Crisis in the Kremlin - Our 1982 USSR

If I were ever to make 2nd timeline, which one would you be most interested in?

  • 1. German Empire 1888

    Votes: 62 29.2%
  • 2. Russian Federation 1993

    Votes: 74 34.9%
  • 3. Red China 1949

    Votes: 37 17.5%
  • 4. Yugoslavia 1920

    Votes: 27 12.7%
  • 5. India 1947

    Votes: 28 13.2%
  • 6. alt-fascist Italy 1922

    Votes: 29 13.7%
  • 7. South Africa 1994

    Votes: 18 8.5%
  • 8. Germany 1990

    Votes: 20 9.4%
  • 9. Japan 2000

    Votes: 18 8.5%
  • 10. United Kingdom 1997

    Votes: 20 9.4%

  • Total voters
    212
  • Poll closed .
Development began in 1988, the soviet have the industrial capabilities, just like they also have said capabilities to develop steam catapults, which should be inested on after the Marshall gets out of the picture
For a level of situational awareness that is needed for a current day battlefield in the 80-ties? I don't think so. It's not the gun or armor I'm worried about, nor the drive train or similar. It's hunter-killer. You need a commander able to see threats and a gunner able to quickly engage them. For both you need vision. Neither will be there in a crewless turret. I'm not even convinced T-14 Armata has enough and that is a 2015 released design.

So Merkava IV, extreme crew survivability since the smaller army needs to compete with the US.
 
1. Vote on deal proposed by Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi
A) + C) Sell weapons and allow licence production of these

2. Redistribution of recovered/saved money and resources:
A) Soviet Space Program
B) Agriculture
E) Education
F) Light industry and production of consumer goods
in the order of importance listed
achievements in space are extremely prestigious, so if we want to influence non-interested states, this is one of the best ways + it seems, that we really doing something agains SDI.


3. Soviet strategy for potential conflict with NATO and China:
H) Conventional defensive stance agains NATO in Europe and nuclear offensive stance against China.

We doesn't need milions men against China. What we need is crypled China without any offensive possibilities against us. Chinese nuclear arsenal is relativly small in compare to ours so as their ICBM rockets numbers. So surprise nuclear attack agains their knowns rockets instalations and silos with cooperation to our anti-missile defense results to destroy their nuclear forces with zero or minimal damage on our side.
Then we should destroy their main armed forces and, under threat to destruction their main cities, force them to sign a peace according to our wishes.

And using nuclears forces ONLY agains China don't involve NATO to do same again us.
 

jparker77

Banned
1) A—- India will be a valuable counterbalance to China and Pakistan.

2) B, F, A— agriculture and consumer goods are areas previous administrations have neglected, and space tech is cool.

3) G—- the idea of occupying substantial chunks of China is absurd, so we should focus on the defensive there. Europe, on the other hand, poses substantial opportunities conventionally.

Also, @panpiotr, how are our proxies across the globe doing? The late 1970s and early 1980s still saw groups like the Red Army Faction very active I believe. Also, what is the current opinion of the Warsaw Pact member states towards the administration? Are there any countries more or less supportive of the current policies?
 
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1. Vote on deal proposed by Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi
A) Yes, this will be beneficial to USSR
B) No, it will lead only to increased tensions with the West and China
A
2. Redistribution of recovered/saved money and resources:
A) Soviet Space Program
B) Agriculture
C) Infrastructure
D) Healthcare
E) Education
F) Light industry and production of consumer goods
G) Other
C, D, and E
3. Soviet strategy for potential conflict with NATO and China:
a) Conventional offensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional defensive stance against China
b) Nuclear offensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional defensive stance against China
c) Nuclear offensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear defensive stance against China
d) Conventional defensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional offensive stance against China
e) Nuclear defensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional offensive stance against China
f) Nuclear defensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear offensive stance against China
g) Conventional offensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear defensive stance against China
D
 
1) A

2) I would say all of the above, especially to the space program because I love outer space shit. But right now B, C, F are the most important in the near term and can give them more revenues and all that to help spend on the rest.

3) G makes the most sense to me.
 
For a level of situational awareness that is needed for a current day battlefield in the 80-ties? I don't think so. It's not the gun or armor I'm worried about, nor the drive train or similar. It's hunter-killer. You need a commander able to see threats and a gunner able to quickly engage them. For both you need vision. Neither will be there in a crewless turret. I'm not even convinced T-14 Armata has enough and that is a 2015 released design.

