Dark Age Britain ideas

I've been thinking about a couple Dark Age Britain ideas.
1) WI the invading Anglo-Saxons were repulsed by the Romanized Britains.
Then a A-S ship or a few ships are blown north like the Spanish
Armada. They end up off the coast of Ireland. The A-S invade Ireland
instead of Britain. This would cause some serious butterflies. Please
discuss.
2) WI the Norse established permanent kingdoms in Ireland. By permanent
I mean kingdoms that survive until the Norman conquest and beyond.
What would be the effect of these Norse kingdoms on Great Britain?
Please discuss.
 
Well, first of all, let's dump the 'Dark Age' idea-an invention of the Victorians largely to justify their world view. Modern historians baulk at the term as its unrealistic.

Idea 1
An interesting one but I doubt one or two ship loads of 'Anglo-Saxons' is going to be sufficient and also why would they feel the need to go as far as Ireland? Even if driven north, it would make more sensible for them to land in what we now call 'Scotland'.
Even without an 'Anglo-Saxon' invasion (if it ever really happened of course), I doubt we will see a united Post-Roman Britannia at this period, evidence indicates it was already breaking up into a series of seperate identities.

Idea 2
Need more of an Early Medieval Irish expert for this but I do feel this has more going for it, esp if (say) early attacks on 'England' fail and Ireland is seen as a better target.
 
The Anglo-Saxons wanted to conquer the (relatively) rich lowlands of England. England was also a short sail from the Anglo-Saxons original homelands. Ireland was far away and not rich. Furthermore, the Anglo-Saxons apparent success in whole-sale population replacement (Anglo-Saxon settlers pushing out native Britons) points to the inevitability of the Anglo-Saxon conquest of England.

The Norse did establish a permanent presence in Ireland, its just that the Norse had a habit of "going native". So later Irish leaders ended up being descended from Norse invaders.
 
Permanent Norse-Gael Kingdoms

Okay, I'll drop the "Dark Ages" term. I didn't know what else to call this period of history.
My idea for the more extensive Norse-Gael timeline involves the Kingdoms
of Dublin, Mann & the Isles as well as kingdoms along the SE coast of Ireland. The N-Gs might also move into Scotland. I think the N-Gs would
remember more of their Scandinavian heritage. Wales and Anglo-Norman
England might become targets of raids. The N-G kingdoms would also probably fight amonst themselves for dominance, maybe a Norse-Gael High
King or something. Who knows the N-Gs might become involved in expeditions to Iceland or North America. Thought????
 
The term a lot of historians now use is "Early Medieval". Some use the term "Migration Period" but that opens up another can of worms-was there migration? If so, how much actually happened.

You'll find quite a lot of older (and even newer) books refer to this as the "Sub-Roman Period" but of late this phrase is dropping out of use as quite a few question the use of the word 'sub-' given its negative contexts; "Post-Roman" is an alternative but not really appropriate for Ireland (unless you want death threats)

Some also use the terms "Early Christian" and "Early/Pagan Saxon", though of course that then means using two different terms for the same period and can get confusing. For Ireland though "Early Christian" is ideal (as is "Early Medieval")

I think some continental historians use the phrase "Post-Late Antiquity" but that always feels like a mouthful to me

Okay, I'll drop the "Dark Ages" term. I didn't know what else to call this period of history.
My idea for the more extensive Norse-Gael timeline involves the Kingdoms
of Dublin, Mann & the Isles as well as kingdoms along the SE coast of Ireland. The N-Gs might also move into Scotland. I think the N-Gs would
remember more of their Scandinavian heritage. Wales and Anglo-Norman
England might become targets of raids. The N-G kingdoms would also probably fight amonst themselves for dominance, maybe a Norse-Gael High
King or something. Who knows the N-Gs might become involved in expeditions to Iceland or North America. Thought????
 
Please....Forget this idea of wholesale population displacement and argue instead for assimilation. My ancestors (Anglians, 7-8th cent.) did apparently completely abolish Welsh settlement south of modern Brum to the Cotswolds, but that's the exception. However, the Anglian Empire in Britain stretched as far as South West Scotland - where I now live. Floreat Anglia ! Not bad for Angeln in Jutland, was it ?
 
Top