Boeing 2707 SST rescued by Japan ?

Archibald

Banned
It's an interesting tidbit I've run into doing research for my space TL.
https://www.google.fr/webhp?hl=fr#hl=fr&q=%22SST%22%22ataka+trading%22

When Congress canned the Boeing 2707 on March 25, 1971, a Japanese trading company with the name of Ataka stepped in. They proposed to buy everything left (mockup, molds, patents) to produce the 2707 in Japan. The proposal was not entirely serious and was rapidly rejected by both governments.

But could Japan have rescued the Boeing 2707-300 ? Mitsubishi had produced Starfighters, Phantoms under licence. As for indigenous designs, the YS-11 and C-1 transports, the F1 / T-2 supersonic aircrafts were build.

Might be fun if Boeing and Mitsubishi build three 2707 prototypes together. According to Flight International the SST prototype was to fly in November 1972.
 
Last edited:
it would fascinate to see this
special if this join venture happened bevor March 25, 1971.
so like Boeing show capitol Hill "He guys, we have here a international Join Venture here, if you stop that we want compensation..."
 

Archibald

Banned
I'm thinking about three prototypes build as demonstrators.

I wonder if the 2707-300 could earn money on the Tokyo - LA route ?
A bit like Concorde did on the North Atlantic route - it found a niche.
unfortunately range was too short, it would have to stop in Hawaii.
At least there's no issues with sonic boom above the Pacific.

P.S Michel, check your inbox !
 
Last edited:
the Route Tokyo, Hawaii, Los Angeles would be very desired.

With range of 7871 km the 2700 are unable to reach Tokyo from Los Angelis non stop.
But Hawaii only 2 hours away from Los Angeles and from there Tokyo in 2.5 hours.
also is route New York - Rio de Janeiro also very attractive.
together with route New York, London, Paris

the Jetset and VIPs would become global with only 3 hours flight time
in morning out bed in Paris, day trip to New York and evening back in Paris.
 
Last edited:
I don't see it happening, one of the US's major fears during the Fs-x program in the 80s was that Japan would get the technology needed to build a commercial aircraft industry to rival America's. Congress delayed the project two years in order to make sure that never happened. I can't imagine the US wanting Japan to build a Super sonic aircraft to dominate pacific air travel.


thats to bad because that has the potential to be more lucrative than atlantic air travel. super sonic aircraft might have caught on for travel.
 
Fs-x program that was very sick political move by Capitol Hill and almost destroy the Japanese USA relation.
but that was in 1980s, here Japan was strong and giving Hard Time to US economy crippled by US politic and Bad Management in Industry.

here we have 1970s were US Industry is still strong.
Japan is consider as a "trainee" in Aerospace technology, they license the F-104 and Delta Rocket build by Mitsubishi.
So why not license the Boeing 2707 SST ? including Co-financing R&D by Japanese MITT together Boeing.
 

Archibald

Banned
here is a little bit of alternate history I've just written - that was fun.

The three Boeing SST build in collaboration with Japan each have a name – Kounotori (Stork), Hayabusa (Falcon) and Hien(Swallow). They have been built in Seattle and flown to Japan via Transpacific routes. The Boeing 2707 cruise speed is of 1800 miles per hour - 2896 kilometer per hour, Mach 2.73 or 0.8 km per second.

Consideration has been seriously given to an experimental transpacific supersonic airline. Main issue when flying the 2707-300 from Tokyo to the West Coast is that range is too short. The 2707-300 has to stop either in Anchorage (northern air way) or in Hawaii (southern air way) before flying to Los Angeles or Seattle.

The direct road from Tokyo to Los Angeles is 5500 miles long.

Tokyo to Hawaii is 4000 miles, Hawaii to L.A is 2500 miles.

Tokyo to Anchorage is 3460 miles; Anchorage to L.A, 2342 miles.

The three 2707s will be operated by NASA in the United States and by the National Aerospace Laboratory in Japan. When building the 2707-300 Boeing and the Japanese gained experience is designing very large (300 feet long), titanium, fast aircraft. Thus the Boeing 2707, as build, might be more than a supersonic airliner. It might become the first stage of an aerospace transporter. Next step would be to replace the GE-4 turbofans by either ramjets or liquid-air rocket engines. In fact NASA and the NAL are currently exploring a first step in that direction.

The 'Mu-3SII' next-generation satellite launch vehicle currently under development in Japan has as its baseline configuration a three-stage winged rocket of 52,000 kg mass and 17-m length. Studies have been conducted for Mu-3SII launch modes from the ground, balloon, or aircraft; attention is presently given to the latter, using a Boeing 747 airliner as the launching mothercraft at 10 km altitude. From the 200 m/sec imparted by the mothercraft, Mu-3SII can deliver 1000 kg of payload into a 250-km circular orbit. This air-launch concept is noteworthy in that it will relax current Japanese spacecraft launch constraints due to heavy coastal sea traffic.

By replacing the 747 with a 2707, very important gains could be made. Indeed a recent study by concluded that at an altitude of 15250m, a rocket launch with the carrier vehicle having a zero launch velocity at an angle of attack of 0° to the horizontal experienced a Δv benefit of approximately 600m/s. The zero launch velocity situations can be used to represent the launch from a balloon as it has no horizontal velocity. A launch at a velocity of 340m/s at the same altitude and angle of attack resulted in a Δv benefit of approximately 900m/s. Furthermore, by increasing the angle of attack of the carrier vehicle to 30° and launching at 340m/s, a Δv gain of approximately 1100m/s was obtained. Increasing the launch velocity to 681m/s and 1021m/s produced a Δv gain of 1600m/s and 2000m/s respectively.

Launching a Mu-3SII from a Boeing 2707 would be an early step in the direction of a fully reusable two-stage to orbit vehicle.
 
Last edited:

Archibald

Banned
Perhaps Imperial Iran could become involved in some capacity, such as financing and/or orders. Iran Air was the last airline to cancel its options on the Concorde and the Shah was making major industrial investments frequently throughout the 1970s.

I even wrote a mini-timeline of sorts in which the Shah and Iran Air save the Concorde.

Shazam. Looks like foreign interest in the SST assets was not limited to Ataka. Request were received from West Germany and... Middle East.

http://www.newspapers.com/newspage/61582661/
 
Didn't Mcdonald Douglas send jigs and tools to japan so that they could build MD 80s over there?
 
Top