So Merkava IV, extreme crew survivability since the smaller army needs to compete with the US.
@Belka DNW I found your suggestion is more valid then I thought. Apparently the designers were also not convinced by the lack of situational awareness of a remote controlled turret, hence they went more conventional later
Later version of Object 490A (was developed under "Boxer" program). In 1984-86, a new version of the layout of the Object 490A tank was developed in which the crew was placed according to the classical pattern. The gunner on the left and the commander on the right in the low-profile turret.


For the first time, the armament of the tank consisted of a 152 mm smoothbore gun.
From:
 
Results of the vote so far:
1. Vote on deal proposed by Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi
A) Yes, this will be beneficial to USSR 24 votes
B) No, it will lead only to increased tensions with the West and China 0 votes
C) Other 2 votes
2. Redistribution of recovered/saved money and resources:

A) Soviet Space Program 5 votes
B) Agriculture 18 votes
C) Infrastructure 13 votes
D) Healthcare 4 votes
E) Education 4 votes
F) Light industry and production of consumer goods 18 votes
G) Other 4 votes

3. Soviet strategy for potential conflict with NATO and China:

a) Conventional offensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional defensive stance against China 2 votes
b) Nuclear offensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional defensive stance against China 1 vote
c) Nuclear offensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear defensive stance against China 2 votes
d) Conventional defensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional offensive stance against China 4 votes
e) Nuclear defensive stance against NATO in Europe and conventional offensive stance against China 0 votes
f) Nuclear defensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear offensive stance against China 0 votes
g) Conventional offensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear defensive stance against China 14 votes
h) Other 3 votes
 
1) A—- India will be a valuable counterbalance to China and Pakistan.

2) B, F, A— agriculture and consumer goods are areas previous administrations have neglected, and space tech is cool.

3) G—- the idea of occupying substantial chunks of China is absurd, so we should focus on the defensive there. Europe, on the other hand, poses substantial opportunities conventionally.

Also, @panpiotr, how are our proxies across the globe doing? The late 1970s and early 1980s still saw groups like the Red Army Faction very active I believe. Also, what is the current opinion of the Warsaw Pact member states towards the administration? Are there any countries more or less supportive of the current policies?
As for proxies, USSR is still very actively supporting them in across Asia, Africa and South America. Personally, Romanov is not a fan of RAF, as he would like to draw Western Europe and West Germany in particular from the USA, but since Kohl supports Reagan's aggressive policy towards USSR, RAF has received increased support from USSR.

In the Eastern Bloc and the Warsaw Pact perception of Romanov and his administration is rather positive. The attitude goes as this:

East Germany - aside from conflict over Program for Renewal of Socialism, attitude is positive
Poland - cautious attitude
Czechoslovakia - rather positive attitude
Hungary - positive attitude
Romania - negative attitude, Ceausescu wants to maintain his independence
Bulgaria - very positive attitude
Albania - very negative, Hoxha hates Romanov
Yugoslavia - slowly getting better, trade between both countries is quickly growing however
China - hates USSR
North Korea - rather positive, but plays USSR and China against each other
Cuba - very good, Castro has a good opinion of Romanov and Kunaev
 
I'm not surprised about Albania since they're more pro-China so... yeah but glad to see the rest of the Eastern Bloc and Warsaw Pact (minus China and Romania) are positive towards Romanov and Kunaev.
 
I'm not surprised about Albania since they're more pro-China so... yeah but glad to see the rest of the Eastern Bloc and Warsaw Pact (minus China and Romania) are positive towards Romanov and Kunaev.
At this point Albania is even more anti-China than anti-USSR, Romanov perceives Hoxha as nutjob and for a good reason
 
At this point Albania is even more anti-China than anti-USSR, Romanov perceives Hoxha as nutjob and for a good reason
Ah ok, I wouldn't be surprise a nutjob like Hoxha managed to gain power... so we should deal with him before he attempts to screw Albania...
 
Chapter Five: Prepare for trouble and make it double (July - August 1983)
The Soviet leadership was more than happy to accept the deal proposed by Indira Gandhi. In return for modernization of the Indian Air Force, deployment of modern Soviet air-defence systems as well as anti-aircraft weapons to India, the Soviet-backed government in Afghanistan would receive political, diplomatic and humanitarian support from India. The humanitarian support would include: shipments of supplies, foodstuff, clothing, emergency vehicles, medicine and medical equipment, and financing of community soup kitchens. For additional diplomatic support on the forum of the Non-Aligned Movement, USSR offered the Indian government a license to build the newly introduced MiG 29A and the S-300 system, with the condition of sharing the cost of any future modernization of the platform for both the Soviet Union and India - dragging India into a Joint-Future-Development contract for the next decade, and as a quick action the modernization of Indian-built fighter bomber aircraft HF-24 Marut with more powerful engines and electronics and extensive modernization programme of MiG-21 in service of the Indian Air Force.

