Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Mario, Dec 12, 2018.
Mongols you say? Interesting, very interesting.
Decade of 1200s
1200: An Armenian Uprising causes serious problems in the Byzantine-Turkish border: a series of Armenian semi-independent statelets appear between both Empires.
1201: The Roman Mauretania is expanded after the occupation of minor post-Andalusian states: the first duke of Mauretania, Roman-Hispanic noble Ferdinando Maris, is appointed by the Emperor.
1202: The Kingdom of Lithuania completes the conquest of the western side of the Dniepr valley and names the area as 'Christian Turkey' (Turcia Fidelis), due to the presence of many Christian-Turkish refugees there.
1203: Sailors from the Roman Mauretania arrive in the island of Sylvia (OTL Madeira) for the first (recorded) time, but it remains unsettled.
1204: After 23 years of war in Ireland between the Danes and the Kingdom of Munster, the heir Prince of Munster begs the Romans to intervene in the island for supporting him, due to the high risk of his realm to be completely overrun by the Danes of Ulster and Leinster.
1205: First contact between the Mongol Empire and the Turkish Empire in Dzungaria. Both Empires agree on avoiding mutual aggression through signing the Treaty of the Five Hills.
1206: A Roman-Hispanic expedition starts the settlement of the Antilian Islands (OTL Azores), in order to establish there a mid-way base for the routes to Terra Nova: some skilled Roman-Hispanic sailors show interest in finding new routes to unexplored regions south to known Terra Nova.
1207: Treaty of Limerick: the Kingdom of Munster becomes a Roman vassal and the Danes cease their hostilities under a serious threat of being invaded by the Roman-British. The Munsterians are allowed to migrate to the Roman Terra Nova if they want to do it.
1208: The Roman Empire establishes two new duchies in their borders with the Kingdom of Sweden: West Geatland and East Geatland. Meanwhile, the Swedes settle in the Estonian islands.
1209: The Mali Empire establishes some ports in the Wagamine islands (OTL Cape Verde) in order to use them as strategic navy bases, due to their proximity to the port of Wagam, in the mainland.
See this is a tl I reeeeally love. While narrative is great it makes it hard, (for me at least) to see and picture whats going on in the larger scheme of things. Plus its while slightly wankish, is still plausible. Kudos Mario for a great job!
It's obviously a somehow wankish TL since the idea of reconstructing the Roman Empire during the Middle Ages requires some close-to-ASB events and high level of luck; it's something like you would try in 100 parallel universes and only might happen in one of them. But it's possible anyway.
I know this format of chronology is schematic and many things are lost compared to narrative TLs; the problem I always had when I tried narrative TLs is that I usually have to abandon them because they required more efforts from my side and sometimes I have no time for that. Moreover, English is not my mother tongue and this is also a handicap for long narrations.
Decade of 1210s
1210: The Emirate of Yemen regains independence of the Turkish Empire after a major uprising, while Alodia expels the Turks from most of Erithrea.
1211: The Byzantines hand most of Holy Land and Syria over to (West) Roman military control due to the difficulties to fund their own troops in most of the Byzantine Levant. Despite the fact that these territories remain under Byzantine sovereignty, the (western) Romans control them de facto.
1212: The Romans of Mauretania manage to expand their dominion of the coastland up to the nearby of Algiers. The territory is then divided in two duchies: West Mauretania and East Mauretania.
1213: A Roman expedition discovers the Angelus Falls (OTL Niagara Falls) and the lake of Christus Rex (OTL lake Erie), thus expanding the dominions of Roman Vinland to the south.
1214: Riots of the Hippodrome: the pro-Union party clash against the Byzantinists (against the Roman reunification) in the streets of Constantinople. The Byzantinists accuse the western Romans of 'invading' their Empire, as they control most of the Eastern borderlands.
1215: Massive migration of the Irish from the Kingdom of Munster to New England and White Man's Land due to the famine in the island and the state of continued conflicts with the Danes.
