The southern constitution was quite blunt about slavery. Specifically, you could not as a confederate state outlaw slavery in your state.ShadowCommunist2009 said:The population of slaves proves NOTHING about people's opinion of slavery, just as the population of "rebels" in Rwanda in 1994 proved nothing about the actual Tutsi rebellion against the Hutu power government, or the "total population" of traitors, wreckers, and counterrevolutionaries proved anything about how "lawless" the Soviet Union was under Stalin.
The abolitionist movement was gaining momentum in the South particularly because of the number of educated free-blacks in the decades leading up to the Civil War. The South (socially) was becoming more and more aware of the possibility that perhaps human "property" had some contribution to society.
And people do go to war over tariffs and states' rights. We did it in the French and Indian War and again in 1776.
Slavery wasn't the primary cause of the Civil War, nor was it the "dominant" idea behind the Confederacy. Read their constitution. The Confederacy's political structure was based on the idea of individual liberty for the states and greater autonomy for state legislatures. And if you look at the political situation in the United States before and after the Civil War, we had much greater political freedom at the state level than we ever had after the Civil War.
Lincoln ruled as a military dictator during the Civil War, and Reconstruction brought an end to states' rights because it imposed not only the law but the will of the federal government on the South which set the precedent that it could be done in the North. And here we are today.
Nonsense. Whoever told you that is a liar or just fantasizing.wkwillis said:The southern constitution was quite blunt about slavery. Specifically, you could not as a confederate state outlaw slavery in your state.
WFHermans said:Nonsense. Whoever told you that is a liar or just fantasizing.
ShadowCommunist2009 said:The abolitionist movement was gaining momentum in the South particularly because of the number of educated free-blacks in the decades leading up to the Civil War.
ShadowCommunist2009 said:Slavery wasn't the primary cause of the Civil War, nor was it the "dominant" idea behind the Confederacy.
joatsimeon@aol.com said:-- wrong. The South was becoming more and more convinced of the "Positive Good" theory; ie., that slavery was a positive good and should be spread everywhere.
-- I suggest you read the secession declarations of the Southern states. None of them mention anything else besides slavery. (And the horrors of potential black rapists lusting after the pure white women if slavery was abolished.)
Face it, the Confederacy was the Evil Empire, and the (justly) Lost Cause was a stench in the nostrils of decent men.
Well, the question is, in 1860 slavery was allowed in all the territories, by the Constitution according to the Dred Scott decision. The South still had enough votes to prevent a constitutional amendment. Everything they could reasonably was going for them on that issue, other than the election of a President who couldn't muster the votes necessary.... Surely this points to other issues being present.Geminonone said:Yet the need to deny this seems almost pathological amongst those who defend the CSA.If you are generous and give such people the benefit of the doubt that racism isnt the main motivation behind such support- what else could be?
Imajin said:.
As for saying black soldiers fought for the Confederacy being equivalent to denying that Nazi Germany slaughter 11 million completely innocent people for their race, um....
Gustav Anderman said:Constitution of the Confederate States of America
Section 9 (4)
4) No bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law denying or impairing the right of property in negro slaves shall be passed.
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_Confederate_States_of_America
Imajin said:Surely this points to other issues being present.
When has anyone used the arguement that, since there were confederate black soldiers, slavery wasn't wrong?Geminonone said:Both revisionist claims are made in the same spirit-to downplay what was done to the victim and to take blame away from the perpetrator.
Imajin said:When has anyone used the arguement that, since there were confederate black soldiers, slavery wasn't wrong?
You're combining the issues of the evil of slavery and that slavery was all the CSA was fighting for- why can't the two be separated?Geminonone said:Seriously right? The claim is cleary used by CSA apologists to suggest that if slavery was so bad and was all the the CSA was fighting for why would BLACK soliders fight for the CSA.
Imajin said:You're combining the issues of the evil of slavery and that slavery was all the CSA was fighting for- why can't the two be separated?
Imajin said:When has anyone used the arguement that, since there were confederate black soldiers, slavery wasn't wrong?
I have heard of one regiment(and only one)of Freedmen that was raised,but never saw service, it may have remained in state service as home guards.Also one of the Texas Cavalry reenactors claim thier regiment had Black enlisted men along side their "Mexican"and white soildersjoatsimeon@aol.com said:-- there weren't, in fact, Confederate black soldiers. There were black servants and laborers with the armies.
Proposals to raise black troops were raised but never actually put into effect, even at the end when the Confederacy was desperate.
joatsimeon@aol.com said:-- there weren't, in fact, Confederate black soldiers. There were black servants and laborers with the armies.
Proposals to raise black troops were raised but never actually put into effect, even at the end when the Confederacy was desperate.
joatsimeon@aol.com said:-- Face it, the Confederacy was the Evil Empire, and the (justly) Lost Cause was a stench in the nostrils of decent men.
joatsimeon@aol.com said:-- wrong. The South was becoming more and more convinced of the "Positive Good" theory; ie., that slavery was a positive good and should be spread everywhere.
joatsimeon@aol.com said:-- I suggest you read the secession declarations of the Southern states. None of them mention anything else besides slavery. (And the horrors of potential black rapists lusting after the pure white women if slavery was abolished.)
robertp6165 said:There certainly were demagogues who argued such a position...just as there were demagogues in the North who were burning the Constitution and calling for the utter extermination of white Southerners. These demagogues no more represented the people of the South as a whole than did those at the North.