second before nodding.
“Of course dear, I will only stay in as long I’m needed.” he smiled. Gill came over and enveloped him in a hug.
“Thank you dear, I love you,” she said before giving Bryan a peck on the cheek.
“I love you too dear,” Bryan smiled as they hugged for a few seconds longer. Gill got up and headed towards the bedroom.
“Don’t stay up too long dear,” she smiled before leaving the living room.
Bryan looked at her leave before considering what to do now. He picked up the tea, now a more pleasurable warmness and drank it.
Feel lucky for what you have, he thought, as he sipped his tea and considered the future.
15th of January 1989, Edinburgh
Peter felt incredibly awkward in the hastily created meeting space in the three star Edinburgh hotel. John had decided to organise a meeting with Gordon in an effort to parlay. It was mainly an attempt to unite the disparate forces of Scottish Labour that would be needed to smash the Gould attempt. The problem was neither would really budge.
John wasn’t going to step aside for the Young Turk that was Brown, whilst Brown wasn’t going to step aside for the wheezing giant of Scottish Labour.
“It’s the man who is too late, meeting the man who is too early.” one aide would joke as the meeting was organised. Peter had told him off, but both knew that it was pretty accurate.
Gordon awkwardly leaned back on the sofa he’d been told to sit on, the coffee table in front of him strewn with a variety of filled tea cups, biscuits and sugar. Across from him sat the ever grumpy visage of Peter and next to him, squeezed into the tiny armchair, was John Smith, the affable bank manager who had been deemed the chosen leader by the Right of the party if the unfortunate instance of heart problems hadn’t caused him to become left behind.
“Now Gordon, you probably know why we’ve come here today,” John said with a twinkle in his eye.
“Yes.” Gordon said, monosyllabic.
“Well I thought we would have a little…” John paused to take a sip of tea (not his usual beverage of choice) “chat, you know Gordon, to...clear the air” he finished with a smirk. John main strength was his charm; many years of working in parliament had given him the ability to charm riches out of any uppity businessman. It’s why he was made Shadow Chancellor when Hattersley threw in the towel.
The problem with being charming is that it tends to work with people who could be charmed and Gordon had a habit of acting on occasion more like a computer than a living, breathing person. It was going to be an awkward meeting.
“Now, Gordon, I’m thinking that we finish this whole, Young Turk routine, it’s unbecoming of you really and it distracts from what I would much rather prefer you be doing.” John grinned as Gordon leaned forward, intrigued by what John had to say. Peter just sipped tea and kept his mouth shut and hoped John could carry the day.
“Well, Gordon, if I become leader, I want a fellow Scot by my side and I was thinking a young radical like you could be best suited to the Chancellorship role maybe..?” John finished, laying his offer out there. Gordon considered this deal with a devil for a few moments.
“But John, you’re someone who seems pretty welded to the more...old fashioned ideas of economics,” Gordon said, trying to avoid biting the hand that feeds. John chuckled.
“I can set aside my principles Gordon if it means I can gain your support.” he continued, before sipping his tea. It went down the wrong way and John’s response was to start violently coughing. Everyone scrambled as they came to make sure John was okay, a look of panic on each face.
“I’m fine, I’m fine...just gone down the wrong throat.” John said looking a bit bemused. Peter looked to Gordon who looked at John with a hint of concern.
“John’s fine Gordon, he’s completely fine,” Peter said through gritted teeth. As if broken from a spell Gordon looked at Peter.
“Is he now?” Gordon said before he got up from the sofa.
“It was pleasure seeing you John, I’ll let you know what I think soon.” he continued before he started heading out of the room. Peter hastily got out of his chair.
“We’d like to know now Gordon, this isn’t something you can sit on,” he hissed as he pointed at Gordon “this is something we have to do here, otherwise what’s the point?”
Gordon turned around and stared at Peter. Through his rather opaque stare, Peter got a flash of defiance. Gordon wasn’t going to budge.
“I’ll let you know John, say hello to Elizabeth for me.” he said, before he left the room.
Peter turned to look at John who was staring at him. John, never usually a man quick to anger, looked furious.
