Could the United States do a complete re-organization of its administrative divisions? (like the 13 Commonwealths from Fallout)

[athgtq16129]

Please note that I am not referring to the US creating new states, or partitioning states, I mean a (somewhat) complete overhaul of all of its administrative divisions in the whole country.

The Fallout universe is set in an alternate TL which diverged from ours around 1945, some 24 years after the POD in 1969, the United States reorganized itself into 13 Commonwealths (looking at it now, it is a pretty ugly layout that could have been done better), sadly we do not know a lot about how the 13 Commonwealths in Fallout actually worked, since the lore talks very little about them, however, it is known that they were an "intermediate government between state and federal", and that the pre-existing states were not abolished, Commonwealths were just put on a level above states.

I should mention that since this layout above is ugly as sin, people have made their own head-canon interpretations of the 13 Commonwealths, such as this one:

https://www.deviantart.com/mobiyuz/art/Far-more-sensible-Fallout-Commonwealths-760572031

I am fascinated with re-organizing administrative divisions of countries, and I am also very into the pre-War lore of Fallout, so I was wondering if there is any possibility if something similar (but not identical, given how ugly it is) to the 13 Commonwealths in Fallout could have been applied to the US in our timeline.

1. What would be the reason for the US to do this?

2. How would this proceeding begin, and when would it be finished?

3. What would be its aftermath, and how would the country react to it?

4. Could it last forever?

5. Your scenario it of course does not requires 13 new administrative divisions, it can be as many or as less as you wish, and how much it would make sense.

This scenario can be similar to Fallout in the sense that the US states are not abolished, they continue existing but are surpassed by a different kind of administrative division, since I realize how near impossible it would be to abolish the pre-existing US states, bonus in the POD is after 1945, much like Fallout itself.

To the mods: for most that I cite Fallout a lot in here, this is not a fandom scenario related to the series at all, just asking if something similar that in the lore of the game could be applied to real life, repeating, we have very little information about the supposed 13 Commonwealths in the game, as far as I recall this map above comes from Van Buren, a cancelled and non-canon Fallout game, I want to know what the proceedings to doing something like this in real life would be.

 

[DocJamore]

For this system to realistically have any teeth the states would have to vote yes on a constitutional amendment giving up their own power to these commonwealths. Of course, realistically the states would never give up their own power in that sort of way which is why a lot of fiction (including the Fallout series) just ignores the “how” of it happened just says it “did” and proceeds with the effects of that. Which I am personally fine with, plausibility can slide so long as the story is fun.

In theory, a constitutional amendment could be passed that changes the ratification process of constitutional amendments or it could change its own ratification process however it wants. An amendment could say that it wants approved as a public referendum instead of by the states and that would supersede the old ratification process. Or it could say that it applies automatically and it doesn’t need to be ratified. This would be utterly undemocratic and would be completely against all precedent in American history since its foundation but the Fallout Universe was pretty dystopian so I’ll let plausibility slide for a fun story to happen.

 

[Deleted member 90949]

My headcanon for Fallout is that the commonwealth system was implemented after a civil war resulting in centralists taking over the Federal government. There was no political will to resist after years of civil war. The US is a de-facto unitary state, with commonwealth heads being appointed by Washington.

 

[Riain]

I saw a YouTube video about this general subject and the USGS watersheds map looked like a pretty good way to divide up the CONUS into rational areas.

However I think if the US were to reorganize it would be because having such a big country doesn't make practical sense any more and as such the US will reorganize into units that revolve around the practicality of transport. Some of these, particularly in the East would be big due to the navigable waterways but others like in the southwest would be small.

 

[RanulfC]

I saw a YouTube video about this general subject and the USGS watersheds map looked like a pretty good way to divide up the CONUS into rational areas.

However I think if the US were to reorganize it would be because having such a big country doesn't make practical sense any more and as such the US will reorganize into units that revolve around the practicality of transport. Some of these, particularly in the East would be big due to the navigable waterways but others like in the southwest would be small.

