Challenge: France in the HRE

Here's a challenge: make France join the Holy Roman Empire and be considered a part of that state, with a POD before 1789 but after 1400. Bonus points for how integrated France is with the empire.
 
Something in the HYW would seem appropriate to break France apart, so the states of the HRE could digest it more easily. Perhaps the alleged continuity back to Charlemagne might be more tolerated ITTL, with the phase from 843 to 14-whenever seen as a sort of interlude between the First Francogermanian Empire and the Francogermanian Reunion.
 
Something I thought of, what if Francis I of France somehow beat Charles V and was elected Holy Roman Emperor?
 
Wouldn't that be more a "French HRE" though? :confused: (Assuming he went all Louis XIV on them... ;))

What do you mean by that? Something like the War of the Grand Alliance? I don't think that would happen if Francis the Emperor.

Or were you talking about something else?

And the empire would still be the Holy Roman Empire, it would just now have another ethnic group thrown into the pot. Plus Francis might be able to help the empire unify.
 
What do you mean by that? Something like the War of the Grand Alliance? I don't think that would happen if Francis the Emperor.

Or were you talking about something else?

And the empire would still be the Holy Roman Empire, it would just now have another ethnic group thrown into the pot.

I think I just got confused...

Plus Francis might be able to help the empire unify.

Around France... ;)

France is much more centralised, and has a huge manpower base... Francis could very well be a new Charlemagne... :eek::p
 

Philip

Donor
The French win at Blenheim? Could this lead to a restructuring of the HRE around France?
 
I think I just got confused...

Around France... ;)

France is much more centralised, and has a huge manpower base... Francis could very well be a new Charlemagne... :eek::p

Yes, but as long as he still calls it the Holy Roman Empire, this POD works.
A second Charlemagne would be very interesting... but now that I think of it, could Francis I unify the empire by any other means besides conquest?
 
Charles V is able to retake Burgundy before Francis I renegs on the Treaty of Madrid. Another war begins when Francis tries to ignore the Treaty leading to war with the Habsburgs. The Henry VIII aids the Univseral Emperor and after a long bloody war, France is totally defeated. England is given areas like Normandy, Aquitaine, ect, with the rest coming under Habsburg influence from both Spain and Austria, with a large Burgundian Kingdom being established. This would also likely result in less of a Catholics versus Protestants divide, or Charles V and Henry VIII would likely end up Protestant some how if the Pope for whatever reason threw support to the French. Burgundy and the rest of the French rump states would be brought into the empire so they could be easily controlled with Burgundy gaining the Habsburgs an elector's position.
 

Susano

Banned
Something I thought of, what if Francis I of France somehow beat Charles V and was elected Holy Roman Emperor?

Much has been made out of this election, and how Charles loaned money from the Fuggers and yadda yadda - but the truth is, his election was never really threatened. He was the Habsburg, after all!
 
Much has been made out of this election, and how Charles loaned money from the Fuggers and yadda yadda - but the truth is, his election was never really threatened. He was the Habsburg, after all!

Hmmm... what if Charles V died beforehand?
 
Any thoughts on my Hundred Years War idea? Certainly, the strains of nationalism were not in use at that time, and loyalty to the King was hardly an important issue. Say Joan of Arc fails.
 
Any thoughts on my Hundred Years War idea? Certainly, the strains of nationalism were not in use at that time, and loyalty to the King was hardly an important issue. Say Joan of Arc fails.

That could lead to a HRE becoming much larger...

Of course, England would expect its own share, so I'm not sure if all of France would end up in the HRE...
 
That could lead to a HRE becoming much larger...

Of course, England would expect its own share, so I'm not sure if all of France would end up in the HRE...

Well, yes, but a couple of Anglo-Burgundian wars could shift a good deal of Frangleterre into the hands of the Habsburgs.
 
Well, yes, but a couple of Anglo-Burgundian wars could shift a good deal of Frangleterre into the hands of the Habsburgs.

There is that...

How about this - All of France becomes part of the HRE, but England keeps a few choice peices arround the edges as part of the king of England's personal domain?

Would that actually work? :confused:
 
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