Challenge: City of Rome Stands to Today

Challenge-

Today, we remember ancient Rome as ruins, such as the forums, coliseum, and old aquaducts.

The Challenge is to have the City of Rome, including the Coliseum, Circus Maximus, The Forums, Trajan's Forum, Temple of Jupiter, and Nero's Golden House stand today as they were in ancient Roman times.
 
Challenge-

Today, we remember ancient Rome as ruins, such as the forums, coliseum, and old aquaducts.

The Challenge is to have the City of Rome, including the Coliseum, Circus Maximus, The Forums, Trajan's Forum, Temple of Jupiter, and Nero's Golden House stand today as they were in ancient Roman times.

I think you need a surviving Roman Empire for this.
 
I think more than a surviving Roman Empire is needed, I think you need the alien space bats. Therefore, you know where this thread should be moved to...
 
Do you mean that the building have to be in use, or that they need to survive intact as historical monuments? The former is difficult. The latter could be doable, I think.
 
One possibility is have the city not get trashed during the Gothic wars. That's what really did a number on the old cities of the Roman Empire in Italy.
 
Looting was also a heavy part of what destroyed many ancient structures. The people of the areas of all these grand structures, in the Dark Ages, took material from the ancient structures and used them to construct houses and buildings themselves. The Catholic church had to intervene at one point to save the Coliseum. The story that the Coliseum was a site where Christians were thrown to the lion's, historically false, was actually concocted by the Catholic church to make it a kind of holy site and therefore pillaging it further taboo. So you need to stop material pillaging after the fall of Rome if the empire still falls.
 
Have the Romans retake Palmyra like OTL but have the Gallic Empire successfully secede. Then the Roman Empire would be smaller, more centralized, more connected, richer, and without too much of a barbarian threat.

Then the Roman Empire survives in some form or another far longer than OTL.
 
Challenge-

Today, we remember ancient Rome as ruins, such as the forums, coliseum, and old aquaducts.

The Challenge is to have the City of Rome, including the Coliseum, Circus Maximus, The Forums, Trajan's Forum, Temple of Jupiter, and Nero's Golden House stand today as they were in ancient Roman times.

So there can be no fires, earthquakes, flood, civil disturbance, variations in weather, humidity, laws of physics, nor changes of religion or government, and a population that is so totally conservative yet un-energetic that they would refrain from changing anything at all for 2,000 years but muster the will to maintain every single building in the city exactly as it is.

I'll have to think about that for a while to come up with an answer, but I'm leaning towards Roman scientists accidentally breed giant spiders that encase the entire city in impenetrable silk that preserves the city until the present, when it is uncovered and put back into use.
 
OK. I think I can do a few. There will probably be minor alterations, but they will be essentially as they were:

1. Coliseum: have it become 'sacred to the memory of Christian Martyrs' earlier and used by the Church as a location to make announcements, hold festivities etc.

2. Circus Maximus: Given to the army who use it as a parade ground and training centre for the cavalry. Given the post Roman collapse I doubt it would need extending for a long time.

3. Temple of Jupiter: Conversion into a Church during the late Empire. May be extended later, but (like the Pantheon) could be maintained.

4. Golden House: One of the more difficult ones (half the building was pulled down by the Romans). Perhaps have it incoroporated as part of the palace of the Rulers of Rome?

5. Forums: These are just going to change IMO. I can probably have a few structures (the Curia, some of the monuments, a couple of the Basilicas and maybe a temple or two) survive by having them be converted to Churches or utilised as administrative buildings. However, the forums themselves will change.
 
OK. I think I can do a few. There will probably be minor alterations, but they will be essentially as they were:

1. Coliseum: have it become 'sacred to the memory of Christian Martyrs' earlier and used by the Church as a location to make announcements, hold festivities etc.

2. Circus Maximus: Given to the army who use it as a parade ground and training centre for the cavalry. Given the post Roman collapse I doubt it would need extending for a long time.

3. Temple of Jupiter: Conversion into a Church during the late Empire. May be extended later, but (like the Pantheon) could be maintained.

4. Golden House: One of the more difficult ones (half the building was pulled down by the Romans). Perhaps have it incoroporated as part of the palace of the Rulers of Rome?

