Chronology: Reconstruction of the Roman Empire under the Carolingian dynasty

Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Mario, Dec 12, 2018.

  1. Cryostorm Monthly Donor

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    So the Mediterranean Sea, the Black Sea, the Baltic Sea, and the North Atlantic are Roman lakes as will the Great Lakes in due time.
     
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  2. SuperZtar64 Lord Protector of the New Commonwealth

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    Do you mean the Aztecs as in the actual empire? Because that was founded in 1428. Or do you mean "Aztec" as a catch-all for the numerous peoples that lived there?
     
  3. Βοανηργές Well-Known Member

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    Does last of chronology mean the TL will shift to story-based storytelling or does it mean the TL has ended?
     
  4. SuperZtar64 Lord Protector of the New Commonwealth

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    Refer to post #172.
     
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  5. Mario Well-Known Member

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    EPILOGUE I. 15th Century.


    The main political event of the century was the break-up of the large Khanate of Mongolia in several entities by the second half of the century. In Europe, the new Khanate of the Tartars succeeded the Mongol power west of the Urals but without being such threatening to Rome. In fact, the Tartars ceded most of their Baltic territories as they were focused on ensuring their dominion in the valley of the Volga.

    The expansion of the Roman Empire during this century was not limited to the former Mongolian Baltic; the decline of the Muslim Egyptian emirates led to their gradual partition between Rome in the North and Aksum in the South. Aksum slowly drifted from an ally position to a potential enemy for the hegemony in eastern Africa.

    In the Terra Nova (OTL America), the Roman expansion was significantly slowed, while the Commonwealth of the Olivians (Olivian Republic since 1492) increased their dominions by all the New Danubian (OTL Mississippi) valley and part of the western plains. Their limited contact with the Aztecs were enough curse for the later, as several waves of smallpox epidemics devastated the Mexican native civilizations during the last decades of the century.

    In the South Terra Nova, the Sultanate of New Mali severed all their former ties with their now declining homeland Mali, but it failed to keep their large territories united. Then, two important powerhouses emerged in the region: Soboko (centered in OTL Venezuela) and Liku-Mali (centered in OTL northeastern Brazil).

    In the Roman Empire, a new Imperial Constitution was passed in 1484, reinforcing the powers of the Diet in Pavia. The growing rivalry with the 'heretic' Olivians, who mainly spoke Middle Latin dialects, boosted the rise of the Germanic Lingua Franca over the others as the main language (and culture) of the Empire, a trend to be further enhanced during the following two centuries.
     
  6. Mario Well-Known Member

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    EPILOGUE II. 16th Century.


    The Roman Empire took part in several major wars, one of them a civil one, during this convulsed century: first against the Olivians, then against Aksum (which also triggered a civil war inside the Roman Empire) and finally against the Soboko.

    The war against the Olivian Republic (1517-1532) at least was useful for finally setting stable borders between the two powers, from the Great Lakes to New Spain (OTL Florida); but the war against the former allies of Aksum (1547-1560) only served the interests of certain Roman elites who ambitioned a direct access to the Indian Ocean. This clash of interests triggered a parallel civil war (1556-1560) in Rome between the pro-war party and the anti-war party.

    The final defeat of the anti-war party and the chaotic surrender of Aksum in 1560 pushed the pro-war elites to form a sort of oligarchy which would act as a shadow power out of the control of both the Diet and the Emperor. During the last decades of the century, these oligarchies promoted a proper colonization of the Upper Nile, created Germanic-controlled duchies in the area and subdued the key city port of Sumekho (renaimed Rome of the Grand South/Grossersüdenrom, or colloquially 'Groma') to their trading interests with India, Madagascar and Indonesia.

    In the South Terra Nova, Rome had to defend their Caribbean dominions from the hostile expansion of the new-Malian Soboko. The war of 1580-1591 divided the area of influence of the Caribbean in two sides: North for the Romans (OTL Cuba, Hispaniola, Cayman, Jamaica, Puerto Rico..) and South for the Soboko (OTL Lesser Antilles, Aruba, Bonaire...). The Soboko also contacted the Inca Empire by the 1530s and they started to get involved in the internal quarries of the Inca soon afterwards; meanwhile, in Mexico, post-Aztec states which had embraced Olivian Christianism started to rise by the end of the century.

    From a cultural point of view, the Civil war of 1556-60 reinforced the hegemony of the Germanic elites over the Latin, Slavic or Greek ones, triggering new migrations of non-Germanic Roman population towards the most tolerant Olivian Republic after 1560.
     
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  7. Mario Well-Known Member

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    The World in 1600

    World_1600.png
     
  8. Falecius Well-Known Member

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    Well, this is darn huge.