“Peter, if this ends up ending my chances of being leader, you know what I’ll do to you.” he said before he grinned.
Peter felt like he had just swallowed a lead weight as he nodded slowly.
--//--
20th of January 1989, London
Benn was going to fling himself into the leadership contest.
Again.
The wheezing remains of the Socialist Campaign Group, gutted by Benn’s last attempt, knew this. But after having some discussions with Gould, Ken had decided that it was for the best if the Group decided to endorse Gould instead. Though neither really knew it, the meeting to decide who the Socialist Campaign Group was going to nominate was going to become a battle ground between the forces of Bennism and the new force of whatever Livingstone was preaching.
You could tell who supported who by how the room was divided.
On one side, the dusty old Bennites, ranging from the ever fiery Dennis Skinner, to the meek appearance of Jeremy Corbyn, and on the other side, Ken was flanked by mainly a gaggle of London Labour MPs like Tony Banks and Diana Abbott, as well as some rather more random individuals like Bob McTaggart, who had supported Prescott during the last contest for Deputy. In between there ranged a smorgasbord of Trots, Crackpots, and the fusty old remains of Labour’s past.
There were two items on the agenda: one was to see if the Campaign Group would be nominating Benn for the leadership contest, and the other item is if not Benn, who would they be nominating from the current roster.
“Okay, so first item, will the Campaign Group be nominating Anthony Wedgewood Benn for the leadership?” the chair grumbled, “Raise your hand For the nomination.” About athird of the room raised their hands. The chair counted the hands and wrote down the number.
“Raise your hands if your against the nomination,” about a third of the room raised their hands. The chair counted the hands and wrote down the number and let out a sigh.
“Any abstentions?” he grumbled. The same as before was repeated as a few nervous people raised their hands.
“Bugger, well paper ballots it is then.” he said as pieces of paper were passed around. Everyone hastily scrawled there answer, folded the paper and passed it to the counter. Everyone would natter as the votes are counted.
“Well it seems that Against has won by 3 votes.” the chair grumbled. Ken smirked as the plan started in earnest; he knew that the weight of Benn would scare some of the members, so he told them to push it to a paper ballot. Benn looked mildly annoyed, but said nothing.
“Okay, we shall now come to the second motion. Which candidates declared so far we shall be supporting. The list compromises of Gordon Brown, Bryan Gould, and John Smith” the Chair rattled through with the energy of a man who was done with everything.
“I nominate Bryan Gould,” Ken said, as he put up his hand, this would be seconded by Diane. Tony Benn stared at him.
“I nominate John Smith.” Tony said as he continued to give Ken the evil eye. Dennis would second it.
A few moments of silence came as no one put forward Gordon.
“Well, put up your hand if you believe that the Socialist Campaign Group should nominate Bryan Gould?” the chair asked, and a surprising number of hands shot up in response.
“Do the same if you think the group should nominate John Smith?” he continued, yet again, selections of hands were raised. But it wouldn’t be enough.
“It seems that Bryan Gould will be receiving the nomination and support of the Socialist Campaign Group” he huffed, before rapidly leaving the table, the siren call of a well earned pint beckoned to him. The group mingled slightly after, some heading off to do errands and other’s staying to chat.
Tony walked up to Ken and looked at him in a betrayed fashion but tried to hide it very poorly.
“So then, Ken was your thirty pieces of silver enough?” he asked.
“I believe it’s enough for me to buy a cuppa for you Tony” Ken said with a smirk. Tony smiled in response, but his eyes showed to Ken his sense of betrayal. It was a sense of betrayal that only a close friend could provide.
--//--
21st of January 1989, London
Bryan had wanted to have an evening swim, but the January weather defeated that option. Instead, Bryan was sitting in a comfy armchair, flipping through the polling and focus group information that Philip had prepared for him. His ‘Cousin’ had compiled a selection of them at the start of the leadership campaign and had informed the leadership team he was compiling more. Bryan wanted to make sure he knew all the in’s and outs of the graphs, diagrams and transcripts sent to him.
