If the Dauphin Louis Charles still die while imprisoned, Louis Antoine of Angouleme (the eldest son of Artois) will became King of France and he will as OTL marry his first cousin Marie Therese Charlotte, Madame Royale. If they still as OTL do not have children the next in line is his brother Charles Ferdinand of Berry. After them the next in line is the Duke of Orleans
If the Dauphin Louis Charles still die while imprisoned, Louis Antoine of Angouleme (the eldest son of Artois) will became King of France and he will as OTL marry his first cousin Marie Therese Charlotte, Madame Royale. If they still as OTL do not have children the next in line is his brother Charles Ferdinand of Berry. After them the next in line is the Duke of Orleans (the OTL Louis Philippe I assuming his father die on schedule). If Louis XVII, Angolume and Berry will all die and Egalitè survive is likely who he and his descendats will be excluded from the line of succession (he voted for the death of his cousin and King Louis XVI) for high treason and the Crown will go the next in lines aka the Condes followed by the Contis
If the Dauphin Louis Charles still die while imprisoned, Louis Antoine of Angouleme (the eldest son of Artois) will became King of France and he will as OTL marry his first cousin Marie Therese Charlotte, Madame Royale. If they still as OTL do not have children the next in line is his brother Charles Ferdinand of Berry. After them the next in line is the Duke of Orleans (the OTL Louis Philippe I assuming his father die on schedule). If Louis XVII, Angolume and Berry will all die and Egalitè survive is likely who he and his descendats will be excluded from the line of succession (he voted for the death of his cousin and King Louis XVI) for high treason and the Crown will go the next in lines aka the Condes followed by the Contis
Why would Egalité's descendants be more likely to be excluded from the succession in this timeline than in the actual one?
I was not talking only about Egalité's descendants, my scenario had two divergences with OTL:Why would Egalité's descendants be more likely to be excluded from the succession in this timeline than in the actual one?
I was not talking only about Egalité's descendants, my scenario had two divergences with OTL:
1) Louis XVI, Loius XVII, Provence, Artois, Angouleme and Berry all die before the Restauration
2) Philippe Egalité (aka the Duke of Orleans who was compromised with the Revolution and voted for the death of the King) is still alive and is the first in line... and likely blamed by almost all the French monarchists for the deaths of the royal family (Just one or two votes more for exile of Louis XVI instead of death and all the French royals captured by the jacobins will be escorted out of the France instead of being guillotined). You really think who the Congress of Vienna would put a such man on the French throne?
Excluding him you will exclude also his descendants so the next in line is Condè (but at this point the King of Rome, grandson of the Emperor of Austria, has real chances to stay on the throne)
Here he would have had a hand the execution of three royals, not just one. I can't see any of the surviving Bourbons being willing to extend any kind of olive branch to the rest of the Orléans line.
Technically the Bourbon-Espagne stand in front of the Bourbon-Orléans in the succession due to the Salic Law. So... No Orléanais Restoration.I was not talking only about Egalité's descendants, my scenario had two divergences with OTL:
1) Louis XVI, Loius XVII, Provence, Artois, Angouleme and Berry all die before the Restauration
2) Philippe Egalité (aka the Duke of Orleans who was compromised with the Revolution and voted for the death of the King) is still alive and is the first in line... and likely blamed by almost all the French monarchists for the deaths of the royal family (Just one or two votes more for exile of Louis XVI instead of death and all the French royals captured by the jacobins will be escorted out of the France instead of being guillotined). You really think who the Congress of Vienna would put a such man on the French throne?
Excluding him you will exclude also his descendants so the next in line is Condè (but at this point the King of Rome, grandson of the Emperor of Austria, has real chances to stay on the throne)
Pretty sure nobody is going to want a Franco-Spanish union. Including both the French and the Spanish if things go similar to OTL.Technically the Bourbon-Espagne stand in front of the Bourbon-Orléans in the succession due to the Salic Law. So... No Orléanais Restoration.
How do you even get there, though? I think Egalité's more or less a dead man if you have anything at all similar to the OTL Terror.