5. Forums: These are just going to change IMO. I can probably have a few structures (the Curia, some of the monuments, a couple of the Basilicas and maybe a temple or two) survive by having them be converted to Churches or utilised as administrative buildings. However, the forums themselves will change.

Realistically, there's no way you're going to have all the buildings preserved. The OP is ASB. Even Constantinople prior to 1204 had buildings disappear or be replaced - it's just the way living cities operate.

In the case of Rome, you need to have the city not be abandoned for so long. If it had been in continuous use from antiquity, no doubt more of its monumental structures would have been converted to other use and preserved.

That's less likely for things like the Colosseum or any hippodromes, as the activities they were used for fell out of favor and were not really replaced by anything.

Rome is especially difficult because it's built on swampy and malarial land that needs a lot of work to keep in operation, and it was so freakin' huge.
 
The only change that I think would work outside of massive PODs would be as someone else said, more religious use of existing buildings and some sort of development of a restoration movement within the church. The Pantheon still seems to be in fine shape, with a couple of exceptions. It was quite spooky to walk through it, knowing how old it was. Same with Hadrian's Tomb

The best POD is of course AHP's. I would suggest that the Spiders also be bred to exude some sort of miasma of forgetfulness, so local Romans or visitors do not become too distressed at the loss of Rome to the Spider People.

Edit - one change would be the construction of a proper Embankment along the Tiber (like it has now). That would massively reduce flood damage. I have no idea if this was achievable pre 19th century when the current one was built
 
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Realistically, there's no way you're going to have all the buildings preserved. The OP is ASB. Even Constantinople prior to 1204 had buildings disappear or be replaced - it's just the way living cities operate.

In the case of Rome, you need to have the city not be abandoned for so long. If it had been in continuous use from antiquity, no doubt more of its monumental structures would have been converted to other use and preserved.

That's less likely for things like the Colosseum or any hippodromes, as the activities they were used for fell out of favor and were not really replaced by anything.

Rome is especially difficult because it's built on swampy and malarial land that needs a lot of work to keep in operation, and it was so freakin' huge.

Yeah. It's just an idea. As I said, the only way I can think of the Circus Maximus surviving is for it to be given a military usage, and even then it'll probably fall to pieces. It's very much an either or scenario. Theoretically the Temple of Jupiter and some of the forum structures could be converted and remain in use at the same time, with the Coliseum becoming less ruinous than it is OTL, but the Golden House is definately going to go in such a scenario.
 

Vitruvius

Donor
Realistically, there's no way you're going to have all the buildings preserved. The OP is ASB. Even Constantinople prior to 1204 had buildings disappear or be replaced - it's just the way living cities operate.

In the case of Rome, you need to have the city not be abandoned for so long. If it had been in continuous use from antiquity, no doubt more of its monumental structures would have been converted to other use and preserved.

That's less likely for things like the Colosseum or any hippodromes, as the activities they were used for fell out of favor and were not really replaced by anything.

Rome is especially difficult because it's built on swampy and malarial land that needs a lot of work to keep in operation, and it was so freakin' huge.

Thank you this is more or less what I was going to say. Though as an Architect I do appreciate this thread. There should be more Architectural PODs. Anyways cities are organic and constantly evolving and to expect one to remain unchanged is unrealistic. As pointed out previously the Domus Aurea was already mostly destroyed by the Romans themselves by the time several other monuments on the list were built. Also it would be a shame to lose the rich palimpsest of Roman architecture. The overlay of multiple uses and eras of construction present in many buildings is one of the things that makes the city so Architecturally rich, its like a literal compression of time.

There's definitely some potential with less pillaging and warfare and a more constant population for the city to preserve more of its Imperial monuments. The civil basilicas could be converted to churches, Perhaps the Pope could move into the Palatine and the Circus Maximus could become like modern St Peter's square, a big forecourt to the Papal palace. There are other possibilities but the buildings in question will still be extensively modified/demolished/rebuilt overtime.

A few other random notes:

Roman temples with rare exception (mostly occuring during Baroque times ) were never turned into Churches. The simple fact is that programatically they were not practical. The pagan Roman temple had only a small dark interior space for a cult figure while many rituals were performed outside it. The Christian church required a large gathering space for communal worship. Hence the early Christians turned to the typology of the Roman Basilica. Which is of course why St. Peters is called a basilica. Compare old St Peters to the Basilica Ulpia and you will see the similarity.