Shame this is all incredibly tedious, he thought, as he closed the dossier and leaned back in his chair. He begun to close his eyes but was interrupted by a blue mug appearing in his vision.
“I made you a tea, decaf of course.” Gill smiled as she handed him the mug, Bryan gripping it gingerly.
“Thank you dear” he grinned before trying to sip it, deciding otherwise as the boiling hot liquid nearly went to his mouth. He placed it on the table beside.
“Now Bryan, I want to ask you something - and don’t take this the wrong way,” Gill said her smile becoming a more sombre expression.
“Of course dear,” Bryan softly.
“Well it’s just-” she started to say before pausing, wondering how to tell her husband her thoughts, “I think that if you become leader dear, and I will support you, I know that’s not the point,” she continued awkwardly, her words tumbling out “I think that you should be...careful.” she finally finished, looking rather uncomfortable.
There was reason to be, the lingering air of Bryan’s bout of Hodgkin Disease that had hit just over two years ago had stayed with the pair. Even with his constant X-Ray’s and checkups which were telling Bryan he was fine, there was a small part that didn’t feel fine.
“I will be dear...you can count on that.” he said, trying to smile.
“Bryan, I want you to promise me, if you do succeed...which I hope you do, that you don’t stay in office for more than ten years dear,” Gill demanded.
Bryan looked at her shocked for a second before nodding.
“Of course dear, I will only stay in as long I’m needed.” he smiled. Gill came over and enveloped him in a hug.
“Thank you dear, I love you,” she said before giving Bryan a peck on the cheek.
“I love you too dear,” Bryan smiled as they hugged for a few seconds longer. Gill got up and headed towards the bedroom.
“Don’t stay up too long dear,” she smiled before leaving the living room.
Bryan looked at her leave before considering what to do now. He picked up the tea, now a more pleasurable warmness and drank it.
Feel lucky for what you have, he thought, as he sipped his tea and considered the future.
Thanks, I hope folks are finding this interesting and enjoyable.
Also the last part of chapter 4 was a deliberate attempt to make sure that Gould was actually presented as a human being and not an arrogant political robot man.
I don't relly know too much of british politics, But i AM relly loving the all strory
Chapter 5: “The Future of Industrial Democracy”
Chapter 5: “The Future of Industrial Democracy”
24th of January 1989, London
Bryan, David and Michael were sat in a rather dingy conference room, the place full of yellowing white walls and coffee stained Formica tables. Philip had decided that he had to organise a meeting with these three men to confer some interesting data that he had found. Philip had been spending the last few weeks going around the country and creating a number of focus groups to add a different flavour to the polling.
“God, when will he show up, I need a piss,” David grumbled. As if hearing David’s grumblings, the slick figure of Philip burst through the door, followed by a scruffy looking assistant carrying some A3 cards emblazoned with graphs and charts behind him alongside a stand.
“My apologies gentlemen, I was making sure to get to gain all my pieces for the presentation,” Philip said as he placed a suitcase on the table. Opening it up with a slight flourish he took out a quartet of manila bound files and passed them around, whilst his assistant awkwardly tried to set up the stand and placed some of the graphs on them.
“Now, it’s been about a month since Bryan announced his campaign, and it has allowed me to see which groups are most sympathetic to his message and which one’s need more efforts to break through as it were,” He opened the folder and indicated to the first page. Behind him, the assistant finally managed to sort out the first card which was covered in graphs and data.
“Now, the graph behind me is based upon polling conducted by various different groups, to ensure as accurate an image as possible,” he said, pointing to the card covered in a confusing array of bar charts and colours.
“Is there any way to simplify any of this?” David grumbled, the array of images meaning nothing to him.
“Okay, Bryan is doing incredibly well with a majority of the Prescott voters in the recent deputy leadership election, southern, and midlands CLP’s, Younger Activists, Labour Democracy Advocates, and what has been dubbed the ‘Rainbow Coalition’ by some,” Philip rattled through, the mentioning of the last group causing Blunkett to let out a grunt.
“Of course” he groaned, Blunkett’s opinions upon the so called Rainbow Coalition of the disadvantaged and discriminated against weren’t the most positive to say the least.