    Administering and defending that massive stretch of former Axumite land is likely to be a big undertaking. Local elites are to be integrated, infrastructure built, etc; I suppose it helps that Africa seems to be generally a lot more "developed" and interconnected with the wider world than IOTL, but this also means stronger challenges from local people both in the conquered areas and over its borders.
     
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  9. luis3007 History amateur

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    An oligarchic empire is one of the few ways to keep that monster somewhat united since the local and imperial magnates partition the responsibilities and duties of each duchy between themselves.

    Of course this arrangement won't last beyond a century. The poor and increasingly destitute Greek and Latin population will create ever increasing bigger rebellions, more religious schisms created by those groups will rise, the Emperor will become a puppet ruler and eventually the whole thing will implode within 2 centuries.

    By then however nationalism in the Americas and new technologies will change the face of the post-Carolingian Roman world.
     
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  10. Mario Well-Known Member

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    Well, I better clarify the situation by the end of the 16th century.

    The Roman Empire is, of course, far from being a centralized entity. Basically at this point, it is an amalgamation of very different sub-entities which are somehow glued by the still strong influence of the Roman Church and the figure of the Emperor, who ITTL is the major symbol of the religious unity, far more than the Pope or any other Patriarch.

    The core of the Empire (Europe) is maybe more technologically advanced than IOTL, but culturally it has not enjoyed any Renaissance-like phenomenon. The more conservative Latin and Greek elites have been gradually cornered to their local spheres while the Germanic ones had developed into a more oligarchic system which is making the transition to a typical colonial one in Eastern Africa.

    I will explain in the next epilogue how the oligarchic duchies of Eastern Africa will become a sort of colonial Empire inside the main one (in fact, they would be a separate entity but keeping the formal union with the rest of the Empire due to their strong commercial interests).

    In the case of Terra Nova, the Olivian Republic would be analogue to the early US and the Roman Terra Nova would be analogue to loyal Canada. In the Caribbean, a smaller colonial experience similar to Eastern Africa would also take place.
     
  11. Mario Well-Known Member

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    EPILOGUE III. 17th Century.


    The seventeen duchies established by the Roman-Germanic elites in Eastern Africa developed their own colonial-style administration parallel to the ordinary Roman one. Their expanded their territories to other parts of Ethiopia and the former Alodia, before launching a systematic conquest of the island of Madagascar and their surrounding archipelagos (OTL Comoros, Seychelles and Mascarenes) during the decades of 1660s and 1670s. Madagascar became a colony without autonomy, co-ruled by those seventeen duchies, which constituted a big anomaly inside the Roman Empire.

    In Terra Nova, the Olivian Republic continued its expansion to the North and West, while the post-Aztec Olivian-Christian states were unified by the Chiefdom of Mexico by 1650. The Roman duchies of South Bluelands and New Spain formed another colonial-like dominion over the islands of the Great Balears (OTL Cuba and Cayman), Leona (Hispaniola), Elyssia (Jamaica) and Boriqua (Puerto Rico).
    In the South, the Soboko introduced the Islam to the Inca, which became the official religion (Inca Sultanate) in 1684.

    In Europe, several famines boosted a strong feeling of local decadence which triggered new migrations to both Terra Nova and Eastern Africa. Several regions like Anatolia or Spain suffered continued popular riots and uprisings against the local nobility, tipped as incompetent. The rise of a new class of burgeoisie, less attached to the privileges awarded by the nobility and more self-organized in new trading companies, started to challenge the traditional system of power in some European duchies.
     
  12. Mario Well-Known Member

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    The World in 1700

    World_1700.png
     
  13. Falecius Well-Known Member

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    And it gets huger.
     
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  14. Albert Blake Member

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    How much of the Sahara is Rome going to gobble up in the next few centuries?
     
  15. SuperZtar64 Lord Protector of the New Commonwealth

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    Bold of you implying it's going to stop at the Sahara.
     
  16. RyuDrago Italian? Yes, but also Roman

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    What is happening or happened to the east in the meanwhile?
     
  17. Albert Blake Member

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    Fair enough but how much can they hope to hold without losing connection to the sea, they never seemed like desert navigators to me.
     
  18. SuperZtar64 Lord Protector of the New Commonwealth

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    That's because they aren't. The Sahara is going to be de jure split between the Malians and the Romans, most likely among some arbitrary border, but hardly controlled until the technology to navigate there properly comes into existence.

    The Malians would definitely have the upper hand in claiming parts of the Sahara, however.
     
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  19. Albert Blake Member

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    Good point, I guess the real question is how much land will Rome take, I think Australia is available unless some Chinese Dynasty has already taken it
     
  20. Musketeer513 Member

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    Just discovered this thread but now I'm following.