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(Soviet MiG 29A soon to be introduced to the Indian Air Force)

The deal, albeit secret, eventually became known to the USA and China. While Reagan's administration harshly criticized the Indian government for their rapprochement with USSR on the international stage, Washington decided not to use economic embargoes against India, as it would close all channels of communication with New Delhi and bring the actual Indo-Soviet alliance into reality. At the same time, a ceremony was held in Beijing, where leaders of China and Pakistan signed the Treaty of Good-Neighborliness and Friendly Cooperation between the People's Republic of China and the Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Deng Xiaoping stated that, "the Treaty of Good-Neighborliness and Friendly Cooperation between China and Pakistan consolidates the aspirations of the two peoples for lasting friendship for generations to come in the form of law and indicates that the all-weather friendship between China and Pakistan enters a new stage of development."

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(Deng Xiaoping - paramount leader of People's Republic of China)

China expressed in the treaty its respect for Pakistan's independence, sovereignty and territorial integrity and its support for Pakistan's efforts to settle peacefully problems with its neighboring countries. Both nations agreed not to join any alliance that infringes upon the sovereignty, security and territorial integrity of the other, nor will either allow its territory to be used by a third country to jeopardize the other party to the pact. Areas in which the two countries agreed to cooperate included fighting terrorism, separatism and extremism, as well as organized crime, illegal immigration and trafficking in drugs and weapons. The nations' security and military organizations would also step up cooperative efforts. Nevertheless, it was not the last word of Beijing as to put more pressure on the USSR, China with smaller input from the USA decided to increase support to Democratic Kampuchea in war against Soviet ally of Vietnam. The Chinese actions forced the USSR to increase its military and economic support to Vietnam.

General Secretary Romanov also made a decision on how to redistribute recently recovered money and resources. The decision was made to spend them on the most pressing issues, which included: development of infrastructure, agriculture, light industry and increased production of consumer goods. The main goals of the Soviet government were to: improve the living conditions for Soviet citizens, increase the wellbeing of the populace, development of the Soviet economy, increase of agricultural production, which would allow limiting the grain export of grain from the USA and to develop Soviet internal market. Romanov focused also and reduction of food spoilage, reduction of waiting lines, overall improvement of the rural economy as well as modernization and mechanization of the Soviet agriculture system.

In regard to overall Soviet strategy for a potential conflict between USSR and Warsaw Pact on the one side and NATO and China on the other, the Soviet leadership decided to adopt conventional offensive stance against NATO in Europe and nuclear defensive stance against China. The Soviet leadership quickly came to the conclusion that the Soviet Armed Forces would not be able to occupy China conventionally due to the sheer size of the country, nor do the USSR have the conventional ability to fight a two front war both in Europe and Asia at the same time. The new strategy would focus on conventional conflict with NATO in Europe, while preventing any Chinese offensives against the USSR or its allies in Asia with a prospect of nuclear exchange in such case, using enormous Soviet advantage over China in nuclear potential and technology.

Samantha-Smith-1.jpg

(Samantha Smith with a letter from General Secretary Romanov)

Amid very tense international relations between superpowers and other regional powers, an opportunity has arisen for USSR to improve its tarnished international image. When Grigory Romanov succeeded Leonid Brezhnev as leader of the Soviet Union in November 1982, the mainstream Western newspapers and magazines ran numerous front-page photographs and articles about him. Most coverage was negative and tended to give a perception of a new threat to the stability of the Western World. At the same time much international tension surrounded both Soviet and American efforts to develop weapons capable of being launched from satellites in orbit. Both governments had extensive research and development programs to develop such technology. However, both nations were coming under increasing pressure to disband the project. In the United States, President Ronald Reagan came under pressure from a lobby of U.S. scientists and arms experts, while in the Soviet Union the government issued a statement that read, "To prevent the militarization of space is one of the most urgent tasks facing mankind". At the time, large anti-nuclear protests were taking place across both Europe and North America, nevertheless The two superpowers had by this point abandoned their strategy of détente and in response to the deployment of cruise and Pershing II missiles from Reagan in Europe, the Soviet Union deployed its SS-20s.

In November 1982, a 10 year old girl - Samantha Smith, wrote to Soviet leader Grigory Romanov, seeking to understand why Soviet Union–United States relations were so tense:

"Dear Mr. Romanov,

My name is Samantha Smith. I am 10 years old. Congratulations on your new job. I have been worrying about Russia and the United States getting into a nuclear war. Are you going to vote to have a war or not? If you aren't please tell me how you are going to help to not have a war. This question you do not have to answer, but I would like it if you would. Why do you want to conquer the world or at least our country? God made the world for us to share and take care of. Not to fight over or have one group of people own it all. Please lets do what he wanted and have everybody be happy too.