“So you’re saying I’m doing rather well with the Left?” Bryan asked, trying to keep the talk on topic instead of going into Blunkett’s grievances.
“For the most part Yes, outmanoeuvring Benn seems to have paid dividends in this case, really only the...passionate fundamentalists would support Smith, which gets me to my next point,” Philip said as he turned the page and the assistant showcased the next graph strewn card.
“Now here’s where I give you the bad news, you’re doing rather poorly with the trade unions, northern CLPs and pretty much all of the Scottish CLP’s at this time.” Philip grimly announced. The News was unsurprising, but still bad in its own way.
“The problem is that Smith’s already ahead of you with the Trade Union support, and there is a possibility that Brown could secure enough Trade Union support to unbalance your attempts and ensure a Smith victory.” he stated in the same moody tone. The three comrades looked rather grim.
“So what is it that we can do, to gain ground?” Michael piped up as the other two mulled on what to do.
“Well we have Sawyer to help us for part of it,” Bryan said confidently.
“Yes, but we’ll need more support than that Bryan,” Michael said as he tapped his fingers on the table, contemplating what to do. “I know… we could try and gain some support from Todd.” he said, snapping his fingers.
“He’s a bit wary since Prescott... he’s been having some trouble as of late,” Blunkett grumbled as he let loose his info about the troubles within the Transport and General Workers' Union, one of the biggest Unions to support Labour. Ron Todd could be as much of a kingmaker as Tom Sawyer if he leant his Unions support to the right person. This is what had lead to the shock Prescott upset after all.
“Hmm, I may have to have a personal chat with Todd,” Bryan mused as he begun planning his next moves, as the rest of meeting swiftly turned into a cacophony of focus groups and numbers, all of which provided Bryan with alternate paths to leadership.
--//--
1st of February 1989, Dagenham
For Ron Todd and Bryan Gould, Dagenham was the perfect place to meet, a form of neutral ground in which conversations that could make or break Gould’s campaign. Each brought a fellow witness, Bryan bringing Michael, whose Left Wing background and his Shadow Employment Secretary Position would prove more approachable to Todd than the grumpy visage of Blunkett, who’d decide to use the opportunity to provide some words to Prescott on future meetings. Todd on the other hand, brought his right hand man, Bill Morris, his stony demeanour and glasses hiding a rather shrewd operator who had managed to get from humble Jamaican roots to being the Deputy Secretary of the TGWU. The meeting was to occur in an office far out of the way of any peering eyes; Gould’s visage would have prompting unwanted attention.
“So Bryan let’s get down to brass tacks. what’s the intention of this little meeting?” Todd asked.
To convince you I’m your only hope, Bryan thought before dissuading that idea.
“Because, Todd, I believe that for me to get anywhere, I require your help.” Bryan said cordially. The two union men looked at him blankly.
“Well we could guess that, the main question is why?” Todd said bluntly. Bryan felt a bit flummoxed by the response.
“Because we believe in a Labour Party that represents the actual issues of all of its members,” Michael came in rapidly with a smile, “A party that is for Unilateral Disarmament, Trade Unions and a Socialist nation... and Ron, your one of the biggest believers in those ideas within the Trade Unions sphere.” he finished with a genial air.
“Those are all very valid points Michael,” Todd grinned as his ego was mildly inflated.
“In some ways, my ideas for the party would give you more say.” Bryan came in with a grin. Todd looked at him in an intrigued fashion.
“Pray do tell Bryan,” Todd continued, a thousand cogs in his brain turning as he planned what could occur in the future.
“Well, I hope to bring in Trade Union voices into the Shadow Cabinet...per say we have a department for Industrial Affairs as it were...like the Japanese maybe,” Bryan confidently announced, the two other men looked at him nonplussed.
“That’s an interesting idea,” Morris said blankly, causing Bryan to feel a bit perturbed.
“Of course, having more say on Party matters too,” Michael swooped as Bryan mulled how to continue this.
“That’s good...I will have to think this over though.” Todd said, offering no real comfort to Bryan.
“You see, we have to air out everyone’s offers before putting them towards the committee...and we’re being extra careful after...the whole Prescott debacle.” Morris said softly.
