Challenge : Combine Man in the High Castle and TNO
- Thread starter Kol
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tanaka's TNO-TMITCH world
Depends on whether you mean the book version or the series adaptation of the Man in the High Castle. Personally, I will try to fuse the series with TNO, using the book to cover any gaps that it can conver in the former, as the book version is actually very close to TNO: The Atlantropa plan has been implemented, Germany is a giant with legs of clay, Italy controls a large empire in the Middle East. When there are contradictions, I will try to use both sources; thus the result would be a mix. The related senteces are in parentheses.
- Central Asia and most of Siberia are controlled by the Russian warlords. Dirlewanger's Brigade is actually a sort of auxilliary force, assisting the German garrisons in the southern Urals and the Wehrmacht still sends disgraced officers and condemned to serve there as punishment.
- In Africa, you could keep most things from TNO, since in TMITCH there isn't much information about the situation there, apart from the extermination of the indigenous peoples mentioned in the book (you could drop that and go for the completely vague line of the series). Regarding the South African War, you could have South Africa keep Southwest Africa, which causes friction with Berlin because the Germans would claim it as one of the four old imperial colonies in Africa. The South African government in turn, begins building stronger ties with Japan. Thus, when the war breaks out, the Reichskommissariats there would fight against South Africa and Japan. You could insert the extrmination story there in case of a German victory or a ceasefire, as Hüttig takes over and begins his Aryanisation and purification camapaigns. Also, the overstretch mentioned by many Japanese could be either this war or, in cae of a complete victory, the fact that Japan is embroiled in an attempt to pacify most of the continent. The north of the continent can also be largely kept like it is in TNO.
- In the United States, you could have perhaps a civil war having broken outin the 1930s, which allowed the Germans and the Japanese to intervene in the conflict after they had finished their wars elsewere and divide the area. Most of the country east of the Rocky Mountains would initially be under the control of a coalition of various right-wing and coservative groups (the National Party), led by a generally authoritarian government. However, the nascent fascist and national socialist movements would demand more power for themeselves. Then, when the German economy collapses in the 1950s, the more independent-minded members of America's ruling coalition, perhaps tired of Germany's overbearing behaviour in the previous years could try to regain full independence. But this plan is stopped in its tracks by Berlin and its local allies, who organise a coup. The result is a new government in the United States with a distinctly National Socialist undertone. George Lincoln Rockwell, the main leader of the national socialists becomes the head of state; the National Party retains its control of the government, but the fascist and national socialist elements inside it gain more power and influence. Furthermore, the SS, already prominent in America, as they were the ones who bore the brunt of the German intervention in the civil war, gain more influence too, to the consternation of many who view the organisation as a backdoor for Germany to exert control. John Smith becomes the first American to take the title of Obergruppenführer. In 1962, the situation is one of tense peace, as the government is divided between a large group of by-nessecity collaborators who want to get rid of or at least considerably reduce German influence, fascists and national socialists who in turn are divided between the more Germanophile ones, those who want an independent fascist/nazi America and those who think that America (and Germany in some cases) hasn't pushed enough to achieve true National Socialism. The resistance movement, although kept under control thanks to a combination of a relatively good economy and strict policing, still persists and is largely supported by the Japanese, who want to create trouble for Germany and its allies. (To move more into the MITHC TL, after Himmler's rise to power-see below in Burgundy section, he wants to solidify his influence over what is arguably Germany's most important ally. Therefore, he removes Rockwell and names Smith as his successor, which results in a member of the SS controlling both the Party andthe army and the SS in North America, centralising all powers in the latter.).
