China in space around 1973. What impact in manned spaceflight flight ?

[Archibald]

I'm surprised no one ever thought about this whatif here.
http://www.astronautix.com/craft/shuuang1.htm

Chinese manned spaceflight in 1975 anybody ?

How would Japan react ?

 

[tallwingedgoat]

From the link it seems their program was doomed by the Cultural Revolution. If they were to succeed it would probably take doing away with that whole mess. In which case China would be a different country in many respects.

 

[Hendryk]

For a Chinese Moon landing in 1972, see Psychomeltdown's story "One Small Step", set in my Superpower Empire TL

 

[Bishop]

The Chinese would certainly have a lot more time and won't be wasting the time and resources they have now to figure out the basic effects of manned spaceflight as they are now. Maybe we'll have a manned space station by them in the 1980's assuming they continue it without any political problems.

If they follow the same road map they have now, they might be the first ones to establish a moon base if the U.S and everyone else continues like OTL.

 

[Archibald]

From the link it seems their program was doomed by the Cultural Revolution. If they were to succeed it would probably take doing away with that whole mess. In which case China would be a different country in many respects.

That's truly the main problem. Now get ride of Mao, maybe Deng earlier.
Or "resurect" this program around 1980 by Deng and have a chinese manned spaceflight much earlier circa 1987...

Good point on the space station Bishop. By the way at the time the CZ-2 rocket had been vastly improved, making the flight probably less painfull for the astronauts.

A pity China and USSR "disagree" in the early 60's, a Chinese Saliut or Almaz would have been great!

 

[Michel Van]

the Shuguang was China aswers to Gemini space craft.
A (sucsessfull) China manned Space Flight is gigantic Propaganda stunt
you know those color full Chinese propaganda poster....

long term politcal impact
wat if China take agressiv manned MILITARY space program ?
the USSR and USA gona have Problem.
if China take Manned military space program like USA SAINT II in 1960s (chanceld in 1965)
http://www.astronautix.com/craft/saintii.htm
the Shuguang rendezvous with, inspect, and then, if necessary, destroy enemy satellites.

so USSR has to answer that problem so build an launch Combat Version of Soyuz (chanceld in 1960)
(see USSR China Border conflic of 1968)
and USA also wenn fist Keyhole spy sat is shot down over China by a Shuguang
so in 1980s Space become battle field of Superpowers
were space fighter protect they space station, Spysat. sicence Sat for enermy space fighter.

wat if China take normal manned Space Program ?
the Shuguang Program would like Gemini space program
mit long time flight, EVA, Spacecraft rendevous and docking.

after that space station like MOL or Lunar mission

and rest of World ?
Taiwan will start also Manned program to contern China
but has no space program, Japan has a Space Program
will be a joinventure of Taiwan and Japan ???

wat about Europe ?
ESA was just constituted and they start fron zero, after ELDO Europa rocket fiasco.
they develope the Ariane Rocket with first launch for 1978
they have other problem as manned space flight.

the Shuguang was China aswers to Gemini space craft.
means you can expand the craft like Gemini
Manned Orbiting Laboratory
http://www.astronautix.com/craft/mol.htm
Big Gemini
http://www.astronautix.com/craft/bigemini.htm
Blue Gemini
Military version one pilot, second seat repaced by Camera
see picture (civilan version of Blue Gemini)

even a Luna Gemini
http://www.astronautix.com/articles/bygemoon.htm

 

[Archibald]

Let's suppose that CIA heard about Chinese manned space program at the time Nixon meet Mao in 1972.
Then chinese manned space program is postponed by 5 years until Deng came to power.
Can US help the chinese in improving their spaceship just to piss of the Soviets ?
for example adding a docking module to Shuguang...

 

[Michel Van]

Can US help the chinese in improving their spaceship just to piss of the Soviets ?

even better given China, the Blue Prints of Gemini Spacecraft (include advance proposals)
Like Gemini Ferry, those inklude docking module in back of Gemini

instatt Apollo Soyuz Test Program a Apollo Shuguang Test Program ?

see picture of Smal Gemini Ferry for MORL project

 

[Dean_the_Young]

even better given China, the Blue Prints of Gemini Spacecraft (include advance proposals)
Like Gemini Ferry, those inklude docking module in back of Gemini

instatt Apollo Soyuz Test Program a Apollo Shuguang Test Program ?

see picture of Smal Gemini Ferry for MORL project

Better yet, give them a copy of the original Saturn V blueprints, and let them work out the bugs.

 

[Thande]

The Chinese invented space, you know...

I think it's a recipe for (even) more emphasis on space station building in the 1980s. Based on their current programme, it seems the Chinese government is more interested in building up a large infrastructure one step at a time than trying for a crazy propaganda goal. Although I suppose it would embarrass the Russians if the Chinese got to the moon first...if the Chinese tried, I suppose the Mir programme would be put on hold and the Soviet moon programme revived...

 

[Archibald]

instatt Apollo Soyuz Test Program a Apollo Shuguang Test Program ?

Excellent idea. Dock the thing to an Apollo or to Skylab.

 

[Bishop]

This is very interesting, I actually thought of writing a piece regarding this issue in the Writer's forum a few months ago, but decided not to with a econ. paper coming up for me. However if someone with the time and intellect can take all this info. and make a TL with it, it'll be a very interesting one.

 

[CalBear]

Forget about manned flight.

This would give the PRC true ICBM capacity by 1973 standards (something that they STILL lack by 2008 standards). It would, put another way, move the PRC 40 years ahead from OTL in rocketry.

 

[Thande]

Forget about manned flight.

This would give the PRC true ICBM capacity by 1973 standards (something that they STILL lack by 2008 standards). It would, put another way, move the PRC 40 years ahead from OTL in rocketry.

Which is the main reason why I don't see the US cheerfully handing over lots of rocket designs as someone else suggested above.

 

[Dean_the_Young]

Which is the main reason why I don't see the US cheerfully handing over lots of rocket designs as someone else suggested above.

That was tongue-in-cheek. The Saturn V was one of the worst rockets ever made, requiring over 1000 emergency fixes on the launchpad before its first launch. My old neighbor, who helped work on the thing, heaped piles of scorn on the process of how Congress decreed it would be developed and made.

 

[Thande]

That was tongue-in-cheek. The Saturn V was one of the worst rockets ever made, requiring over 1000 emergency fixes on the launchpad before its first launch. My old neighbor, who helped work on the thing, heaped piles of scorn on the process of how Congress decreed it would be developed and made.

Well, given how its only competitor was the N1, which didn't work at all, I say it worked well enough

 

[Dean_the_Young]

Well, given how its only competitor was the N1, which didn't work at all, I say it worked well enough

Ah, but it was atrocious compared to the other ones. When Congress ordered that the megamajority of work be done by contractors (who work for profit, not quality) as opposed to the federal government (who can sacrafice profit for quality), and then ordered the work dispersed across the country, major foulups occured, including (but not limited to)...

-low-quality wiring systems that could (and did) lead to accidents
-various contractors not sharing a single blue print, resulting in different stages of the rocket being built for different link-up measurements
-rough long-distance parts movement to get from one contractor to another
-price gouging