Oh fuck, Bryan thought as he continued smiling as the men got up and shook hands, leaving with a sense of mild foreboding.
--//--
1st of February 1989, London
John Prescott had wondered what had happened to cause him to be leader of the opposition. Maybe he’d punched an old witch or something at some point, because it rapidly seemed like a curse had befallen him. All the Newspapers, Politicians, and more who had been gunning at Kinnock now, had turned their sights on Prescott, and it was incredibly easy to do.
Cartoonists were having a field day portraying him as a fat, brutish lout who had stumbled into the position of temporary leader. It became quite annoying after a while.
Today, Blunkett had given him an offer to escape this temporary hell. As the two sat in his rather bare leader of the opposition office, Blunkett showed him a vision... a vision of Bryan Gould as leader.
“You want me to support Bryan?” Prescott asked, knowing the answer.
“Yes John, you have your various Union connections and you can persuade the few who maybe are wobbling on the fence to join our camp,” Blunkett said. Prescott considered it with a furrowed brow.
“Why you over John?” He asked, waiting for him to confirm the obvious.
“Because we believe the same things, John.” Blunkett grumbled as Prescott grinned, “You know, not supply side Socialism or whatever the fuck it is,” he continued as Prescott nodded.
“Well maybe, but you know, I’ll have to consider it.” Prescott butted in.
“You know Peter’s working for John, right?” Blunkett said bluntly.
“What does that twat have to do with anything?” Prescott grumbled.
“Well, remember the stories during your bid, the ones saying you were thick and shit like that,” Blunkett continued in the same tone as Prescott winced. “Well...we all know it was Peter’s doing...now imagine him with the ear of John.” he finished, offering Prescott a grim vision of the future.
“Fuck!” Prescott blurted as Blunkett nodded in agreement.
“Give it a consideration John,” Blunkett said, getting ready to leave as Prescott rapidly made up his mind and prepared for the ensuing campaign of ass kissing for Bryan.
24th of January 1989, London
Bryan, David and Michael were sat in a rather dingy conference room, the place full of yellowing white walls and coffee stained Formica tables. Philip had decided that he had to organise a meeting with these three men to confer some interesting data that he had found. Philip had been spending the last few weeks going around the country and creating a number of focus groups to add a different flavour to the polling.
“God, when will he show up, I need a piss,” David grumbled. As if hearing David’s grumblings, the slick figure of Philip burst through the door, followed by a scruffy looking assistant carrying some A3 cards emblazoned with graphs and charts behind him alongside a stand.
“My apologies gentlemen, I was making sure to get to gain all my pieces for the presentation,” Philip said as he placed a suitcase on the table. Opening it up with a slight flourish he took out a quartet of manila bound files and passed them around, whilst his assistant awkwardly tried to set up the stand and placed some of the graphs on them.
“Now, it’s been about a month since Bryan announced his campaign, and it has allowed me to see which groups are most sympathetic to his message and which one’s need more efforts to break through as it were,” He opened the folder and indicated to the first page. Behind him, the assistant finally managed to sort out the first card which was covered in graphs and data.
“Now, the graph behind me is based upon polling conducted by various different groups, to ensure as accurate an image as possible,” he said, pointing to the card covered in a confusing array of bar charts and colours.
“Is there any way to simplify any of this?” David grumbled, the array of images meaning nothing to him.
“Okay, Bryan is doing incredibly well with a majority of the Prescott voters in the recent deputy leadership election, southern, and midlands CLP’s, Younger Activists, Labour Democracy Advocates, and what has been dubbed the ‘Rainbow Coalition’ by some,” Philip rattled through, the mentioning of the last group causing Blunkett to let out a grunt.
“Of course” he groaned, Blunkett’s opinions upon the so called Rainbow Coalition of the disadvantaged and discriminated against weren’t the most positive to say the least.
“So you’re saying I’m doing rather well with the Left?” Bryan asked, trying to keep the talk on topic instead of going into Blunkett’s grievances.
