Churchill's suicide Spring 1942

Winston Churchill suffered from depression.

WI in the aftermath of the losses of Tobruk and Singapore he killed himself?

I do not think this changes the overall outcome of the war but I wonder if it changes its conduct and future politics both in the UK and internationally?

Might Eden have found a way of making a united India an independent ally?


Oh and would there be a serious effort to claim that the PM's death had some other cause?
 
Winston Churchill suffered from depression.

WI in the aftermath of the losses of Tobruk and Singapore he killed himself?

I do not think this changes the overall outcome of the war but I wonder if it changes its conduct and future politics both in the UK and internationally?

Might Eden have found a way of making a united India an independent ally?


Oh and would there be a serious effort to claim that the PM's death had some other cause?

Earlier would be more likely IMO, after the initial adrenalin rush of the fight for survival but before the US joins in and victory becomes just about inevitable.

Alternatively, IIRC he had a suspected stroke in 1943 (according to Lord Moran's book). If you just want him dead then a worse stroke might do as a PoD.
 
I think suicide is completely against Churchills character. He had an almost psychotic self belief and I could only imagine him doing himself in in a situation where he would make a martyr of himself.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
I think suicide is completely against Churchills character. He had an almost psychotic self belief and I could only imagine him doing himself in in a situation where he would make a martyr of himself.

As devoted a fan of Churchill as I am, I'm not sure this is correct. He once told a friend that he suffered from depression so terrible that he made himself stand a certain distance away from the tracks at a rail station, fearing that he might not be able to keep himself from throwing himself onto them. He also said that he forced himself to stand away from the rails while on board a ship.

Yes, Churchill had an immense self-belief, but I think it's clear that he is what we would today call a manic-depressive. The fact that he was able to overcome this in an age before anti-psychotic medication speaks volumes about his immense willpower.
 

MrP

Banned
As devoted a fan of Churchill as I am, I'm not sure this is correct. He once told a friend that he suffered from depression so terrible that he made himself stand a certain distance away from the tracks at a rail station, fearing that he might not be able to keep himself from throwing himself onto them. He also said that he forced himself to stand away from the rails while on board a ship.

Yes, Churchill had an immense self-belief, but I think it's clear that he is what we would today call a manic-depressive. The fact that he was able to overcome this in an age before anti-psychotic medication speaks volumes about his immense willpower.

I've done that and for that reason. But I'm still here, and I find it hard to rate myself higher than Churchill. ;)
 

Thande

Donor
I've read that story about Churchill and the train - he called his depression "the black dog". But, as P says, just because he felt the temptation didn't mean he'd act on it, and I suspect that in a wartime context he would be even less likely to act on it. Because he would see it as a duty to serve as PM and he would be a coward abandoning his post to commit suicide in that situation, as opposed to when he was a lone voice in the wilderness and a backbench MP in the early 30s.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
I've read that story about Churchill and the train - he called his depression "the black dog". But, as P says, just because he felt the temptation didn't mean he'd act on it, and I suspect that in a wartime context he would be even less likely to act on it. Because he would see it as a duty to serve as PM and he would be a coward abandoning his post to commit suicide in that situation, as opposed to when he was a lone voice in the wilderness and a backbench MP in the early 30s.

Oh, I agree 100%. I'm merely saying that suicide wouldn't have been entirely alien to his character.
 
Top