D-day paratroopers?

But more than the weight of an M22 light tank, or a M114 howitzer.

Always thought it odd that Ordnance thought the 37mm was the best choice for the M22, rather than having the 75mm pack howitzer that the M8 and LVT(A)-4 had, that were designated for infantry support.

M66 HEAT round could penetrate twice what the 37mm AP could do, at the cost of weighing 130 pounds more, plus had a decent smoke and HE load.
 
The Hamilcar carried loads including the M22 or a 17lbr AT gun and tractor, two universal carriers or other sundry equipment, all in all a very useful addition to your airborne logistics capability. The British airbourn could have done with a lot more of them and the Halifax's to tow them.
 
The term "production difficulties" applies to the Hamilcar, with everyone blaming everyone else, and rightly so. Another Castle Bromwich, but without an ultimate solution. Good design, poor follow-through.
 
Not to fight an individual battle.

That total is the average to fight a campaign and so includes beyond food, fuel and ammunition things like replacement uniforms and equipment, and probably a share of a Coca-Cola plant.

That was what they needed every single day they were in combat. This isn't happening.
 
It would be a brave officer indeed who'd be entrusted with the job of informing his unit's men they'd be sent out in M22s against Panthers and Tigers.

Yes, but a 17 pounder anti tank gun which was also carried by the Hamilcar was quite capable of knocking out German cats.
 
Not really; you can get people up to free-fall parachuting standard in a couple of weeks.

Static-line jumps are easy; the challenges are moving around the plane fully-loaded, and landing without breaking too many things.
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Any soldier can learn the basics of static-line jumping in one day. I have taught the one-day S/L course dozens of times for a total of hundreds of S/L or IAD students. Ground school can be taught in as little as 3 hours (with bright students). 99 percent jumped the same afternoon.
Mind you, they required close supervision. They exited one per pass with me closely supervising: a firm hand on their harness and leaning out close enough to kiss them! We tried to time exits so that only one student was in the air at a time.
Teaching troops to exit 30 per pass would take another week. Teaching them how to jump with rucksacks, rifles and snowshoes would take most of another week.

But learning S/L parachuting is the easy part.
Toughening up light infantry is the hard part. They need to learn how to carry and use a variety of radios, weapons, explosives, etc. All that light-weight, go-fast gear quickly adds up to 100 pound (40 kg) rucksacks, plus body armour, etc.
Then they have to learn how to swim and run marathons with all that gear. Finally, they need to learn to fight as teams to kill the enemy.
Training light infantry can take several years to slowly grow all the muscles, tendons, ligaments, lungs, etc.

Master Corporal (retired) Rob Warner CD, BA, Canadian Army Basic Paratrooper Wings, West German Army Bronze Paratrooper Wings, plus a long list of civilian skydiving ratings. Total more than 6,600 jumps.
 
It would be a brave officer indeed who'd be entrusted with the job of informing his unit's men they'd be sent out in M22s against Panthers and Tigers.

of which were zero in the area where US airborne troops were. The Germans in those areas had light armor, armored cars.

13mm of armor beats a khaki shirt when attacking a MG nest
 
of which were zero in the area where US airborne troops were. The Germans in those areas had light armor, armored cars.

13mm of armor beats a khaki shirt when attacking a MG nest

The presumption of the thread is that the entire D-Day invasion force would be delivered by air.
 
The presumption of the thread is that the entire D-Day invasion force would be delivered by air.

Point stands, there were zero Tigers or Panthers at first.

And no-one was saying that the Allies wouldn't be landing equipment on D-Day+1 and thereafter
 

Driftless

Donor
Having sufficient numbers of gliders of varying types is only part of the calculation.
  • How much available acreage (not flooded or "asparagussed" with posts) was available and big enough to use for landing gliders in reasonable proximity to the beaches? Those landing zones would need to be reasonably close to a shoreline usable for shore landing of replenishment materials, tanks and other heavy gear.
  • That and how close together would those sites have been? Unless you can concentrate your airborne forces to some extent, they're going to be chewed up pretty quickly by local German forces.
  • How many of those landing zones were big enough for more than a few gliders per field - many were damaged on landing and how would you clear the field for airborne reinforcement with limited equipment and little time, while under fire? Practically, they got one shot at using most landing zones.
  • How many more tow planes could be diverted from other tasks before that impacts other operations?
*edit* With hindsight, more and better use of gliders could have been made during Overlord, but there's also probably a point of diminishing returns on that option
 

BlondieBC

Banned
Having sufficient numbers of gliders of varying types is only part of the calculation.
  • How much available acreage (not flooded or "asparagussed" with posts) was available and big enough to use for landing gliders in reasonable proximity to the beaches? Those landing zones would need to be reasonably close to a shoreline usable for shore landing of replenishment materials, tanks and other heavy gear.
  • That and how close together would those sites have been? Unless you can concentrate your airborne forces to some extent, they're going to be chewed up pretty quickly by local German forces.
  • How many of those landing zones were big enough for more than a few gliders per field - many were damaged on landing and how would you clear the field for airborne reinforcement with limited equipment and little time, while under fire? Practically, they got one shot at using most landing zones.
  • How many more tow planes could be diverted from other tasks before that impacts other operations?
*edit* With hindsight, more and better use of gliders could have been made during Overlord, but there's also probably a point of diminishing returns on that option

With hindsight, you have more of the funnies built for Omaha beach. And you release the existing tanks assigned closer to the beach. It would be pretty easy to make Omaha a much easier breakout, easier with hindsight.
 
Original German doctrine dropped a first wave of paratroopers onto an existing airfield. They suppressed AAA and over-ran the first rank of airfield defence. The second wave of infantry were supposed to land (inside airplanes). The third wave of airplanes brought fresh ammunition and heavier guns.
That is why a German Mounsin Division was flown into Crete after paratroopers failed to capture the island. Mountain troops were accustomed to travelling quick and light and delivering a world of hurt as soon as they arrived on the objective. Mountain troops were elite infantry who did not care whether they travelled by truck or train or airplane.
 
I can dig up some numbers tonight. Otherwise I can say with confidence the losses of the airborne forces were comparable to the landing forces.

Beyond that the maximum number of aircraft were committed to the airborne operation. No more could be carried.

To reinforce Carl's point, the airborne forces in Normandy sustained approximately 30% casualties on D-Day. That was considered an overwhelming success, as the planners had assumed 70%. "Less risky" my fourth point of contact.

Airborne landings weren't and aren't intended to move a large body of troops into an opposed area, they were part of a combined arms operation intended to disrupt the German rear. Even today, with aircraft capable of carrying a lot more equipment and troops, the only real doctrinal role of mass parachute drops is to seize an airhead by which additional troops (preferably the kind who ride in metal and have big guns) and supplies can be brought in.
 
Last edited:
Top