Arguably possible (linked map below) but there's WAY more than 13 regions kind of for a reason And in context you'd have to break it up in a way that population likely more than geography was the key. Missouri, Pac-North-West and the Great Basin are all lower population zones than say California or the mid-Atlantic regions. ) ) As it is the "official regions" of the US (according to the census bureau) is divided into four (4) while the Bureau of Economic Analysis breaks it up into eight (8) so first you have to get an agreement on what constitutes a 'region'. Good luck with that

Attached is a link to an article "The 11 Nations of the United States" which likely shows a better division of the US by culture and outlook. (And you thought the Fallout map was bonkers) Can't upload it the forum says the file is too large but also keep in mind it includes most of Canada as well a lot of Mexico.

As to 'how' you have to look at the US "need" for representation as that's what the 'states' are supposed to represent. Reorganization would require convincing both the States and their populations, (which after all are NOT the same thing ) that by doing so they get some major benefit out of it. Realistically, (ya I know video game but hey game backgrounds are ideally supposed to have SOME basis in reality ) adding another layer of government would have little or no benefit to the States or the population but maybe extending the wartime "patriotism" gives it some kind of boost with the 'threat' of China driving things more than the threat of the USSR did OTL.

Randy

 

[Enigmajones]

This occurred in It Can’t Happen Here by the Corpo government.

 

[athgtq16129]

This occurred in It Can’t Happen Here by the Corpo government.

It is this one, right?

Some interesting comment from where it was posted in (reddit):

For those who haven't read the book, it's a thinly-veiled roman-a-clef about how Huey Long wins the presidency over FDR (who splits the democratic vote). Huey Long (or "Buzz Windrip") promises lots of redistribution, but he also brings some militarist thugs into power.He forces a number of constitutional amendments that un-check presidential power, including castrating Congress and abolishing the states in favor of top-down administrative provinces (seen here).

After some twists and turns, an analogue for Douglas MacArthur siezes the presidency in a coup. He cuts off most of the redistribution and starts a war with Mexico. This finally breaks the back of the new regime, and the country descends into civil war (but not regional, as the map suggests).

Edit: For those who are complaining about the boundaries, that's a key point in the book. Windrip tears up the checks and balances of the constitution, but the thing that makes Americans really mad is when he abolishes state identities. These boundaries frustrate people within the book, and they make it easier for Windrip's "corpo" (corporatist) thugs to divide and conquer the population.

And also this one:

One of the first maps I've seen where Texas isn't still Texas

That or in the case of Fallout itself where Texas becomes its own commonwealth, and Arkansas is the only other state to join it, because reasons.

realistically the states would never give up their own power in that sort of way which is why a lot of fiction (including the Fallout series) just ignores the “how” of it happened just says it “did” and proceeds with the effects of that.

We know almost nothing about the 20th century in the Fallout lore, in fact the 13 Commonwealths being established is the most important thing that occurred in the Fallout universe's 20th century, some kind of Vietnam war where the US directly declared war on Vietnam also occurred around that same time period.

That said, you're still right, Fallout does not explains how a lot of how weird stuff could have feasibly happened, even if it's not realistic at all, like China somehow invading Alaska and annexing multiple of its neighbors, ultimately, Fallout was not created by geopolitical experts or political theorists the same applies to almost every single work of fiction who dabbles in alternate history or some massive geopolitical happenings, and I am also not a geopolitical expert nor a political theorist that qualified to give my "lessons" to the creators behind Fallout's fantastic world and stories.

 

[Citycat]

I like these administrative divisions. It actually looks more logical and practical than OTL reality.

 

[Twin City Lines]

Realistically, for "administrative regions" like the OP suggests would require a complete change in the interpretation of the Constitutional relationship between the states and the Federal government, and possibly an amendment to the Constitution. There's really no pressing reason why this would seem to be necessary to good government.

That said, we do have regional divisions in the United States for limited purposes, such.as the 12 Federal Reserve districts, or the 10 postal divisions based on the first digit of ZIP Codes. There are four Census divisions, basically Northeast, Southeast, Midwest, and West. There are probably others I haven't thought of yet, but as I'm on my way to bed (12:40 AM CDT), I'll just leave that for now.

One of the few things where regional divisions would actually be useful would be if the US tried to adopt proportional representation for the House of Representatives. Some states are so small as to have only one Representative, which would render PR moot in those states if districts can't cross state lines. However, states are unlikely to consent to losing their sovereign identity in such a way.

 

[Whiteshore]

What about a fascist or socialist takeover of the country? Could that be a good POD for that?