Challenge: Write a TL for this map

Dorozhand

Banned
Write a TL about the world which this map depicts:

Chu2.png

Chu2.png
 

Dorozhand

Banned
You might want to translate it for everyone.

The Blue area is the character "Chu", the same as the ancient state of Chu. The other blue area is "Tibet autonomous region". The light blue area means "Kingdom of Qing". The capital of the Dark blue area is Kaifeng, and the light blue capital is Qiqihar.
 
The Blue area is the character "Chu", the same as the ancient state of Chu. The other blue area is "Tibet autonomous region". The light blue area means "Kingdom of Qing". The capital of the Dark blue area is Kaifeng, and the light blue capital is Qiqihar.

I thought you already put some idea's about this.
However I have 2 idea.
1. Qing will rise. Then start conquering Ming.
Khalkha and Dzungars remain Ally. When Qing forces reach Delta Yangtze, Eastern Mongols will revolt, which will halt Qing troops advance. This will give Ming troops time to re-group and establish Khalkha-Dzungar-Ming Alliance. Now Qing fights 2 or even 3 fronts and force them to retreat to Northern Manchuria.
Then maybe Ming collapse and Chu Dynasty will be established. Then conquers Tibet.
Dzungaria conquers Khalkha Mongols.
Borders need to be bit adjusted on Russia Mongolian border and Dzungar Basin goes to Mongolia.

2. Han Chinese will revolt just after Opium War. Same time Mongols and Xinjiang will revolt. Now Qing collapses and will retreat to Northern Manchuria. Mongols, Xinjiang, Qing is protectorate of Russian Empire while Chu Dynasty is modernized and transformed itself Great Power.
 
My answer will be post 1900 not pre 1900.

First off the Japanese do not enter China in 1937, and there by have much more in the way of forces to throw into Khalkhin Gol in 1939. With these extra forces the Japanese are able to break off a chunk of Mongolia.

Xinjiang is broken off by the Soviet Union and is currently be worked on as a puppet state with the goal of being an SSR in the Soviet Union.
 
My answer will be post 1900 not pre 1900.

First off the Japanese do not enter China in 1937, and there by have much more in the way of forces to throw into Khalkhin Gol in 1939. With these extra forces the Japanese are able to break off a chunk of Mongolia.

Xinjiang is broken off by the Soviet Union and is currently be worked on as a puppet state with the goal of being an SSR in the Soviet Union.

Post 1900

The Qing Monarchy falls in 1911. Republicans set up a republic/democracy similar to the USA, but after a few years, it becomes clear that the republic won't work. In around 1929, a previously unknown person comes into sight. A charismatic person called Chu, he leads a number of people under a monarchist banner. The Chinese Civil War now has three factions, Jiang's Republicans, Mao's Communists, and Chu's Monarchists. In 1931, Japan enters Manchuria and sets up a puppet government under the last Qing Monarch. In China, Chu restrains himself, letting the Republican faction and the Communist faction battle themselves out. The Chinese Civil War continues into the late 1930s, but the Japanese from Manchuria do not invade China. Instead, to take advantage of the chaos, the Soviet Union siphons off East Turkestan and Inner Mongolia from China, with the intention of eventually converting East Turkestan and Mongolia into SSRs. (The creator of the map decided to use the Chinese Xinjiang instead of the official East Turkestan)

By the early 1940s, both the Republicans and the Communists are worn and weary of war, and the general public has become disillusioned with both communism and democracy. Now, Chu launches his attack on both the Communists and the Republicans, in which he utterly destroyed the opposition. In Nanjing in 1945, Chu is crowned Emperor of China. By 1950, tensions between Chu China and Tibet have escalated, over a border dispute. In a move similar to Bismarck about 80 years ago, Emperor Chu made Tibet the aggressor nation of the Sino-Tibetian War. By the end of the war, Tibet has been totally conquered by Chu China. On the other hand, Chu China's attempts to gain its northern lands back fail.

Japan had joined World War 2 in 1939 on the wrong side. Pacific War events are pretty much similar to OTL, until we get to 1944. By 1944, it was getting clear that the Japanese were losing, but some of those in the top positions refused to believe, and continued to commit to a hopeless cause. In the country itself, having been bombarded day and night by American planes, dissent against the war has started, especially amongst the moderates, and continues to grow. Emperor Hirohito, all this time, was a virtual puppet of the militarists in power, but nearing the end of the war, he slowly started forming his own opinions. By the beginning of 1945, tensions between the militarists and the anti-war faction has reached an apex. A vote whether to end the war or not was tied 3-3, only to be broken by Hirohito in favor of ending the war. As a consequence, the USSR never declares war on Japan and never invades Manchuria. After the war, Korea, Taiwan, and Manchuria are independent kingdoms or republics.
 
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My answer will be post 1900 not pre 1900.

First off the Japanese do not enter China in 1937, and there by have much more in the way of forces to throw into Khalkhin Gol in 1939. With these extra forces the Japanese are able to break off a chunk of Mongolia.

Xinjiang is broken off by the Soviet Union and is currently be worked on as a puppet state with the goal of being an SSR in the Soviet Union.

That can't work.
1. There will be no independent Manchuria given WWII goes as OTL.
2. Inner Mongolia can't be back to Outer Mongolia.
3. After War the Communists China is almost inevitable.
 
Taiping Rebellion succeeds , the French and British decide to remain neutral.

Russia intervenes, setting up a Qing puppet in Manchuria while Mongolia and East Turkestan become puppets as well. Tibet is peeled off earlier to Britain, and is called an autonomous region so as to allow for British meddling while saving face.

Russia and Japan eventually come to blows. Russia's bloated eastern sphere combined with their disloyal nature hampers Russia's efforts. Japan seizes Korea, but having Japan take all of Manchuria is a step too far for the European powers, so they return it to the "Chinese sphere" *with the european powers + japan all getting various spheres of influence*.
 
