Can the XB-19 produced in quantity?

M79

Maybe it gets an upgraded engine, maybe the US Government gives greater/more timely support, maybe the British think it could serve as an air alternative to some high-value cargo shipping, maybe much better engines become available that make the plane more viable. Is there a legitimate reason why the XB-19 might be produced in quantity in some ATL?

For reference:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_XB-19
 
marathag

marathag

Banned
The USAAC had a blind spot on engine development for large aircraft. Allison was hardly large enough to do single V-12 1710, let alone the X-3420 and V-3420 programs, that were started in 1936, but languished from low priority, only ramped up again after the Wright R-3350 started to show what the mess it was after Pearl Harbor and the interest in the new XB-29

Army was more interested in the Hyper engines, high output from small displacement engines, like from Continental to be put in high performance fighters.

Alison would need to be enlarged, with a lot more in the engineering department. Not impossible, or all that expensive to start in 1937
 
marathag

marathag

Banned
Peg Leg Pom said:
Except the things a sitting duck for any fighter it's likely to encounter.
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The same as any WWII Bomber, really.

Empty weight: 84,431lb
Loaded weight: 140,000lb
Maximum weight: 162,000lb
Normal Range: 5,200 miles
Range: 7,710 miles with 2,500lb payload
Bomb load: 16,000lb internally plus 20,000lb on external racks

It has roughly 78,000 pounds of total payload, and fuel tankage for 68,000 pounds of fuel

So one B-19 could do the job of eight B-17s. Properly escorted, it could carry a couple Earthquake bombs.
 

Draconis

I think it would have been a little too low and slow for operations in Europe. If it had been fitted out with the turbocharged Allison V-3420s then the B-19 would have been a little faster at a little higher altitude. But perhaps not enough. But I think the B-19 would have been better suited for the Pacific and/or the China-India-Burma theatre. What with it's very long range. A super Liberator so to speak.

OTOH with its long range and endurance it might also have made an excellent U-boat hunter which could have been used to close the Mid-Atlantic gap.
 

TonyA

Draconis said:
OTOH with its long range and endurance it might also have made an excellent U-boat hunter which could have been used to close the Mid-Atlantic gap.
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What a thought...how many depth charges, mines, and later, FIDO's, could have been toted by that airframe? Maybe even some thru fuselage recoilless rifles for pylon turn shooting, a la COIN AC-47's.
 
marathag

marathag

Banned
B-19 has the Payload for this
178px-RUR-4A_round.jpg

525 pounds of rocket propelled fun with 250 pound warhead
Originally known as Weapon Able, this was later known as Weapon Alfa or Alpha. The original Mark 108 launcher was based on the twin 40 mm Bofors gun mount and weighed 22,760 lbs. (10,324 kg). The later, purpose-built mounting had a weight of 25,240 lbs. (11,450 kg). Weapon Alfa could fire 12 rounds per minute and held 22 rounds in a ready-service ring. Train rate was 30 degrees per second, maximum elevation was 85 degrees.
 

TonyA

Carl Schwamberger said:
Or a mass of rockets or small 25kg bombs. Saturate the target area.
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Not crazy about the rocket idea, too much like strafing, and I would think maybe too much exposure to AAA for a valuable airframe. Maybe a downward Schrage Musik type installation...German subs were carrying a fair AAA suite late in the war. But, lotsa small bombs always seemed like a winner to me. Always wondered why we didn't attack cargo vessels and smaller warships with clustered incendiaries. Carriers as well...
 

Dave Shoup

Banned
M79 said:
Maybe it gets an upgraded engine, maybe the US Government gives greater/more timely support, maybe the British think it could serve as an air alternative to some high-value cargo shipping, maybe much better engines become available that make the plane more viable. Is there a legitimate reason why the XB-19 might be produced in quantity in some ATL? For reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_XB-19
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Could it? Yes.

Would it? Depends on many things, but given that by the time the prototype was in the air, better designs were in hand, pretty much suggests that beyond serving as a proof of concept, it was a dead end.
 

BlueTrousers

M79 said:
Is there a legitimate reason why the XB-19 might be produced in quantity in some ATL?
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The B-19 or B-20 (an improved XB-15) might conceivably see service if the United States gets dragged into a war where a long-range bomber is needed in 1939-1940 rather than 1944-1945. I've seen a TL where the 1937 Panay Incident led to a war between the US and Japan that saw this happen.
 

Peg Leg Pom

marathag said:
So one B-19 could do the job of eight B-17s. Properly escorted, it could carry a couple Earthquake bombs.
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At a speed and altitude that puts it in the ideal engagement zone of enemy ack ack and leaves it vulnerable not just to modern monoplane fighters but last generation bi plane fighters as well.
 
marathag

marathag

Banned
yulzari said:
So a cruising B19 could be outrun by a Fairey swordfish going flat out.
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But would be up to 7700 miles with full fuel load and a ton of bombs, so the crew would be able to go back to the galley, eat a meal, and then hit the bunks and sleep it off before finishing the mission.

When it finally got the long delayed V-3420s, cruise went up to 179mph.
 
marathag

marathag

Banned
Peg Leg Pom said:
At a speed and altitude that puts it in the ideal engagement zone of enemy ack ack and leaves it vulnerable not just to modern monoplane fighters but last generation bi plane fighters as well.
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Lucky the Germans put the last of them to ground attack on the Russian Front.

For Flak, its errors in judging altitude, rather than speed that provides protection. It would be flying at Sterling or Liberator altitude.
 

TonyA

Seriously, before any actual use, the 19's going to need more powerful engines, not that it's actually going to run into any Spads or Albatrosses over the mid-Atlantic...
Oh, and the Sopwith Camel with the Beagle in the cockpit is on our side.
 
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