Could the Third Reich have been more successful than OTL?

Is Germany doing any better in WWII plausible?


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If Hitler had not taken control of the german army. NAZIs would have won WW2.
No, I will let others inform you of your error in more detail but after June 22 1941 the Nazi's could get a draw at most and December 11th 1941 they were gone
 
Even if the Soviets got the bomb in time to use it in a war against Germany, it'd take a long time to build up a decisive number of them. Russia isn't like the UK, which can sit tight in its island fortress and nuke Germany into submission at its leisure: a Russian-German war will be settled on the ground with convention arms.

I think we are also under-estimating what Germany could squeeze out of Europe in terms of material and manpower, from France, Italy, occupied Poland, etc, etc.
 
Given the way Germans ran their empire, it is remarkable how well they did in getting resources out of it.

But Germany lost hugely because of the level of corruption, theft, sabotage that was going on in its plants. There are stories that Germany kept going and had tremendous production levels even despite the bombings and etc. I think folks are reading too much into production reports, which had to be passed to a higher authority which would shoot you if they didn't get the paper numbers they wanted. So at every level numbers were fudged.
 
Even if the Soviets got the bomb in time to use it in a war against Germany, it'd take a long time to build up a decisive number of them.

The Germans can not just shrug off the damage that they will start taking if the Soviets gain the ability to obliterate their war industries far more rapidly then even the most successful conventional bombing campaign.

I think we are also under-estimating what Germany could squeeze out of Europe in terms of material and manpower, from France, Italy, occupied Poland, etc, etc.
No more then what they got historically which, if you will recall, was not enough. Particularly given that a good portion of that manpower will be inaccessible for ideological reasons that, unlike OTL, will not be sidelined out of necessity.

If the Germans attack the Soviets in 1945, they'll find the Red Army more then ready to beat whatever potential force they could scrounge up by then to a bloody pulp and then some.
 
Many things would have to happen....

1) The Luftwaffe would have to continue to bomb British factories instead of switching to bombing their cities

2) Larger production of U Boats earlier in the war

3) No halt order in Dunkirk, capturing the BEF

4) Better coordination with Japan and Italy, keep Italy out of the quagmire in N. Africa and Greece until after the Soviets and British are defeated...Having Japan delay their attack of the Soviet Union from 1939 to 1941...if the entire Axis military machine was directed at Russia all at once....it would have been different

5) Reaching and taking Moscow in 1941 is critical

6) Developmet of the Me262, Wasserfall Rockets, Stg44 etc needs to happen slightly sooner

7) Convincing (Threating) Francos Spain to join the war

8) Keeping America out of it as long as possible, Victory in Russia and England is critical before fighting America....its Germanys only hope....IMHO there is no possible way Germany could have defeated America so this is by far the most important

9) Germany also could have put women in the factories, freeing up men to fight in the front lines, if the Nazis wernt racist they could have used the jews to fight as well...
 
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Dorozhand

Banned
~a POD that removes the lend-lease act?

~Hitler not mucking about and expending the Luftwaffe on Britain, and instead building up his resources for a focused attack on the USSR (earlier).

~Sweden joins Finland in the winter war, Finland does better. When the continuation war starts the Finno-Swedish forces aid the Germans enough to take Leningrad (combine this with the above scenarios and this gets rather interesting).

~Rommel on the eastern front at any point will help.

~Hitler doesn't order Rommel to cease his advance in Egypt. Rommel takes Cairo, and then the Suez. Hitler declares the campaign in Africa a success. Rommel is transferred to the East. The Afrikakorps fights with the 6th army at Stalingrad....

~Whites win the Russian Civil War. Far Right in Germany still takes over. Invades Alt-Poland, and France. Quickly defeats Russia, turns attention to England....

A POD in which India revolts from the British Empire during WWI. British come back with a vengance, unable (and unwilling) to retake the colony after a bloody war. India sides with Alt-Nazi Germany....


just ideas.
 
