Cold War - Fascism vs Communism vs Democracy

Ice-Titan

Banned
What if Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union had remained allies during WW2 and decide to split Eurasia between them? With Nazi Germany invading North Africa and parts of the Middle East and the Soviet Union invading Korea and North China. What would the post war situation look like? Especially if the United States dose not get in involved? Say that Nazi Germany and the USSR both develop nuclear weapons and can not go to war with each other and instead end up in a cold war. How will a three way cold war look like? Fascism lead by Nazi Germany, Communism lead by the Soviet Union and Democracy lead by the United States. Who will join who? Who will win? How would things look like today? Society? Polticals? Technology?

I have an idea in my head and its some like this.
TWCW.png

TWCW.png
 
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Up until the 1970s we had something like this. Remember Portugal and Spain were both fascists until that point.
 
What if Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union had remained allies during WW2 and decide to split Eurasia between them? With Nazi Germany invading North Africa and parts of the Middle East and the Soviet Union invading Korea and North China. What would the post war situation look like? Especially if the United States dose not get in involved? Say that Nazi Germany and the USSR both develop nuclear weapons and can not go to war with each other and instead end up in a cold war. How will a three way cold war look like? Fascism lead by Nazi Germany, Communism lead by the Soviet Union and Democracy lead by the United States. Who will join who? Who will win? How would things look like today? Society? Polticals? Technology?

I have an idea in my head and its some like this.
View attachment 51976
Neutral Switzerland....
 

Ice-Titan

Banned
I mean an actual power struggle between ideologies and there super power backers. Spain and Portugal where not exporting fascism to the world, they where not super powers in a cold war with the Soviet Union or the US, they where for the most part behind the US.
 
Why does Nazi Germany always keep Alsace?

Anyway, the obvious answer is that, assuming we don't die in nuclear war, the US wins.
 

Ice-Titan

Banned
Why does Nazi Germany always keep Alsace?

Didn’t they already annex it in 1940? Why would they not keep it?

Anyway, the obvious answer is that, assuming we don't die in nuclear war, the US wins.

I don’t know. The Soviet Union will be less likely to collapse, simply because Germany is next store and they never lost 20,000,000 people in a war with Germany, so they‘ll be stronger. Germany could also “liberalize” some what after Hitler die’s and fix there broken education system, making it a deadly long term enemy. I am not a believer in the chosen/invincibility status of the US, the US will be less powerful with the Soviet Union and Germany being stronger because they never fought a war with each other.
 
Didn’t they already annex it in 1940? Why would they not keep it?

I meant to say France; your map shows it as part of whatever rules France.

I am not a believer in the chosen/invincibility status of the US, the US will be less powerful with the Soviet Union and Germany being stronger because they never fought a war with each other.

It has nothing to do with chosen/invincibility of the US; a democratic Europe would outperform a fascist or Communist America.
 

ninebucks

Banned
I don't really think the Nazis and the Soviets would be able to keep away from each others' throats. Maybe some other post-Weimar Rightist German regime, but not the Nazis.

Another thing: how is Fascism, (an ideology that is based on the idea that the strong should conquer and oppress the weak, and is often extremely racist), supposed to export itself to the Third World? I mean, there's political oppurtunitism, but surely the Nazi-backed African warlords will realise that their paymasters would rather they were all dead.

This isn't a criticism of this scenario, just generally about Fascist Cold War Blocs in TLs.
 
Have a different form of fascism take root. Extreme Catholic corporatism/clericalism. Italy, Spain, Portugal, Latin America, pre-Anschluss Austria can get behind it. Race doesn't become as big a problem- Franco had an elite guard of Moors, after all. Heck, it might not even be anti-Semitic.

You just have to replace National Socialism and the historical Hitler.
 

Ice-Titan

Banned
I meant to say France; your map shows it as part of whatever rules France.

It’s a small map and I am on a lap top.

It has nothing to do with chosen/invincibility of the US; a democratic Europe would outperform a fascist or Communist America.

Or like how a democratic France out did a Fascist Germany. I am not a believer in the chosen status of Democracy ether, everything depends on circumstances, people don’t win just because there democratic.

I don't really think the Nazis and the Soviets would be able to keep away from each others' throats. Maybe some other post-Weimar Rightist German regime, but not the Nazis.

It doesn’t have to be the Nazis, it doesn’t even have to be Germany. That map was just an idea I had, my real question was about a three way cold war between fascism-democracy-communism and how it would affect things.

Another thing: how is Fascism, (an ideology that is based on the idea that the strong should conquer and oppress the weak, and is often extremely racist), supposed to export itself to the Third World?

Third world people cannot be extremely militaristic and racist?

I mean, there's political oppurtunitism, but surely the Nazi-backed African warlords will realise that their paymasters would rather they were all dead.

The only Nazi back regime I had was South Africa, I would not consider that an African warlord state. Plus how many Russians fought for the ROA, how many more would have volunteered if Hitler let them sooner?

Have a different form of fascism take root. Extreme Catholic corporatism/clericalism. Italy, Spain, Portugal, Latin America, pre-Anschluss Austria can get behind it. Race doesn't become as big a problem- Franco had an elite guard of Moors, after all. Heck, it might not even be anti-Semitic.

Nope doesn’t have to be racists or anti-Semitic, contrary to popular belief not all fascist states and movements where racists and anti-Semitic.
 
There is no chance of the US staying out once anyone started meddling in the Western Hemisphere. All of South America is either democratic or a junta backed by the US.

It's also very doubtful that the British Empire can survive if Hitler and Stalin are genuine allies.:(
 
It’s a small map and I am on a lap top.

I'm joking.

Or like how a democratic France out did a Fascist Germany. I am not a believer in the chosen status of Democracy ether, everything depends on circumstances, people don’t win just because there democratic.

Looking at Europe today, fascist Germany is conspicuously absent.

And of course France was smaller than Germany.

I stand by my original belief. Democracy pulls ahead because democratic societies are better at innovation and economics, which are what matter once the nuclear standoff develops.
 
In the "Allies Intervene in the Winter War" thread, I had this a long-term possible outcome.

The Allies intervene in Scandinavia, precipitating a premature German invasion. This gets defeated.

France may still fall, but Scandinavia and Britain could still remain free. Perhaps they get US backing or during the course of the war, the Allies raid Baku and damage enough Soviet oil production that the Germans don't have enough and have to squeeze Romania to get what they can.
 
There is no chance of the US staying out once anyone started meddling in the Western Hemisphere. All of South America is either democratic or a junta backed by the US.

It's also very doubtful that the British Empire can survive if Hitler and Stalin are genuine allies.:(

Hitler and Stalin will not be genuine allies. A watchful peace will dominate Eastern Europe in this scenario, like the Cold War.

The Iron Curtain encircles Europe now. =]
 
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