British canal system modernised and widened as per that of Germany, Netherlands and France

[DougM]

The challenge is the locks. They are very very expensive to build and huge locks like those described above take amazing amounts of water and that can be a huge issue as the water has to come from somewhere. And ultimately has to get to the top of the system either by nature (which is rare in the quantity needed for the huge locks’ or is needs to be pumped (expensive to run). The smaller locks of the narrow canals use a lot less water and thus nature pretty much can keep up with the requirements and thus things are inexpensive to run.
Also one deep lock tacks a lot longer to fill and lift one of two boats then 4 shorter locks do. As I can have a boat or two in the 2nd or later locks and put another boat in lock 1. Vs having to wait until the lock is cleared if I only have one deep lock. Add in if I have passing basins between locks I can have boats going down and up at the same time. And no you can’t just fill the locks faster as you can only fill them so fast or the in rush will damage the smaller boats. And this new system will have to support the smaller narrow boats for years after the expansion assuming you expand the whole system and almost forever if you only expand some of the system.
plus tge huge deep locks require a lot more advanced tech for the doors as they have to seal tighter and be a lot stronger as the pressure is much much higher on a deep lock.. So the cost to build and operate and maintain the doors (which will have to be powered also) is going to go up a lot.
So this ne system is not just going to be expensive to build but is going to be expensive to run.
And frankly I am not sure how much use expanding the existing system is when you have to replace every thing. And go deeper and wider on the canals themselves. And as a side issue a lot of canals had buildings up against one side (non tow path side) or other obstructions that would have to be torn down to widen them. And the final issue to be overcome is that you will put the canal out of business for a year or more to expand it.
So a a buisness owner I have to either find a replacement for the cana for a year or three or shut down while you expand in hopes that ultimately I can use bigger boats or rafts? If you put me out of buisness because I can’t ship anything in or out for two years I won’t need the canal no matter how inexpensive shipping on it is.

 

[CB13]

Just off top of my head....

If I was a British canal owner, I would host a meeting with canal owners from France, Germany, Holland and Belgium to look at an integrated international transportation system where they agree on a "Canal-MAX" barge size to be transitioned to over a period of 10 years. That way it would give them significant time to design and build the new locks, barges, warehouses, depots, etc. Of note, if they were smart they would further agree to share the cost of designing and engineering those locks and barges (build with flexible engine mounts for multiple engine options) with all partners having full access to the final blueprints which they can then contract out for construction wherever is most economical to them.

In terms of funding these major investments, there are many options but one could be to sell shares in the upgraded canal companies to both the businesses most likely to use it (and profit from it) and to the districts that are most likely to benefit from it (jobs). That way instead of trying to get loans from the big banks who may have vested interests in the security of the railroads, the canal companies go directly and raise capital from the entities most likely to benefit from the new system.

Two Key Competitive Advantages:
1. Significant savings in manpower as can avoid two extra loading and unloading steps from railcars to ships to railcars.
2. Depending upon final barge design, an ability to carry larger and heavier items than railcars.

That's all I've got from this coffee. Maybe I'll think of more later...

 

[PMN1]

The challenge is the locks. They are very very expensive to build and huge locks like those described above take amazing amounts of water and that can be a huge issue as the water has to come from somewhere. And ultimately has to get to the top of the system either by nature (which is rare in the quantity needed for the huge locks’ or is needs to be pumped (expensive to run). The smaller locks of the narrow canals use a lot less water and thus nature pretty much can keep up with the requirements and thus things are inexpensive to run.
Also one deep lock tacks a lot longer to fill and lift one of two boats then 4 shorter locks do. As I can have a boat or two in the 2nd or later locks and put another boat in lock 1. Vs having to wait until the lock is cleared if I only have one deep lock. Add in if I have passing basins between locks I can have boats going down and up at the same time. And no you can’t just fill the locks faster as you can only fill them so fast or the in rush will damage the smaller boats. And this new system will have to support the smaller narrow boats for years after the expansion assuming you expand the whole system and almost forever if you only expand some of the system.
plus tge huge deep locks require a lot more advanced tech for the doors as they have to seal tighter and be a lot stronger as the pressure is much much higher on a deep lock.. So the cost to build and operate and maintain the doors (which will have to be powered also) is going to go up a lot.
So this ne system is not just going to be expensive to build but is going to be expensive to run.
And frankly I am not sure how much use expanding the existing system is when you have to replace every thing. And go deeper and wider on the canals themselves. And as a side issue a lot of canals had buildings up against one side (non tow path side) or other obstructions that would have to be torn down to widen them. And the final issue to be overcome is that you will put the canal out of business for a year or more to expand it.
So a a buisness owner I have to either find a replacement for the cana for a year or three or shut down while you expand in hopes that ultimately I can use bigger boats or rafts? If you put me out of buisness because I can’t ship anything in or out for two years I won’t need the canal no matter how inexpensive shipping on it is.

Valid concerns but they do not seem to have affected the modernisation and widening in Germany, Netherlands and France.

 

[Reggieperrin]

If I was a British canal owner, I would host a meeting with canal owners from France, Germany, Holland and Belgium to look at an integrated international transportation system where they agree on a "Canal-MAX" barge size to be transitioned to over a period of 10 years.

I’m going to guess that the proposed British Canal-MAX would be received with ”you mean, a small barge”? No idea how big they were historically but these days one of the standard sizes is 70m x 9.5m x 2.5m draft (Europa 1) and potentially in job lots.

Based on the towage technique2, the pushing unit is formed by a variable number of non-motorized barges interlinked with a tug. Depending on the waterway prospects, different formations are possible. On the Lower Rhine, on the ARA port relations (Amsterdam, Rotterdam, and Antwerp) and the Ruhr area, up to 6 European barges can be connected. On the Middle and Lower Danube, a pushing unit with up to 9 interlinked barges can be used. As the “lead ship” for the extension of the international cargo traffic relevant canal system (waterway class Vb), the single-lane, two-part pushing unit with the following dimensions was determined: length 185 m, width 11.40 m, maximum loaded draft 2.80 m, tonnage capacity ca. 3,600 t.

AIUI that’s basically the equivalent function to coastal shipping - what goes by canal/river in US/Europe goes on the coastal shipping in UK. Never being further than 70 miles from the sea means British rivers are smaller but you can just use the ocean instead.
From:https://www.project-emma.eu/sites/default/files/EMMA_Act. 2.2. Report_final.pdf

Valid concerns but they do not seem to have affected the modernisation and widening in Germany, Netherlands and France.

From my very very limited exposure the canals seem to have much less drop and be connected to larger rivers. So instead of having to fill a lock say 1.5m high you might need only 50cm, and there is a big river to do it. I think another factor may be that in some places the canals are an adjunct to the river trade and are expanded to not restrict that, rather than having to be profitable as a standalone.

 

[yulzari]

If you have a mix of a few large continental size canals and several small old size ones it might prompt some form of standard containerisation to ease trans shipment between the two.

 

[PMN1]

Does anyone know what size and capacity the largest horse drawn barge was, not just the UK but elsewhere as well.