Samantha Smith"


Her letter was published in the Soviet state-run newspaper Pravda. Smith was happy to discover that her letter had been published; however, she had not received a reply. She then sent a letter to Soviet ambassador to the United States Anatoly Dobrynin asking if Romanov intended to respond. On April 26, 1983, she received a response from Romanov. A media circus ensued, with Smith being interviewed by Ted Koppel and Johnny Carson, among others, and with nightly reports by the major American networks. On July 7, 1983, she flew to Moscow with her parents, and spent two weeks as Romanov's guest. During the trip she visited Moscow and Leningrad and spent time in Artek, the main Soviet pioneer camp, in the town of Gurzuf on the Crimean Peninsula.Later Smith wrote in her book that in Leningrad she and her parents were amazed by the friendliness of the people and by the presents many people made for them. Speaking at a Moscow press conference, she declared that the Russians were "just like us". In Artek, Smith chose to stay with the Soviet children rather than accept the privileged accommodations offered to her. For ease of communication, teachers and children who spoke fluent English were chosen to stay in the building where she was lodged. Smith shared a dormitory with nine other girls, and spent her time there swimming, talking and learning Russian songs and dances. While there, she made many friends, including Natasha Kashirina from Leningrad, a fluent English speaker. During a private meeting with Smith General Secretary Romanov discussed with her importance of international cooperation and understanding between United States and the Soviet Union. What is more, Romanov expressed his admiration for Smith's interest in current state of the world "as young people from around the globe are our future, and we must leave them the world in better state than we have received from previous generations". Smith's return to the U.S. on July 22, 1983, was celebrated by the people of Maine with roses, a red carpet, and a limousine and her popularity continued to grow in her native country. Some critics at the time remained skeptical, believing Smith was unwittingly serving as an instrument of Soviet propaganda.

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(Black July in Sri Lanka)

Just as the Soviet Union was once again perceived with more positive light thanks to the visit of Samantha Smith to USSR, a new front of struggle between USA and USSR has opened in Sri Lanka. Sri Lanka was 74.9 percent Sinhalese and 11.2 percent Sri Lankan Tamil. Within these two groups, Sinhalese tend to be Buddhist and Tamils tend to be Hindu, displaying significant linguistic and religious divisions. However, the strife between the grounds purportedly began much further back in Sri Lanka’s ancient settlement history. Though the Sinhalese people’s arrival in Sri Lanka is somewhat ambiguous, historians believe that the Tamils arrived on the island both as invaders and traders from India’s Chola Kingdom. These origin stories suggest that the Sinhalese and Tamil communities have experienced tension from the very beginning—not out of cultural incompatibility, but rather out of power disputes. In July 1983 the LTTE (Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam) launched a deadly ambush on Sri Lanka army patrol outside the town of Thirunelveli, killing an officer and 12 soldiers.Using nationalistic sentiments to their advantage, members of the ruling UNP party organized massacres and pogroms in Colombo, the capital, and elsewhere (known also as Black July). According to various sources 5,638 Tamils were massacred and 250,000 Tamils fled were displaced internally during Black July; majority of them fled Sinhala-majority areas. This is considered the beginning of the civil war.

Because of its location, conflict in Sri Lanka quickly attracted attention of regional powers and other important players on the international stage. The government of Sri Lanka has received an extended military, financial, diplomatic and economic support from China, Pakistan, United States and United Kingdom. Nevertheless, this brought reaction from Indian government, who feared an encirclement from hostile states including Pakistan in the West, China in the East, and potentially hostile Sri Lanka to the South. All of these facts prompted for a direct involment of India in the Sri Lankan civil war on the side of rebels. From August 1983 the Indian government, through its intelligence agency Research and Analysis Wing (RAW), provided arms, training and monetary support to six Sri Lankan Tamil militant groups including LTTE, Tamil Eelam Liberation Organization (TELO), People's Liberation Organisation of Tamil Eelam (PLOTE), Eelam Revolutionary Organisation of Students (EROS) Eelam People's Revolutionary Liberation Front (EPRLF) and Tamil Eelam Liberation Army (TELA). LTTE's rise is widely attributed to the initial backing it received from RAW. It is believed that by supporting different militant groups, the Indian government hoped to keep the Tamil independence movement divided and be able to exert overt control over it. Nonwithstanding, Indian help was not enought against combined commitment from China, UK, US and Pakistan, as the government forces were able to score number of victories over rebel forces, which forced them to seek support in Moscow. The LTTE was a self-styled national liberation organisation with the primary goal of establishing an independent Tamil state. Tamil nationalism was the primary basis of its ideology. LTTE claimed to strive for a democratic, secular state that is based on socialism. Its leader Velupillai Prabhakaran was influenced by Indian freedom fighters such as Subhas Chandra Bose.The organisation denied being a separatist movement and saw itself as fighting for self-determination and restoration of sovereignty in what it recognised as Tamil homeland.