Agree on the Gothic wars. Once the aqueducts were destroyed during one of the sieges the water supply was cut to many areas of Rome and the population slowly gravitated towards the Tiber in the area of the campus Martius. It was only by the 17-18th centuries that Romans began to repopulate the Quirinal and other areas to the south and east. Just look at the Nolli Map to see the distribution of built areas.

Another factor affecting the city was shift to peripheral areas. The Christian churches were all at the periphery of the city often fuori la mura (because that's where the martyrs were buried) and so became the center for new development. San Pietro in Vaticano is the best example of this.
 
Thank you this is more or less what I was going to say. Though as an Architect I do appreciate this thread. There should be more Architectural PODs. Anyways cities are organic and constantly evolving and to expect one to remain unchanged is unrealistic. As pointed out previously the Domus Aurea was already mostly destroyed by the Romans themselves by the time several other monuments on the list were built. Also it would be a shame to lose the rich palimpsest of Roman architecture. The overlay of multiple uses and eras of construction present in many buildings is one of the things that makes the city so Architecturally rich, its like a literal compression of time.

There's definitely some potential with less pillaging and warfare and a more constant population for the city to preserve more of its Imperial monuments. The civil basilicas could be converted to churches, Perhaps the Pope could move into the Palatine and the Circus Maximus could become like modern St Peter's square, a big forecourt to the Papal palace. There are other possibilities but the buildings in question will still be extensively modified/demolished/rebuilt overtime.

A few other random notes:

Roman temples with rare exception (mostly occuring during Baroque times ) were never turned into Churches. The simple fact is that programatically they were not practical. The pagan Roman temple had only a small dark interior space for a cult figure while many rituals were performed outside it. The Christian church required a large gathering space for communal worship. Hence the early Christians turned to the typology of the Roman Basilica. Which is of course why St. Peters is called a basilica. Compare old St Peters to the Basilica Ulpia and you will see the similarity.

Agree on the Gothic wars. Once the aqueducts were destroyed during one of the sieges the water supply was cut to many areas of Rome and the population slowly gravitated towards the Tiber in the area of the campus Martius. It was only by the 17-18th centuries that Romans began to repopulate the Quirinal and other areas to the south and east. Just look at the Nolli Map to see the distribution of built areas.

Another factor affecting the city was shift to peripheral areas. The Christian churches were all at the periphery of the city often fuori la mura (because that's where the martyrs were buried) and so became the center for new development. San Pietro in Vaticano is the best example of this.

Lots of good points here. Of course, the Pantheon is the one big exception to the rule on temples. But it was much lighter anyway. Perhaps some of the Temples can become annexes to Churches-storerooms or the base of Belfrys, though this isn't strictly the OP's wishes. It certainly won't be possible to prevent a gradual shift of focus to San Pietro in Vaticano and San Giovanni in Laterno, but it can be reduced without the Gothic Wars.

And I totally agree about how much of Rome's architectural interest comes from old structures being incorporated into newer ones. The Curia Julia, Hadrian's Mausoleum and the Theatre of Marcellus are probably my particular favourites as examples of this.
 
Challenge-

Today, we remember ancient Rome as ruins, such as the forums, coliseum, and old aquaducts.

The Challenge is to have the City of Rome, including the Coliseum, Circus Maximus, The Forums, Trajan's Forum, Temple of Jupiter, and Nero's Golden House stand today as they were in ancient Roman times.

If you mean EXACTLY as in ancient times, then I agree with Abdul Hadi Pasha's rant. But that's no fun. Let's assume you mean that it's OK for the Romans to constantly repair, modify, and update the buildings. In other words, the Colloseum now looks like this:
400px-Stadio_Olimpico_in_Rome.jpg

The Circus Maximus now looks like this:
400px-Vallelunga.race.circuit.in.italy.arp.jpg

The Old Roman Forum now looks like this:
400px-Brunostatue.jpg

Trajan's Forum now looks like this:
3433728699_1145cfe63d.jpg

The Temple of Jupiter now looks like this:
400px-Sistine_Chapel_ceiling_left.png

And Nero's Golden House now looks like this:
400px-Raphael_Heliodorus.jpg


Yeah, I think we could arrange that. :)
 
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