1216: The Romans from Scania take permanent control over the islands of Oland and Gottland, after years of territorial disputes with the Swedes for their sovereignty.
1217: End of the Mongol-Turkish truce in the East: Mongol hordes raid the easternmost provinces of the Turkish Empire in Central Asia.
1218: Plague of the Orient: thousands of cases of an unknown variant of pest are recorded in Persia, with high taxes of mortality and elevated risk of contagion.
1219: According to unverifiable sources, the first Arabic-Malian expedition to Terra Nova Australis (OTL South America) was attempted, without success: two ships allegedly departed from the Wagamine islands to the west, in order to find new routes to unexplored southern regions of Terra Nova, but never returned.
Decade of 1220s
1220: The first Hispanic sailors arrive in Terra Nova Hispanica (OTL Florida), departing from the Antilian islands. However, no settlement is planned as the area discovered was 'swampy and wild'.
1221: The plague of the Orient arrives in eastern Arabia, then passing to Yemen and later to Alodia, where it causes a dramatic death toll.
1222: The duchy of New Francia is officially established by the Emperor: the Roman dominions in Terra Nova are significantly expanded to the west.
1223: Death of the Emperor Edmund I. His son Charles VI is crowned as new Emperor in Milan: he strips the titles of King of Norway and King of Munster, merging them into the Imperial Crown. Charles VI will be an importat advocate of the 'Only Emperor of All Christendom' ideal.
1224: The Mongols invade most of the western Eurasian steppes, reaching the shores of lake Ladoga. The loose borders with the Turks are pushed to the south.
1225: A significant number of German settlers arrive in northwestern Tunisia, in order to mitigate the depopulation in the area after almost all of the Muslim population departed. This contrasts with the rest of Tunisia, mostly repopulated with Italians.
1226: The Diet of Pavia agrees, for the first time, to consent an eventual dynastic union with Byzantium. However, the situation of the moment does not allow that union, as both Empires have male heirs.
1227: The plague of the Orient causes a high death toll in Baghdad: the Imperial family and most of the Turkish high nobility moves to the old capital of Meru, where the Plague has not arrived.
1228: Completely encircled by Roman dominions and fearing an imminent invasion, the Danes of Ireland (the last territory in Western Europe not subdued by Rome) offer a treaty (Treaty of Derwig) to the Emperor accepting to recognize him as their overlord if he keeps the Danish nobility as their vassal rulers in the duchies of Ulster and Leinster.
1229: The Plague of the Orient arrives in Roman Armenia and advances into Anatolia, while Turkish Mesopotamia is seriously depopulated after the huge number of casualties.
The World in 1230
Decade of 1230s
1230: Lucius Stressemanni becomes the first Roman to visit the Wagamine islands, in the Mali Empire. The contact between Rome and Mali will help the Malians to improve their sailing abilities and marine engineering.
1231: Massacre of Dublin: the Danes opposed to Roman rule are massacred by the militias of the Danish duke of Leinster. The survivors opt to exile to Terra Nova.
1232: The Roman armies help the Lithuanians to repeal a Mongol invasion in the area of Livonia, but can't avoid that the Mongols ravage the valley of the Dniepr, killing many peasants in the Christian Turkey.
1233: Prince Boris Uzov, a renowned Bulgarian noble and member of the pro-Union party in Byzantium, gets the compromise of the Bulgarian nobility to achieve their own autonomy as duchies inside a common Roman Empire, like Serbs or Croatians actually enjoy.
1234: The Plague of the Orient arrives in Jerusalem: the Romans block all ships coming from the Levant in their ports.
1235: Persian Revolution: following the depopulation of Mesopotamia due to the Plague of the Orient and the relocation of the Turkish court to Meru, anti-Turkish Persian factions allied with Arabs and Egyptians proclaim Ardashir I as legitimate King of Persia, Mesopotamia, Arabia and Egypt in the old throne of Baghdad. Thus, a civil war breaks out inside the Turkish Emipre.