“For the most part Yes, outmanoeuvring Benn seems to have paid dividends in this case, really only the...passionate fundamentalists would support Smith, which gets me to my next point,” Philip said as he turned the page and the assistant showcased the next graph strewn card.
“Now here’s where I give you the bad news, you’re doing rather poorly with the trade unions, northern CLPs and pretty much all of the Scottish CLP’s at this time.” Philip grimly announced. The News was unsurprising, but still bad in its own way.
“The problem is that Smith’s already ahead of you with the Trade Union support, and there is a possibility that Brown could secure enough Trade Union support to unbalance your attempts and ensure a Smith victory.” he stated in the same moody tone. The three comrades looked rather grim.
“So what is it that we can do, to gain ground?” Michael piped up as the other two mulled on what to do.
“Well we have Sawyer to help us for part of it,” Bryan said confidently.
“Yes, but we’ll need more support than that Bryan,” Michael said as he tapped his fingers on the table, contemplating what to do. “I know… we could try and gain some support from Todd.” he said, snapping his fingers.
“He’s a bit wary since Prescott... he’s been having some trouble as of late,” Blunkett grumbled as he let loose his info about the troubles within the Transport and General Workers' Union, one of the biggest Unions to support Labour. Ron Todd could be as much of a kingmaker as Tom Sawyer if he leant his Unions support to the right person. This is what had lead to the shock Prescott upset after all.
“Hmm, I may have to have a personal chat with Todd,” Bryan mused as he begun planning his next moves, as the rest of meeting swiftly turned into a cacophony of focus groups and numbers, all of which provided Bryan with alternate paths to leadership.
--//--
1st of February 1989, Dagenham
For Ron Todd and Bryan Gould, Dagenham was the perfect place to meet, a form of neutral ground in which conversations that could make or break Gould’s campaign. Each brought a fellow witness, Bryan bringing Michael, whose Left Wing background and his Shadow Employment Secretary Position would prove more approachable to Todd than the grumpy visage of Blunkett, who’d decide to use the opportunity to provide some words to Prescott on future meetings. Todd on the other hand, brought his right hand man, Bill Morris, his stony demeanour and glasses hiding a rather shrewd operator who had managed to get from humble Jamaican roots to being the Deputy Secretary of the TGWU. The meeting was to occur in an office far out of the way of any peering eyes; Gould’s visage would have prompting unwanted attention.
“So Bryan let’s get down to brass tacks. what’s the intention of this little meeting?” Todd asked.
To convince you I’m your only hope, Bryan thought before dissuading that idea.
“Because, Todd, I believe that for me to get anywhere, I require your help.” Bryan said cordially. The two union men looked at him blankly.
“Well we could guess that, the main question is why?” Todd said bluntly. Bryan felt a bit flummoxed by the response.
“Because we believe in a Labour Party that represents the actual issues of all of its members,” Michael came in rapidly with a smile, “A party that is for Unilateral Disarmament, Trade Unions and a Socialist nation... and Ron, your one of the biggest believers in those ideas within the Trade Unions sphere.” he finished with a genial air.
“Those are all very valid points Michael,” Todd grinned as his ego was mildly inflated.
“In some ways, my ideas for the party would give you more say.” Bryan came in with a grin. Todd looked at him in an intrigued fashion.
“Pray do tell Bryan,” Todd continued, a thousand cogs in his brain turning as he planned what could occur in the future.
“Well, I hope to bring in Trade Union voices into the Shadow Cabinet...per say we have a department for Industrial Affairs as it were...like the Japanese maybe,” Bryan confidently announced, the two other men looked at him nonplussed.
“That’s an interesting idea,” Morris said blankly, causing Bryan to feel a bit perturbed.
“Of course, having more say on Party matters too,” Michael swooped as Bryan mulled how to continue this.
“That’s good...I will have to think this over though.” Todd said, offering no real comfort to Bryan.
“You see, we have to air out everyone’s offers before putting them towards the committee...and we’re being extra careful after...the whole Prescott debacle.” Morris said softly.
Oh fuck, Bryan thought as he continued smiling as the men got up and shook hands, leaving with a sense of mild foreboding.