- Canada was initially spared and became a neutral state in North America, where many members of the British royal family escaped after Britain's fall. German attempts to force the Canadians to hand over the royals and follow a more pro-German line led to a souring of relations between the two countries and to Canada turning more to Japan for protection against Germany. When the German economy collapsed and the German-backed regime seemed to be on the verge of collapse, Canada actively supported the anti-German factions. This however backfired, as the Germans retained their influence and in retaliation for Canada's actions (but also to eliminate a source of instability for their American ally) invaded the country. Japan protested this move by moving to support Canada. In the end, the country was divided, with most of its territory being annexed to the German-backed American state. In most of British Columbia and Alberta , a rump Canadian state survived under Japanese protection, although it has become de facto part of the Pacific States. The exiled British royals have moved to Vancouver; the Japanese government doesn't want to allow them to move to Australia and/or New Zealand, despite the requests made by Elizabeth II, due to fears that such a move could potentially strengthen the anti-Japanese and pro-independence groups in these two countries.
- West of the Rocky Mountains lie the Pacific States of America, more commonly called the "Japanese Pacific States". Unlike its eastern counterpart, this state was set up following the Japanese invasion of the West Coast, which happened in order to prevent Germany from potentially gaining access to the Pacific through its American ally. During the 1950s, the Japanese began the large-scale settlements of Asians, for multiple reasons: firstly, to weaken the potential opposition of the white majority by changing the local demographics. Another idea behind the move would be to eliminate the threat posed by disloyal subjects such as Chinese and Koreans in Japan's Asian holdings and satellite states by moving them across the Pacific in an area closely controled by the Japanese army and where the latter, unable to find allies in a white population that would likely be generally racist towards the Orientals (at least not in public) and thus be forced to stick with the Japanese authorities. And finally, to ensure the loyalty of the puppet government of the Pacific States. Furthermore, the Pacific States would experience large economic growth, thanks to sustained investment in the area and the development of the oil industry to support Japn's industrial development; but this prosperity, coupled with the fact that the porous border with the neutral zone in the Rocky mountains would make the Pacific States a conduit for lucrative illegal trade with the eastern American state and by extension, the German sphere would attract the attention of both military service branches of Imperial Japan, which would seek to profit and also fight each other for which branch has more rights and jurisdiction over the West Coast. (Later on, the Minazuka scandal and the subsequent governmental and economic crisis would lead the Army and the Navy to step up the operations against its other, as the Navy, leaning closer to Takagi's more liberal positions, wants to liberalise and reform the administration of the Pacific States and change Japanese policy vis-a-vis it, while the Army insists on maintaining the staus quo and even pushing for more direct control. This rivalry would cost the life to a leading proponent of reforms inside the Pacific States, Trade Minister Nobusuke Tagomi).
- East Asia would be under Japan's control through the Co-Prosperity Sphere and its vast collection of puppet states. Depsite its vast power and the fact that it is one of the two superpowers, Japan still face problems in many parts of its empire, with Manchukuo and Mengjiang being the scene of (large scale) warfare between the Japanse-backed regimes and local insurgents , often supported by nearby Russian warlords. China, the breadbasket of the Sphere, has a government that is divided between those who favour the status quo and those who secretly want an independent China and to destroy Japan's empire. There is also spoadic unrest, while in Yunnan, a certain general, Long Yun, plans to strike the puppet regime in Nanjing and free China from the foreigners.
- South Asia is largely under Japan's influence. But India, already fairly independent from Tokyo, is beginning to be less willing to accept Japanese hegemony and is beginning to aspire itself to become the next Asian power.
- The Middle East is divided: while a large part of the region is controlled, either directly or through various puppet regimes, by Italy, Turkey has also greatly expanded in Syria and Iraqi Kurdistan. Saudi Arabia remains neutral and sells oil to everyone who can pay while Iran is rather closely tied to Germany.
- Europe is divided between Germany and Italy. Britain is balkanised, with the Kingdom of England and the republics of Scottland and Wales being independent states. France has been reduced in size by the creation of Brittany and the Order State of Burgundy, while it is unable to effectively control its colonial empire. The Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia, Slovakia, the Netherlands, Denmark, Norway, Sweden and Finland are all tied to Germany politically, economically or militarily, to a larger or lesser extent. Poland, the Baltic states, Belarus, Ukraine, the Caucasus region and European Russia are all colonial territories of the Reich.