I also don't see why excluding Egalité would require excluding his son as well. The duc de Chartres didn't vote for the death of Louis XVI, why should he be passed over? Especially since the Condés are, in 1814, a 78 year old and his 58 year old son, with no prospect of an heir, while Chartres has a large and growing family. It strikes me as unthinkable that you pass over the vigorous 41 year old with the young, child-bearing wife in favor of the line doomed to imminent extinction.
Sure, there will be crazy Ultras who blame Chartres for his father's actions and don't want to accept him as King. But I don't see why they'll be relevant. Chartres and his father will be the only plausible candidates. And certainly the Russians and the British will look at both very seriously. The Prussians don't care who's on the throne, and the Austrians will push the King of Rome, but everyone else will still hate that.
I suppose Bernadotte also becomes a possibility in this scenario.
I can see several alternatives. If the whole family of the Bourbons is executed (save perhaps for Madame Royale) I think there will be a lot more sympathy for the (lone) survivor, who already in OTL was the "Orphan of the Temple", by all of Europe and by France itself post-Napoleon. In that case I CAN see salic law being overturned (heck the Allies could do what they wanted at that point) and Marie-Therese and her likely Habsburg husband (who is a good military leader and not likely to make the mistakes of Charles X) on the throne.
Also I can definitely see Louis-Phillipe d'Orleans. being given the throne. We know both he and his family (particularly his sister) are extremely ambitious and they were highly regarded by Alexander of Russia. Yes, Egalitie voted for Louis XVI's death, but even in OTL that was not held to L-P as much as his ursurpation of the young Henri V's rights when Charles X trusted him and made him Regent. In this case that never happens and L-P never personally betrayed the main branch of the Bourbons and the Legitimists who loathed him in OTL would rally to him.
Then there's the Bernadotte factor. I don't think it would be Bernadotte persay (he had already abjured Catholicism for the Swedish throne, no, so the monarchist base probably would not take to him) but the most capable (and traditional) of the Marshals might be a good pick. If the allies really wanted to experiment they could place the VERY young, OTL Charles II of Parma (who is unquestionably a Bourbon and descendant of Louis XIV) on the French throne with a capable Regency (controlled by the Allies/Talleyrand) in exchange for giving the Habsburgs complete control of Parma after Marie Louise's death.
Technically the Bourbon-Espagne stand in front of the Bourbon-Orléans in the succession due to the Salic Law. So... No Orléanais Restoration.
I know there was actual talk of Bernadotte in 1814 or 1815, so that wasn't just made up out of thin air. In this scenario, by the way, is there any possibility of the marriage of Louis Philippe d'Orléans with Madame Royal? The ages line up well, and Louis Philippe didn't marry OTL until 1810, so he's available. It would be an obvious move for the Orléans family, and makes as much sense for Madame as marrying Archduke Charles.
Philip V had renounced succession rights for himself and his descendants in the Treaty of Utrecht. There were, indeed, some people who didn't accept this, but I don't think their objects have any practical result in the actual context of the 1814-1830 period. Prior to the July Revolution, if the senior line dies out, Orléans is going to become king. A few Ultras might object, but there's no way the army and the Napoleonic officials accept Ferdinand VII or one of his brothers as King of France, to say nothing of great power objections.
How do you even get there, though? I think Egalité's more or less a dead man if you have anything at all similar to the OTL Terror.
I also don't see why excluding Egalité would require excluding his son as well. The duc de Chartres didn't vote for the death of Louis XVI, why should he be passed over? Especially since the Condés are, in 1814, a 78 year old and his 58 year old son, with no prospect of an heir, while Chartres has a large and growing family. It strikes me as unthinkable that you pass over the vigorous 41 year old with the young, child-bearing wife in favor of the line doomed to imminent extinction.
Sure, there will be crazy Ultras who blame Chartres for his father's actions and don't want to accept him as King. But I don't see why they'll be relevant. Chartres and his father will be the only plausible candidates. And certainly the Russians and the British will look at both very seriously. The Prussians don't care who's on the throne, and the Austrians will push the King of Rome, but everyone else will still hate that.
I suppose Bernadotte also becomes a possibility in this scenario.