--//--
1st of February 1989, London
John Prescott had wondered what had happened to cause him to be leader of the opposition. Maybe he’d punched an old witch or something at some point, because it rapidly seemed like a curse had befallen him. All the Newspapers, Politicians, and more who had been gunning at Kinnock now, had turned their sights on Prescott, and it was incredibly easy to do.
Cartoonists were having a field day portraying him as a fat, brutish lout who had stumbled into the position of temporary leader. It became quite annoying after a while.
Today, Blunkett had given him an offer to escape this temporary hell. As the two sat in his rather bare leader of the opposition office, Blunkett showed him a vision... a vision of Bryan Gould as leader.
“You want me to support Bryan?” Prescott asked, knowing the answer.
“Yes John, you have your various Union connections and you can persuade the few who maybe are wobbling on the fence to join our camp,” Blunkett said. Prescott considered it with a furrowed brow.
“Why you over John?” He asked, waiting for him to confirm the obvious.
“Because we believe the same things, John.” Blunkett grumbled as Prescott grinned, “You know, not supply side Socialism or whatever the fuck it is,” he continued as Prescott nodded.
“Well maybe, but you know, I’ll have to consider it.” Prescott butted in.
“You know Peter’s working for John, right?” Blunkett said bluntly.
“What does that twat have to do with anything?” Prescott grumbled.
“Well, remember the stories during your bid, the ones saying you were thick and shit like that,” Blunkett continued in the same tone as Prescott winced. “Well...we all know it was Peter’s doing...now imagine him with the ear of John.” he finished, offering Prescott a grim vision of the future.
“Fuck!” Prescott blurted as Blunkett nodded in agreement.
“Give it a consideration John,” Blunkett said, getting ready to leave as Prescott rapidly made up his mind and prepared for the ensuing campaign of ass kissing for Bryan.
So since we’re five chapters in I will enquire if folks have questions, ideas and other bobbins to ask me.
Also criticisms are always looked for.
Also criticisms are always looked for.
As someone who has basically zero knowledge of the internal workings of the Labour Party at this point in history, and yet a keen interest in how they are going to affect things, I'm still watching with interest but quite a bit of general confusion as to who 90% of the people here are or their importance.
The aim is for it to be understandable for folks who don’t know 1980s Labour.
Well how about I just say who the major characters are;
Bryan Gould-An MP from New Zealand he was off the Soft Left, Eurosecptic and Tribunate section of Labour though he was also a firm believer in modernisation of presentation and political ideas (he was a firm Market Socialist). He was also an arrogant and rather intellectual man so.
Peter Mandelson-The Prince of Darkness, the architect of New Labour etc. At this point in time he was the Director of Communications, a job that he used to bulldoze enemies of Kinnock and establish the group that would allow for New Labour to exist. But due to Kinnock throwing in the towel in this timeline he’s a bit more in a lurch. Also has a dumb moustache.
Other characters will appear ranging from Gordon Brown to Ken Livingstone. Please enquire if you need me to explain other folks.
I know this is a late reply but this doesn’t surprise me, he was also Peter Shore ‘disciple’ as it were (though his views on how to achieve Socialism were less Autarkic than Shore’s, more Market Socialist inspired). I recommend reading Gould’s memoir it’s lots of fun.
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I don't know how to insert a gif, so here it is: https://tenor.com/Js7B.gif
It's weird, but Bryan Gould's market socialism is more libertarian and less statist than Tito's.
So he was part of the hard left.
"A Future for Socialism", by Bryan Gould. I've been trying to find it online. All I can know is that he wants to replace inefficient industries with new industries in the North of England. To use industrial policy (economic planning) to create new export manufacturing industries.
His market socialism envisions replacing the private sector with worker cooperatives and employee stock ownership plan.
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Gouldnomics and the ‘Future of Socialism’
This is for anyone, like me, who does not have Bryan Gould's book/pamphlets.I wrote that actually. Also I do own a copy of Future of Socialism.
Windows95
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Holy.... whoa. I am surprised. I'll have to cite you for this. I am sorry for not acknowledging your work. I did not know you write this. By the way, it is good content.