OK, now a lend-lease can only be removed if US is totally disinterested in the fate of Europe. I can't imagine that being the case. France and Britain were more significant to US economy and besides friendly powers. That USA would allow them to go under without an attempt to help is very unlikely.

On the second point well I just say no. Hitler had to attempt to subdue Britain or it will bite him on the a*s sooner or later. No BoB means Britain bites sooner.

Why would Sweden take part in Continuation war? They were not directly threatened. If they would have decided to directly help Finns in Winter war it would be to defend. They would not attack or at least would be unlikely to attack.

Knowing Rommel, he'd be in Siberia before you could say 'Herr general you went too far behind the lines'.

Hitler ordered Rommel to stop advance? :confused: When? I never heard of it. He may have ordered him to stop retreat in 1942, something Hitler tended to do. But to stop attack? Rommel attacked even when it was beyond his ability to pursue attack, so no. Just no.

The point on Whites being victorious is so full of butterflies that WW2 would be absolutely unrecognizable.

India siding with Germany? To what purpose?
 
~a POD that removes the lend-lease act?

~Hitler not mucking about and expending the Luftwaffe on Britain, and instead building up his resources for a focused attack on the USSR (earlier).

~Sweden joins Finland in the winter war, Finland does better. When the continuation war starts the Finno-Swedish forces aid the Germans enough to take Leningrad (combine this with the above scenarios and this gets rather interesting).

~Rommel on the eastern front at any point will help.

~Hitler doesn't order Rommel to cease his advance in Egypt. Rommel takes Cairo, and then the Suez. Hitler declares the campaign in Africa a success. Rommel is transferred to the East. The Afrikakorps fights with the 6th army at Stalingrad....

~Whites win the Russian Civil War. Far Right in Germany still takes over. Invades Alt-Poland, and France. Quickly defeats Russia, turns attention to England....

A POD in which India revolts from the British Empire during WWI. British come back with a vengance, unable (and unwilling) to retake the colony after a bloody war. India sides with Alt-Nazi Germany....


just ideas.

-If Robert Taft were elected in 1940, not only is no lend lease possible, but probable...Taft wanted nothing to do with wars
 
~a POD that removes the lend-lease act?

~Hitler not mucking about and expending the Luftwaffe on Britain, and instead building up his resources for a focused attack on the USSR (earlier).

~Sweden joins Finland in the winter war, Finland does better. When the continuation war starts the Finno-Swedish forces aid the Germans enough to take Leningrad (combine this with the above scenarios and this gets rather interesting).

~Rommel on the eastern front at any point will help.

~Hitler doesn't order Rommel to cease his advance in Egypt. Rommel takes Cairo, and then the Suez. Hitler declares the campaign in Africa a success. Rommel is transferred to the East. The Afrikakorps fights with the 6th army at Stalingrad....

~Whites win the Russian Civil War. Far Right in Germany still takes over. Invades Alt-Poland, and France. Quickly defeats Russia, turns attention to England....

A POD in which India revolts from the British Empire during WWI. British come back with a vengance, unable (and unwilling) to retake the colony after a bloody war. India sides with Alt-Nazi Germany....


just ideas.

-The USA will regard Britain and France as important trading partners, and was unnerved at the prospect of a British surrender and the Germans taking their fleet.

-If Hitler doesn't expend the Luftwaffe on Britain, then the UK recovers more quickly, unleashes the Strategic Bombers, and has more airforce to use in the rest of the world.

-Even as skilled a general as Rommel can only do so much with a poor logistics train, as he demonstrated by ignoring it (to his cost) in Egypt. The Afrika Korps never had the ability to supply itself all the way to Cairo. Similarly, whilst Rommel was capable, one man isn't going to be able to singlehandedly turn the Eastern front around in the face of Soviet numerical superiority and increasing skill at using it. Especially with, again, German logistical issues.

-Why is the German far right going to take over in Germany when there is no Bolshevik menace for the people to fear? And, even if it does, why will it more rapidly defeat Russia than it did in our timeline?

-Why is India going to revolt against the British Empire in WWI? The problems only really began afterwards with the dissapointing Government of India Act of 1919 angering the INC.
 
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