British East Indies, the Crown Jewel of Empire

I have been strangely fascinated with this concept for long time although I have no idea is there even any sense behind it. Anyway, the basic idea is that Britain somehow gets modern Indonesia while doesn't have any areas in India. What sort of POD could produce something like this? I was thinking France doing better in the War of Austrian Succession or the Seven Years' War. Later Britain could try to compensate the loss of India by expanding its influence in East Indies. I must admit though that my knowledge is rather limited when it comes to effects of those wars in Asia.

It would be also interesting to hear your ideas how Britain having East Indies would affect British culture.
 

ingemann

Banned
Complete French victory in some war in the 18th century with a annexation of Netherlands and crushing the British in India, and peace treaty where Britain have to accept this against getting the Dutch East Indies.
 

Japhy

Banned
IIRC the Dutch had a better time hooking up with Local leaders in Indonesia and in wiping out British settlements in the region. Just like the British developed a better habit of doing such in India. Not being able to delve into specifics it doesn't seem impossible for the British to be able to win over more local monarchs in the early days of the European presence in the East Indies. If the DEIC is delayed a few years or have a harder time building momentum due to the conflict with Spain and Portugal the British can entrench themselves better.
 
If we go earlier, to say 1650, we can just avoid having the Mughal Empire stagnate to the degree that it did. Stagnation was the biggest reason Britain was able to capitalize on India, and even having multiple small states would have seen nothing similar like it, since technologically, we'd see even footing, anyways. This makes Indonesia a bigger prize and thus diverts British attention there, with ports around India being the default holdings for most colonial powers.
 
If the Mughal Empire had not started its decline by the beginning of the 18th century but had lasted longer up to the 19th century, the British would not have obtained the chance they got in the OTL. This was not too difficult either. Had Dara Shikoh won the battle of succession after Shah Jahan and Aurangzeb was killed, the fortune of the Mughals would have changed. Dara was a very tolerant prince and would have maintained better relations with Hindu powers like the Rajputs, the Mahrattas and the Sikhs. Sulaiman Shikoh, the eldest son of Dara Shikoh was also an able and brave prince. The Empire under their rule had more chances of survival than under the despotic and fanatic Aurangzeb.
Under such a situation, the British might have turned their attention to the East Indies. In a competition with the British, the Dutch would have lost out and a British East Indies would have resulted.
 
Tipu Sultan survives and while the British and French are distracted by the Napolionic Wars launches a masive and successfull attack on the Honourable East India Company's posesions. This prompts other Indian rulers to do the same and the europeans are driven out.

Later on when the Netherlands fall to the French and the British take over the East Indies they decide to keep them rather than hand them back after the war.
 
Later on when the Netherlands fall to the French and the British take over the East Indies they decide to keep them rather than hand them back after the war.
Not too hard, IIRC when the British took over the place during the Napoleonic wars to deny them to the French before giving them back afterwards their administration was actually more popular with the locals than the previous Dutch one due to some of the reforms they introduced that they asked to not be given back. If the Honourable East India Company has been ejected from India or never really managed to establish their presence to as large a degree as our timeline I could easily see the British doing like they did with the Cape Colony and deciding to keep the place.
 
A PoD during the 17th century may be good. If the English get more stuck in during the Dutch-Portuguese War, they may be able to snag a few colonies here and there. Of course, Anglo-Dutch rivalry in the East Indies would result in a few wars, which the English (later British, going by the OP) would eventually win, and take control of the East Indies, maybe going all out and grabbing Formosa, Deshima and some trading posts in Indochina also.

Similarly, a more stable India - not quite Gurkani Alam levels, but still not very week - would lead to Europeans staying in their trading posts, bidding for influence amongst the local courts, but not being given the rights to collect taxes etc.
 
If the Mughal Empire had not started its decline by the beginning of the 18th century but had lasted longer up to the 19th century, the British would not have obtained the chance they got in the OTL. This was not too difficult either. Had Dara Shikoh won the battle of succession after Shah Jahan and Aurangzeb was killed, the fortune of the Mughals would have changed. Dara was a very tolerant prince and would have maintained better relations with Hindu powers like the Rajputs, the Mahrattas and the Sikhs. Sulaiman Shikoh, the eldest son of Dara Shikoh was also an able and brave prince. The Empire under their rule had more chances of survival than under the despotic and fanatic Aurangzeb.
Under such a situation, the British might have turned their attention to the East Indies. In a competition with the British, the Dutch would have lost out and a British East Indies would have resulted.
Hell, if we have Prince Akbar win against Aurangzeb when he rebelled, it would have worked out better as well. Essentially, all you need is consolidation, and the area becomes impenetrable. I mean Tippu Sultan did get to Madras, and that's mainly because Mysore was a strong, consolidated state.
 
I've always like the late, Napoleonic PoDs to achieve it. I wonder if we can kill Napoleon shortly-to-immediately after Austerlitz or Tilsit, though basically anytime can ensure Netherlands staying under French thumb permanently.

More pressingly, it has never been discussed how will Post-Napoleonic British Indonesia effect things globally, especially over the later Scramble for China and general European Oriental policy and colonial expansion pattern.
 
Honestly for this sort of things, a rigid POD should be established, or at least a certain time period, because a lot more can change from the period before. I mean, a stronger Mughal Empire might look at the Indies with just as much interest, while Mysore might, too. But by Napoleonic times, this gets shifted out of the equation.
 
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