Representatives of LTTE have arrived in Moscow to seek a meeting with General Secretary Romanov and other representatives of the Soviet leadership. From the very beginning both sides knew what they wanted from each other. LTTE's representatives asked for financial, military, diplomatic and economic support from USSR in order to fight back against Sri Lankan government. In exchange for support for Tamil independence and after gaining independence, LTTE promised to join the bloc of countries allied with the USSR, allow construction of military bases (including ports) for the Soviet Armed Forces, as well an access to natural resources and arable land located on their territories. Romanov and the Soviet leadership decided to think over all pros and cons of supporting LTTE in the Sri Lankan Civil War before giving a final answer.

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(Thomas Sankara - Africa's Che Guevara)

In the meantime, another opportunity presented itself for USSR to expand its influence in Africa. On 4 August 1983 a coup d'état was launched in the Republic of Upper Volta (Burkina Faso) in an event sometimes referred to as the August revolution or Burkinabé revolution. It was carried out by radical elements of the army led by Thomas Sankara and Blaise Compaoré, against the regime of Major Jean-Baptiste Ouédraogo. At the age of 33, Sankara became the President of the Republic of Upper Volta and launched social, ecological and economic programs and renamed the country from the French colonial name Upper Volta to Burkina Faso ('Land of Incorruptible People'), with its people being called Burkinabé ('upright people'). His foreign policies were centered on anti-imperialism, and he rejected aid from organizations such as the International Monetary Fund. Sankara welcomed foreign aid from other sources but tried to reduce reliance on aid by boosting domestic revenues and diversifying the sources of assistance. Now Sankara, known also as "Africa's Che Guevara" is now seeking a protection and patronage from USSR against former leadership and their French allies. On the side, Romanov thinks that Sankara ideologically is much closer to Maoism than to Marxism-Leninism, but can't deny the fact that USSR could always use a friendly country in Africa.
 
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1. Vote on Soviet involvement in the Sri Lankan Civil War
A) Yes, friendly state in the Indian Ocean would be great for us
B) No, we don't have to be involved everywhere
C) Support the rebels only through India

2. Vote on recognizing of Sankara's government
A) Yes, we must help fellow revolutionaries
B) No, we don't have to be involved everywhere
 
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1. Vote on Soviet involvement in the Sri Lankan Civil War
A) Yes, friendly state in the Indian Ocean would be great for us
B) No, we don't have to be involved everywhere

2. Vote on recognizing of Sankara's government
A) Yes, we must help fellow revolutionaries
B) No, we don't have to be involved everywhere
1c, we support India, as a deniable proxy
2b, until we have food to spare for their gold etc
 

TheSpectacledCloth

Gone Fishin'
1). C - This could give us an opportunity to establish a new naval base in the Indian Ocean, and we'd be able to station a mighty fleet there to further solidify our ties to India. If we pull this off, the Tamils would have to do everything we say, and we would gain a massive advantage in the geopolitical world. There is plenty of risk to this, but there is an overwhelming amount of reward to it as well.

2). A - This is a great opportunity to show the world that a nation doesn't need to rely on capitalism to survive and thrive. Additionally, we could deal the killing blow that the waning colonial empires and expose them for the vile bourgeoisie imperialists they really are. We can give them some of our aircraft in exchange for their precious natural resources. We have nothing to lose from this.
 
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1. Vote on Soviet involvement in the Sri Lankan Civil War
A) Yes, friendly state in the Indian Ocean would be great for us
B) No, we don't have to be involved everywhere
C) Support the rebels only through India
C) India's closer, let them take the lead.
2. Vote on recognizing of Sankara's government
A) Yes, we must help fellow revolutionaries
B) No, we don't have to be involved everywhere
A) much of Africa remains under European influence with America also interjecting themselves as well. A foothold in Western Africa could be useful.
 
1. Vote on Soviet involvement in the Sri Lankan Civil War
C) Support the rebels only through India

2. Vote on recognizing of Sankara's government
A) Yes, we must help fellow revolutionaries

This is the best way to tell the Indians and various African states that our words and promises matter.
 
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