That can't work.
1. There will be no independent Manchuria given WWII goes as OTL.
2. Inner Mongolia can't be back to Outer Mongolia.
3. After War the Communists China is almost inevitable.

You can take a look at the short piece I just posted.

Edit: And the reason why it should be post 1900 is because outside of China itself, the borders look exactly like the borders of the late-1800s and the early-1900s.
 
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Let's analyse the map first.

IOTL, there was the Manchu Khanate, then Hongtaiji changed its name to " Great Qing State" as the Khanate was becoming more and more of a player with affairs within China. Then, as Qing was exposed to western concepts of "empire, kingdom, or republic", they changed their formal name to "Great Qing Imperial State", or Qing Empire. In no circumstance would the Qing downgrade themselves to a mere Kingdom, unless they were reduced to some sort of client state of Someone else's.

Chu. The Chu in Warring States Period was today's Hunan and Hubei. The dynastic name suggests that China was being ruled by someone(and his clique) from the two provinces, which was very likely with a 19th century PoD as the Hunanese soldiers was the main force in putting off the Taipings.

Tibetan Autonomous Region. The name "Autonomous Region" strongly hints communist influences as the commies love word-redundancy. Perhaps there was a leftist revolt in Tibet against the China-backed Lamas, and Chu, under a Leftist government, compromised by granting Tibet autonomy.

Colors. Greater Mongolia and Xingjiang were colored similar to Russia, hinting Russian influences or even colonialism. Based on the similar colors of Chu and Qing, we assume that Chu subdued Qing.

Xingjiang. It's a Chinese name, hinting a Chinese-dominated (Han or Hui) Xingjiang taking orders from Russia?:eek:

TL:
Due to strategic misjudgements, the Qing failed to contain the Taiping's northern expeditions, and fled West to Shaanxi. When the Muslims started to rebel(otl), a good part of the Qing Royal house was wiped out.

Xiang (Hunan) Clique, a royalist force, now have nobody to be loyal to. Not willing to kowtow to the heretic (unconfucian)Taiping, the Hunanese soldiers declared Zeng Guofan their emperor, despite Zeng's own loyalty to the Qing house. The Qing government (on the run in Manchuria) killed many of Zeng's family when they heard Zeng's "treason", forcing Zeng to really accept the title Emperor of Chu.

At the same time, Taiping Heavenly Kingdom was suffering from its own victories. Wei Changhui launched a coup against Yang Xiuqing, killing his entire family. Shi Dakai, disappointed by the infighting, fled to join the Taiping force in the north, who happened to be Yang Xiuqing's loyalists. Shi Dakai declared that with Yang Xiuqing dead, he was the new Reincarnation of God, and he was to save Hong Xiuquan from Wei Changhui. Thus we now have two Heavenly Kingdoms based in Nanjing and Beijing, respectively.

Now China is in complete chaos. Shaanxi and Gansu in the hands of the Muslims, Central Plain the Northern Taipings, Jiangnan and Jiangxi the Southern Taipings, Xingjiang the Yakub Beg, Manchuria the Qing, and the rest of China was maintaining a weak stability under their own provincial governors.

Gradually, upon realising that reviving Qing was impossible, the provincial governors shifted their allegiance to Chu. In a war no less bloody than OTL, the more united Chu was able to beat the Taipings.

Meanwhile, Russia invaded China, and was able to gain much more than they did IOTL due the collapse of the Qing. Outer Manchuria was completely annexed (as per Aigun Treaty IOTL), Mongolia and the rump Qing was puppetized, and Yakub Beg was toppled with the help of Chinese Muslims(Hui), that's why the new Russian protectorate was called Xingjiang, other than Kashagaria.

Zeng Guofan wiped out the Taipings and united China, only to find out that a large chunk of it was gone. However, China was in no position to fight another war. Zeng signed a treaty with Russia*, inaugurated a series of reforms, waiting for the chance to take revenge on the Russian backstabbing...

*In China, it's a rule for a new dynasty to treat the descendents of the previous dynasties' emperors with dignity, as a measure to boost the new dynasty's legitimacy as the legal successor of the old one. Zeng Guofan therefore gave the Yuan, Ming and Qing descendents princely title in respect to this custome, and as a protest against Russian dominance over Manchuria and Mongolia.
 
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The Chu had very quite successful reforms under the emperor Zeng Guofan and his son Zeng Jize, as well as a group of ministers including Li Hongzhang, Zuo Zongtang and Zhang Zhidong.

Besides military, industrial and ideological reforms, Chu also experimented with western style political systems. A consultation council was set up in 1875, which became a parliament in the 1890s.

During Russian Revolution, the Chu was able to Make Xinjiang and Mongolia independent(buffer) states, cleared of Russian troops, and Qing Kingdom a Chinese protectorate. No further advances was made because China itself was threatened by the revolutions as well.
 
Tibetan autonomous movement was a set left wing political movements in the 1960s. It was set against the Chu-backed Lama ruling class.

As nationalistic and communistic groups filled the Tibetan Provincial Council, the Chinese government was forced to make compromises. Although the fact that socialists were in charge of Kaifeng(the imperial capital) at that time also contributed to such outcome.

Tibetan Basic Law was passed in 1967, declaring an Autonomous Region, giving more to the more say in their local affairs so that they can carry out socialist reform.
 
Why the heck did you place the capital in Kaifeng? It was an indefensible position and one of the reason Northern Song resistance got so easily wiped out. No sane chinese politician would have Kaifeng has his capital again.

As for why Taiwan was lost... Well, Commodore Matthew C. Perry, after Opening japan, saw how China was in disarray and took it with his black ships.
 
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