Dabuyid Persia after Islamic disintegration

Dorozhand

Banned
Earlier, I posted a scenario about the Coptic Revolt of 725 driving the Arabs from Egypt. This got me thinking about a possible domino of rebellions in other parts of the Islamic Empire. After all, it would occur near a crisis point in the Caliphate's internal stability (The Abbasid Revolution), and would have Egypt's example to highlight the possibility.

This also got me thinking about the Dabuyids, a rump Zoroastrian state that hung on in Tabaristan well into the VIII Century. What if they went on the offensive as the tide receded and reconquered all of Persia?

What would this new Zoroastrian dynasty look like? What would be the aftermath of its conquest? How would it affect the future of Iran and Eurasia in general?
 
I did something similar in my No Islam TL only they swept away the remants of the Sassanids and break away states. Given the nature of the Tapurianis I would say initially they would favor Infantry and Heavy Infantry as they were known for that but eventually would have to reconcile and rebuild the Diqhan Class that constituted the Cataphracts.

In fairly certain on a religious scale they would at least initially be not in favor of a more Orthodox approach to Zoroastrianism especially the way the State Church acted. If sources are correct it is possible they were influenced by Mazdakite hold outs and may take a more Eglitarian approach but in this case we may see the Zoroastrian Orthodox allying with the Muslims as they did to put down a revolt by Revolutionary Messiahic Zoroastrians in the Khoroasan area.
 

Dorozhand

Banned
I did something similar in my No Islam TL only they swept away the remants of the Sassanids and break away states. Given the nature of the Tapurianis I would say initially they would favor Infantry and Heavy Infantry as they were known for that but eventually would have to reconcile and rebuild the Diqhan Class that constituted the Cataphracts.

In fairly certain on a religious scale they would at least initially be not in favor of a more Orthodox approach to Zoroastrianism especially the way the State Church acted. If sources are correct it is possible they were influenced by Mazdakite hold outs and may take a more Eglitarian approach but in this case we may see the Zoroastrian Orthodox allying with the Muslims as they did to put down a revolt by Revolutionary Messiahic Zoroastrians in the Khoroasan area.


Very interesting. Maybe we could see come out of this a Dabuyid Persia with an excellent heavy infantry doctrine supplemented by the Sassanid heavy cavalry doctrine that they would have inherited. That would be a formidable force indeed.

It would be really intriguing if there developed some kind of syncretic fusion of Islam, Christianity, and heterodox messianic Zoroastrianism, or at least a Zoroastrianism that inserts itself into a semi-Abrahamic philosophical framework.
 
Earlier, I posted a scenario about the Coptic Revolt of 725 driving the Arabs from Egypt. This got me thinking about a possible domino of rebellions in other parts of the Islamic Empire. After all, it would occur near a crisis point in the Caliphate's internal stability (The Abbasid Revolution), and would have Egypt's example to highlight the possibility.

I think we need to draw a sharp distinction between the collapse of the Umayyads and "Islamic power" when it comes to rebellions or things like the Dabuyids going on the attack.
 

Dorozhand

Banned
I think we need to draw a sharp distinction between the collapse of the Umayyads and "Islamic power" when it comes to rebellions or things like the Dabuyids going on the attack.

Well, the revolt of the Abbasids was a part of a growing feud between Damascus and Baghdad, and rebellion threatened to break out before as the Umayyad Empire weakened. This sort of situation seems like something that could have turned into a protracted civil war, especially if it had broken out earlier.

Let's suppose, then, that the war begins at an earlier date, and the Umayyad and Abbasid factions continue fighting one another with no clear victor on either side. This might save the Dabuyids from being overrun by the Abbasids as they were IOTL. It would also decrease Arab presence and vigilance in their more far flung territories.

A Coptic Egyptian revolt occurring on the heels of this civil war would then have a much better chance of succeeding.

In the event of the revolt succeeding, other peoples under Arab control might be inspired to do the same. The Zoroastrians of Iran might unite behind the Dabuyids and provide them support and recruitment if they move on the offensive.

By the time the dust settles, there are two rival Caliphates in Damascus and Baghdad, an independent Egypt, and a Dabuyid Persia.
 
Well, the revolt of the Abbasids was a part of a growing feud between Damascus and Baghdad, and rebellion threatened to break out before as the Umayyad Empire weakened. This sort of situation seems like something that could have turned into a protracted civil war, especially if it had broken out earlier.

Let's suppose, then, that the war begins at an earlier date, and the Umayyad and Abbasid factions continue fighting one another with no clear victor on either side. This might save the Dabuyids from being overrun by the Abbasids as they were IOTL. It would also decrease Arab presence and vigilance in their more far flung territories.

Who leads this revolt? Who supports it?

I don't think we can just have it moved back two decades or more without taking into consideration the situation in the early 720s (where other than the attacks on Constantinople Islamic conquests have been pretty successful) vs. the 740s (where things have slipped a bit and the caliph is less popular/able).

In the event of the revolt succeeding, other peoples under Arab control might be inspired to do the same. The Zoroastrians of Iran might unite behind the Dabuyids and provide them support and recruitment if they move on the offensive.

By the time the dust settles, there are two rival Caliphates in Damascus and Baghdad, an independent Egypt, and a Dabuyid Persia.

I think you overestimate the strength of the latter two. I'm not saying this can't happen, but I think it would take a pretty substantial change to have things get this bad.

Egypt breaking free even temporally would be a significant something given OTL circumstances. Going from there into "and things unravel completely" needs a bit more than how Zoroastrians in Iran might support the Dabuyids and you might get a prolonged civil war.
 
Obviously Abu Muslim would be a key figure. Perhaps of he was more Zoroastrian oriented. Though a course where he is not killed may be involved. If this scenario takes place around his time frame.
 
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