Confederate Expansion

If the CSA holds, which of these places does it annex?


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So most Southern Victory TL's have the CSA expanding its grasp, usually into Latin America and sometimes Africa. Which of these places, if any, are likely annexations for the CSA?

(poll coming soon)
 
none, there lucky to have what they got. They would either get a Pacific port and Arizona territory from U.S.A.

Or they could risk war with mexico and take Sonora. Either way both are ASB or close to it. The Confederates are staying put
 
Realistically, Cuba would be the biggest, though I could see some small islands being bought ala the sale of the Danish Virgin Islands.

If they stay racist for along while but get rid of slavery I could see a Liberia-like colony being established, though it would only be a colony for a short time as otherwise would defeat the whole purpose of it.
 
At the minimum, I could see the Confederacy buying the Danish West Indies or Guyana or something.

But otherwise, I doubt that Cuba would be annexed; they'd tolerate CSA rule even less than Spanish rule and would probably revolt again. Maybe a puppet state.
 
Why should a CSA with much less industry & population than the USA conquer large areas?

Even Spain and Mexico have a real chance to beat them.
And if not the European powers intervent and fuck them.
 
Why should a CSA with much less industry & population than the USA conquer large areas?
The same reason that the United States expanded across the continent, IE Manifest Destiny, that and for economic and security reasons and for prestige.
 
I predict Mexico celebrating after regaining some international respect following a victory against the CSA when the USA turns it into a two fronted war. Seriously why would the USA just sit there and let the CSA grow?!?
 
They had the desire, at least; even in 1861 they were making plans for expansion into Latin America, though taking all of S. America is of course ASB.
 
The same reason that the United States expanded across the continent, IE Manifest Destiny, that and for economic and security reasons and for prestige.
I was meaning how could

Sorry

And this is slightly different from expanding across a empty (save for natives) continent, as all of this territory (save African colonies) would have to be conquered from internationaly recognized states.
 
None are very likely. An independent Confederacy would have enough problems handling yeomen dissenters, blacks (who obviously will not love the regime very much) and the potential of another war with the United States while grappling with the problem of the large army required to deal with the latter two issues to bother with expanding elsewhere.
 
The only reasonable thing I could think of would be northern Mexico being sold to them while Maximilian has French backing. Southern victory in the Civil War would have killed the Monroe doctrine, so I could picture France backing Maximilian longer. And the Republic of the Rio Grand was culturally similar to Texas, so I could picture Maximilian giving that to the Confederacy as well.

But Beyond that? The CSA would have to fight against opponents they could not beat without Northern Industry.
 
I say none. The whole expansionist CSA thing here is a cliche that annoys me to no end. Everyone does it with very, very little reason beyond "that's what Turtledove/everyone else did" or "I like big CSA on a map". Real life politics and whatnot are not decided by the fancies of AH authors or what looks "cool" on a map. The CSA was very poor, if they won they'd remain quite poor and unable to buy very much, simply put. They might have been on friendly terms with Maxi's regime but that doesn't mean there'll always be a Mexican Empire nor does it mean they'll always hand them chunks of land.
 
One thing people aren't considering is aside from Spain, all the European colonial powers in the Caribbean had abolished slavery by 1865 (the Dutch had only two years prior however). I think it would have caused an international uproar during the period if a power which had abolished slavery sold one of their possessions to a nation which still had the practice in place - even if guarantees were put in place none of the current residents would be re-enslaved.

After slavery is abolished, it may be another matter of course. But then the real impetus for new colonies falls to the wayside anyway, and I doubt the CSA would want to take on even more black subjects.
 
I disagree with most posters. If the CSA wins, it's far more likely that Max remains Emperor in Mexico. If things go poorly for Max and his French backers, then they might want to sell some land to make some quick cash. Or if Mexico collapses, the land can simply be taken. Otherwise, non-government supported filibusters took control of parts of Central America IOTL, so if similar filibusters were supported by the CSA itself, they'd logically meet with more success. I agree with the idea that the CSA was poor, but it was also very expansionist. The slaveholders wanted more lands to spread slavery, and with the Monroe Doctrine in shambles due to French Mexico and no Northern doves to stop them, I could see government supported filibusters taking control of lands in Central America, Mexico, or the Caribbean.
 
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