Chances of an American nation(USA, Mexico, Colombia, Brazil etc.) turning colonial?

What about European colonization of the Americas then?

what about it? The purpose of this thread is about turning one of the New World nations into a real colonial power. 'Colonial' as in the way the Europeans established hegemony over Africa and Asia. Settlement of the Americas (and Australia too) was more a matter of nearly total population replacement, since the natives were damn near wiped out first by disease and then by the whites themselves. The Europeans didn't come close to anything like that in Africa or Asia...
 
TL idea I had involved a messier divorce of Portugal and Brazil in the 1820s.

Basically after Dom Pedro I's reactionary brother roses up against his daughter Maria for the throne (basically the Portuguese Carlist Wars) he abdicated the Brazilian throne in order to focus on the war in Europe. He eventually won but died soon after. Let's have Miguel's forces with stronger Spanish and French support win in Portugal proper, possibly with Pedro's death on campaign.

This leaves an infant Dom Pedro II in Brazil, possibly with Maria as Regent if she escapes across the Atlantic.

One advantage the Liberals had during the civil war was naval - they staged attacks from the Azores and had a pick of the coast, led by plenty of adventurous Brits such as Cochrane. Let's say after Pedro I's death the European Powers accept Miguel as King. This leaves a hostile Brazil with an experienced navy and smaller though dedicated army of Pedroistos led by mercenary bounders and rakes in possession of key Atlantic islands.

Through a combination of local military superiority and the draw of Maria's legitimist cause, you could see Brazil seize the African outposts, Macau and Timor. Part of me expects Goa might be sacrficed to the British to turn a blind eye against Brazil unsporting tactics.

Basically Brazil will be de jure merely holding Portuguese colonies for Maria's eventual return but after a failed revolt or too I can see Brazil having a legitimate colonial empire, entrenched during a long cold war with Miguelisto Portugal.

African holdings would certainly make an interesting dynamic for the slave issue in Brazil. Meanwhile by the late 19th century if Brazil progresses economically as it did in OTL she will probably make more of the colonies than ailing Portugal ever did. Something of a steal from FabR but I like the idea of a post-slavery Brazil using Afro-Brazilians to colonise and civilise Angola et al in a Liberia writ large. Anyone keen on seeing Brazilian forces battling alongside Boers in Zambia to implement the Pink Map plan!
 
American colonialism may not seem very significant compared to Europe, that that's relative to which powers you're comparing it to. The Philippines alone has a much larger population than the former overseas possessions of Italy, Germany, Russia, Denmark, and Sweden. It's about on par with Belgium's empire, too.

As others mentioned, Peru might make a good candidate for a colonial presence in the South Pacific, considering slave traders from Peru steam-rolled the islands in the 1860's. All they need is a little backing by the government and a few Peruvian flags and the area is theirs for the taking.

If you think about it, Chile's annexation of Easter Island and Ecuador's annexation of the Galapagos (which had no indigenous population, but does have a colonial settler population today) constitute imperialism on a very small scale.
 
As already mentioned the US was (and in a way still is) a colonial power in OTL.
Now in an ATL the two most likely candidates I think would be Mexico and Brazil.
An independent Mexico that somehow manages to stay stable and modernizesat a good pace would have what it is needed to get some colonies. They would likely foucus in the Pacific and Caribbean and as already mentioned the kinda have claim on the Philippines, maybe they get them at the same time the US did in OTL. The enlarged Pacific coast (including Cali and Central America) makes things like Hawaii and othe Pacific Islands likely targets. The Caribbean would be part of a "Friendly Neighbor" policy ala Monroe Doctrine.
For Brazil, it is about Portugal's African colonies deiciding to go with the Brazilian administration. This one is much easier than the above. If you have Portugal fare alot worse in the Napoleonic Wars and the royal family actually staying in Brazil.
 