1236: A new Hispanic expedition to Terra Nova discovers the Planitia Islands (OTL Bahamas), but after suffering of severe scurvy, only a few part of the crew is able to return to the Antilians (OTL Azores) without attempting to settle there.
1237: The Persians defeat a large Turkish army in Shiraz: as a consequence, the remaining troops loyal to the Turkish Emperor in Meru have to evacuate the Iranian plateau.
1238: Bloody Nights of Constantinople: the arrival of the Plague of the Orient to the outskirts of the Byzantine capital causes riots and chaotic evacuation of several neighborhoods. Basileus Nikolaos the Unfortunate and his family flee to Thessalonica, but some of the royal family fall ill, including Princes Konstantinos and Alexandros.
1239: Treason of Thessalonica: noble members of the pro-Union party block the return of the Basileus to Constantinople. Prince Alexandros finally dies due to the sequels of the Plague while Prince Konstantinos is blinded and confined to a monastery in Macedonia. Nikolaos is then forced to recognize Princess Zoe as his only legitimate heiress, who is sent to Patras.
Awesome work so far! I'm really enjoying it.
How far are you planning to take this?
Until the modern Roman Empire is complete
I guess this timeline will never end then
Decade of 1240s
1240: Marriage of the Roman Prince Charles (future Charles VII) and the Princess Zoe in Dyrrachium. The Byzantinist party does not acknowledge the rights of Zoe to be the future Empress and proclaim her cousin Michael as legitimate heir of Basileus Nikolaos.
1241: Byzantinist Uprising: the anti-Western nobles take control of Anatolia and the city of Constantinople, while the pro-Union nobility keeps their strongholds in the Balkans, specially Bulgaria and Macedonia. The Levant is directly ruled by Rome (even if Byzantine de jure).
1242: End of the Turkish Civil War: the independence of Persia is recognized by the Turks. The new Kingdom of Persia also controls the lower Mesopotamia, Arabia (excepting Yemen) and the upper Egypt.
1243: Princess Zoe gives birth to a boy, named Charles Theodore, in order to reflect his dual heritage. The Byzantinists do not recognize him as a legitimate heir of the Empire, while Romans and pro-Union Byzantines do it.
1244: Death of Basileus Nikolaos: Princess Zoe is crowned Empress of Byzantium in Thessalonica, as the Byzantinists ban her to return to Constantinople. Her cousin Michael is crowned alternate Emperor of Byzantium, but his real power is basically reduced to Thrace and Anatolia.
1245: Byzantine Civil War: Basileus Michael tries to regain the control over Greece, while the Roman armies support the pro-Union party there.
1246: A Malian expedition arrives in Terra Nova Australis (in OTL Ceará) and, for the first time, it manages to come back home for reporting their discoveries.
1247: The old Byzantine administration in Bulgaria and Macedonia is replaced by a typically Roman ducal system, granting the pro-Union Bulgarian noblemen their desired autonomy.
1248: The Roman troops in the Levant attack Byzantinist units in Eastern Anatolia. The Roman-Bulgarians occupy the Byzantine Crimea, repealing a Mongol raid in the northern region.
1249: A second Malian expedition discovers the Olugo island (OTL Fernando de Noronha), which will be helpful as a midway stopover for the future Malian expeditions to the Terra Nova Australis.
yaaaay I second that it never ends
Going straight across from the Azores to N. America in medieval carracks would be most inadvisable, that's a hell of a distance for such a ship. (To say nothing of the absolute devastation brought a full century or more ago, but hey, actual recovery time!)
This is neat overall, Mario, well done!
You are right, and that's why it has been done only twice in all those years. The usual routes to Terra Nova (NE America) are still the old routes used by the Norse.
However, giving the fact that the Norse navigation has been incorporated and improved in the Roman one ITTL probably by this time navigation would have anticipated maybe more than one century compared to OTL timeline of progress in navigation.
Loving this timeline! Keep it going!