- Italy controls most of the western Balkans through a series of puppet states (Croatia, Greece) or states in personal union with the Italian crown (Albania, Montenegro). It still remains a rather loose and unwilling . ally of Germany (although the Germans still insist to depict it in their maps as being a full ally). Alongside Iberia and Turkey, it has formed the Triumvirate, as an informal mutual security alliance to act as a counterweight to German power, which however is quite unstable, while it covertly competes with Germany for influence in the Balkans, which are divided between Italy's aforementioned puppets, Germany's remaining allies in the area (Serbia and Bulgaria) and Hungary and Romania, which have become neutral after leaving Germany's bloc in the mid 1950s. The country also suffers greatly from the destruction caused by the Antlantropa project.
- Germany had a bumpy road after the war. When the Führer fell ill in 1948 and many thought that his death was imminent, there was near civil war, which was only averted by the Party's alliance with the SS and the Führer's recovery. After that came the economic collapse of the 1950s, which nearly destroyed the Reich. In 1962, Germany is only a superficial superpower: its empire, covering half the world, is in fact teetering on the verge of collapse; its army is at first glance, the largest and best in the world, but in reality it is a an expensve and bloated mess. Berlin exemplifies this best, as it is a magnificent and luxurious front covering a decaying and declining Germany. The country is at crossroads, with its economy frozen, its people on the streets demonstrating and demanding changes and its government bitterly divided between many factions: Speer's reformists inside the Party, the army, the business world and the people, who want to change the Reich dramatically in almost every way, Bormann's conservatives who think that while Germany may need to change, it must maintain National Socialism at all costs, Goebbels' fanatical National Socialists who think that the solution is more National Socialism and related ideas - including war, this time directed against Japan, Germany's superpower enemy, Göring's alliance of opportunists that want power and power alone and Heydrich's SS, suspected by many to be Himmler's instrument to bring about the changes he considers necessary in Germany, while their leader wants to get rid of his overbearing and often eccentric former superior.
- The Order State of Burgundy was created in 1948, after the crisis inside the German government that led to the consolidation of the Party's leading position, during which the SS, under Himmler's control, attempted to wrestle power from the Party and their other opponents. Having to face the army, the Party was forced to reach an agreement with Himmler to secure his support; in exchange, the Order State of Burgundy was created out of Belgium and much of northern and eastern France. Himmler agreed after some arm-twisting, to give up his command of the German SS and become the leader of the new state, which he intended to turn into the ideal Aryan state. Heydrich succeeded him as the de-facto head of the German-SS. Initially, Himmler tried to remain involved in German domestic affairs and in 1955, with the eich paralysed by crisis, tried for a second time to gain power for himself; he was stopped however and forced to retreat in Burgundy, abandoning any offices he may have held in Germany until then. From then on, Burgundy became the hermit kingdom, with Himmler cutting many ties to Berlin and preparing for the next turn. He still has some clout however, as some in Germany think that he may be the only one who could restrain Heydrich or even bring the SS on their side and therefore, are willing to negotiate with him. (We could use this as justification for Himmler's prsesence in MITHC but remaining in line with the general ideas of TNO: Heydrich, in an effort to also gain total control of the SS, conspired with Heusmann. Once Heydrich got eliminated, he approached Himmler, whom he managed to bring back to Berlin for having managed to "expose" Heydrich's conspiracy. Himmler then sets on consolidating his position and in the end, after removing Heusmann, manoeuvers himself in the position of the Führer).
Considering how hope and bash the fash are major themes in TNO, how does that Gel with a world where the Axis rules everything? Would the OFN equivalent be confined to South America because I can't think of a good reason why Germany would fuck around there aside from some map painting.
Regarding this bit, considering how it seems like every member of the German sphere shits itself, maybe the US simply breaks away and forms a new bloc. Depending on who takes power they probably won't return Speer's calls
@Tanaka did nothing wrong, my compliments on producing so coherent a merge of these two horrible, horrible timelines!
that was my favorite part of the TV series and I'm very much interested in the TNO Coprosperity sphere which is more plausible than what was shown in the show
In tno the Japanese have atomic bombs