Could Tsarist Russia survived without WWI?

Me and my friend were discussing Tsarist Russia and I felt that without the strains of military defeat and collapse of the home front in WWI that Russia would have been able to survive, that its problems could be dealt with.

He seems to think that the Tsarist regime was doomed to failure and would have collapsed without a catostropic event like WWI

So could Tsarist Russia have survived without WWI happening?
 

HJ Tulp

Donor
I'm pretty sure it will. Russia was modernizing it's military, industry and infrastructure like mad with the help of the French and British capital. This is one of the reasons the Germans thought that war was inevitable and should happen as soon as possible.
 
Well I suppose the first question is what exactly you mean when you say Tsarist Russia? If that includes a lessening of the Tsar's autocratic powers and a move towards an elected Duma with him as some sort of constitutional monarch then it's fairly doable. Even a setup where democracy comes in but he keeps a bit more power and influence than a typical constitutional monarchy that we normally think of nowadays might be possible, sustaining an autocratic government however I think is pretty much impossible.
 
Well I suppose the first question is what exactly you mean when you say Tsarist Russia? If that includes a lessening of the Tsar's autocratic powers and a move towards an elected Duma with him as some sort of constitutional monarch then it's fairly doable. Even a setup where democracy comes in but he keeps a bit more power and influence than a typical constitutional monarchy that we normally think of nowadays might be possible, sustaining an autocratic government however I think is pretty much impossible.

I'm thinking either an Autocratic regime or a CM in line with the powers of Kaiser Wilhelm II pre WWI
 
Then no, not after 1905, not after the Russo-Japanese war. Tensions will keep increasing, war or not, it will just be slower.

Or it must be a police state. Make the army the backbone of Russia. If conscription is a succes it can become a center for nationalistic propaganda. However the GDP must not be to bad or the people will revolt anyway or make there life so miserable only idiots think of a revolt.
 
I'm thinking either an Autocratic regime or a CM in line with the powers of Kaiser Wilhelm II pre WWI


Yeah Impossible after 1905 however in my TL I started in 1880s and now it's 1907 and we have a stable and prospourous Russia with Michael II as Tsar. What happened was in 1881 when Tsar Alexander II was assasinated the assasin killed Nicky as well... Then the family died in when in 1888 the imperial train crashed during the great Borki train crash and Michael lived, then I had him become emperor as survivor, right now 1907 Michael is loved by his people dearly, plus he seized absoulute power because in 1906 he purged many generals, nobles, advisors, anyone who did t agree with his policies and those in power were killed.. Read the tl it's good, although I accidently called it Tsar Nicolas I dies all hail Michael I I messed up big time but the tl is under that thread title.....:):)
 
It could have survived, it could have not. Nothing is inevitably. However, a regime as uncomfortable and ineffective as that of Nicholas II after 1905 couldn't last indefinitely. It's end, however, need not mean a revolution and a republic (though it could). If a better tsar takes over in time, reform is possible; otherwise, there is my old chestnut about the army and the Black Hundreds jointly taking power and leaving a figurehead tsar in place, which was alluded to earlier in the thread.

In short, yes, but it doesn't have to.
 
What really should be asked, is how long WW1 could have been averted. Some sort of clash between Germany, it's allies and the rest of Europe were inevitable; whether it came in 1900, 1914, 1915 or 1930 or later. Of course, with latter World War I the tsarist state might be able to reform and become strong enough to weather a war with Germany or whatever nation or combination of nations it would have face in an alternate World War I.
 
What really should be asked, is how long WW1 could have been averted. Some sort of clash between Germany, it's allies and the rest of Europe were inevitable; whether it came in 1900, 1914, 1915 or 1930 or later.

Nothing is inevitable until my catchphrase becomes worn out. Which is never. :p

Now, a clash much like WW1 happening in 1915 is certainly plausible, even likely. But since the German general staff specifically wanted to fight Russia before 1916, we have to assume that, for at least a little while as people's view of the balance of power adjusts, nobody will be too keen to start a general war in the period from 1916 over the next few years.

And then what? What is Russia gets so strong, and so lucky with regards to the Ottomans, that the Entente and Germany find themselves co-operating to address the shennanigans of the troublemaking Russo-Italian axis?

Even if you think that a big war in Europe was "inevitable" (I don't), the existence of "Germany and its allies" in any recognisable shape cannot be taken for granted.
 

yourworstnightmare

Banned
Donor
The Russians would be forced to conduct political and social reforms though. The Aristocratic absolute monarchy of the Czars could not survive, but the Russian Empire could.
 
Me and my friend were discussing Tsarist Russia and I felt that without the strains of military defeat and collapse of the home front in WWI that Russia would have been able to survive, that its problems could be dealt with.

He seems to think that the Tsarist regime was doomed to failure and would have collapsed without a catostropic event like WWI

So could Tsarist Russia have survived without WWI happening?

Tsarist Russia would've gone the way of the dinos eventually...........the Bolsheviks were just gaining too much support and the czars weren't exactly national heroes anymore, either.
 
the Bolsheviks

In 1914 the Bolsheviks were a radical minority in the Russian left wing, never mind Russian society as a whole. Lenin spent his time writing screeds in exile, Stalin robbed banks, and Trotsky was a Viennese curiosity with Menshevik tendencies.

I certainly regard leftist revolution in a Tsarist Russia that avoids the war as plausible, but it wouldn't be Bolshevik. That's like saying Imperial Germany's parliamentary majority were Spartacists.
 
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