archaeogeek

Banned
As already mentioned the US was (and in a way still is) a colonial power in OTL.
Now in an ATL the two most likely candidates I think would be Mexico and Brazil.
An independent Mexico that somehow manages to stay stable and modernizesat a good pace would have what it is needed to get some colonies. They would likely foucus in the Pacific and Caribbean and as already mentioned the kinda have claim on the Philippines, maybe they get them at the same time the US did in OTL. The enlarged Pacific coast (including Cali and Central America) makes things like Hawaii and othe Pacific Islands likely targets. The Caribbean would be part of a "Friendly Neighbor" policy ala Monroe Doctrine.
For Brazil, it is about Portugal's African colonies deiciding to go with the Brazilian administration. This one is much easier than the above. If you have Portugal fare alot worse in the Napoleonic Wars and the royal family actually staying in Brazil.

I had a thought about a hypothetical scenario where the Spanish crown somehow ends up being divided: Ferdinand VII is more succesful but fails to capture Godoy, so instead of the Bayonne interview, Charles IV ends up relocating in the americas along with the people at court who are still loyal to him (IOTL one of the reasons he agreed to an interview was to save his prime minister, among others). Thus you have a Brazilianization of Mexico and it's more likely to end up keeping the islands both west and east.

Of course it's not exactly likely as a scenario and the succession crisis butterflies it would lead to would be the Carlist wars on steroids- plus it's a TL idea I'm working on (will be working on when I don't have to go play ethnography that is :p) if I can figure out the plausibility of such a situation, which I suspect is mildly implausible anyway.
 
As already mentioned the US was (and in a way still is) a colonial power in OTL.
Now in an ATL the two most likely candidates I think would be Mexico and Brazil.
An independent Mexico that somehow manages to stay stable and modernizesat a good pace would have what it is needed to get some colonies. They would likely foucus in the Pacific and Caribbean and as already mentioned the kinda have claim on the Philippines, maybe they get them at the same time the US did in OTL. The enlarged Pacific coast (including Cali and Central America) makes things like Hawaii and othe Pacific Islands likely targets. The Caribbean would be part of a "Friendly Neighbor" policy ala Monroe Doctrine.
For Brazil, it is about Portugal's African colonies deiciding to go with the Brazilian administration. This one is much easier than the above. If you have Portugal fare alot worse in the Napoleonic Wars and the royal family actually staying in Brazil.

Taking this all the way and slightly wanking the situation maybe the Portuguese Royalty would stay forever in Brazil and Portugal itself would become of Colony of Brazil. That way Brazil would inherit every part of the Portuguese Empire including Goa, Macao, and Flores.
 
Something of a steal from FabR but I like the idea of a post-slavery Brazil using Afro-Brazilians to colonise and civilise Angola et al in a Liberia writ large. Anyone keen on seeing Brazilian forces battling alongside Boers in Zambia to implement the Pink Map plan!
I read somewhere that Portugal, at the time of Brazil-Colony, had problems with implanting african administration brought directly from Europe. The non-acclimated european personnel didn't adapt too well to the african weather. So, they tended to recruit a good percentage of the african colonial administration in Brazil...
Now, if you can find any support to this sidenote, this can have interesting consequences on your thesis...
 
I read somewhere that Portugal, at the time of Brazil-Colony, had problems with implanting african administration brought directly from Europe. The non-acclimated european personnel didn't adapt too well to the african weather. So, they tended to recruit a good percentage of the african colonial administration in Brazil...
Now, if you can find any support to this sidenote, this can have interesting consequences on your thesis...

Very interesting, seems to make practical sense. I've always been intrigued by Portugal's unique (or at least most radical take on) policy of Ultramar, namely the colonies are integral parts of the Nation-State to the point of rather inefficiently not having a Colonial Ministry but instead an Angolan department at the Interior Ministry etc. I imagine Brazil would take a similar stance however with a large mixed and black population centred in the southern hemisphere it would be intrigueing to see how closer they could get to a true Imperial Federation, particularly with a liberal D. Pedro II at the helm.

Me thinks I'll be popping into Central Library tomorrow for a little research...
 
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