Decade of 1250s
1250: The Mongols expel the Swedes from the Ladoga-Onega area and force them to retreat to Finland, also abandoning their outposts in Estonia due to their vulnerability.
1251: The first permanent Malian settlements are established in Terra Nova Australis (OTL NE Brazil), known as New Mali.
1252: First Diet in Pavia including dukes from Byzantium (Bulgarias, Macedonia and Levant). Crimea is also established as a Roman duchy.
1253: The Anatolian Byzantinists fail in their attempts to capture the city of Antioch and retreat to Cappadocia.
1254: Death of the Emperor Charles VI: his son Charles VII is crowned Roman Emperor first in Milan and later in Jerusalem.
1255: The last Byzantinist resistence is crushed in Crete, so the pro-Unionists of Rhodes incorporate the island to their newly formed duchy (Crete and Dodecanessus).
1256: The famine in the British Isles triggers another big wave of migration towards White Man's Land and New England.
1257: The Roman armies finally take control of the semi-independent Armenia, thus securing the full control of the Eastern border with Persia and Turkey.
1258: Basileus Michael discovers a plot against his life by pro-Union agents in Constantinople. Feeling unsafe there, he decides to move his court to the loyal city of Nicea.
1259: The Kingdom of Persia declares a new war to the Turkish Empire after the continued Turkish raids in the northeastern Iranian plateau.
Decade of 1260s
1260: The Roman armies conquer the Byzantium's vassal territory of Lazica, establishing the border with the Turks along the western Caucasus, thus improving the safety of the northeastern border.
1261: The duchy of New England is expanded to the south, up to the bay of the Barbars (OTL Delaware Bay), after defeating some of the local tribes in the battle of Little Birmingham. Many settlers from Ireland and northern Britain are established in these new lands.
1262: Massive landings of Roman troops in the Aegean coast of Anatolia. The pro-Union noblemen convinces the authorities of the cities of Smyrna and New Ephesus to surrender the cities to the Romans without being damaged.
1263: Battle of Adrianople: the defeat of the last Byzantinist troops in the Balkans opens the doors of Constantinople to the Roman forces. The city is partially sacked and part of its walls dismantled. However, Charles VII calls for respecting the properties of the pro-Union party in the city.
1264: Peace between Persia and Turkey: the Turks recover some of their lost territories in the northeastern Iranian plateau, while the Persians ensure their control over the Baluchistan.
1265: The Emperor of Rome Charles VII and the Empress Zoe enter Constantinople. Basileus Michael, fearing the advance of the Romans into Bythinia, flees to the port of Sinope and takes a ship with unknown destination: after the flight of Michael, the Byzantinists lose heart and they are defeated across all the fronts in Anatolia.
1266: The Malians discover the Amazon river; many Muslim North African settlers which originally fled from the Andalusian states to the Mali Empire now migrate again to New Mali in order to establish there their own communities, as many of them suffered of discrimination in Mali.
1267: The last stronghold of the Byzantinists in Iconium is captured by the Romans: the civil war in the East is over and the old Roman Empire is reunified. The last Byzantine themas are reorganized in typical Roman duchies, thus unifying all the administration across the Empire.
1268: Charles VII and Zoe abdicate and their son, 25 years-old Charles Theodore I, is crowned first Emperor of the reunified Roman Empire. He is crowned only in Jerusalem, in order to do not favour Milan or Constantinople, and this tradition will be followed with the future Emperors.
1269: First Diet in Pavia with all the duchies of the reunified Empire. The parties of the Diet also suffer reorganization: the Greek duchies align with the Italian party, while the Anatolian ones form their own new party along with the Levant and Northern African duchies, in order to balance the Italian-Germanic power in the Diet.
The reunified Roman Empire in 1268
The name of the duchies are in both Latin and Germanic:
Now historians from this ATL wont need to discuss about which empire (MRE or ERE) is the true heir of Rome. Also, wil what will be the status of the greek language? How is the ethno-linguistic distribution of the empire?
Separate names with a comma.