Part of a Marine Nationale Since 1960 TL
Alternative Submarine Q244/Q251
I've wanked the development of the French nuclear submarine reactor. Therefore, Q251 wasn't cancelled in 1959 and was completed in the first half of the 1960s as an SSN.
Or it was decided to complete her as an SSBN. I'd like her to be built to the same design as Le Redoutable, but it's more likely that she'd be a "super Gymnotte". That is her hull would be cut in half and a new centre section accommodating 16 tubes for M-1 MSBS missiles like the American George Washington class. In common with the OTL Gymnote she'd be completed in 1966, but would not fire the first M-1 missile until 1968 and like Le Redoutable wouldn't be declared operational until the end of 1970.
However, it also means that the French would have 3 operational SSBNs in 1973, 4 in 1974, 5 in 1976 and 6 in 1980 compared to 2, 3, 4 and 5 in those years.
The OTL Gymnote was decommissioned in 1986 and I also think that the TTL Gymnote would also have been paid off in 1986. This was because L' Inflexible was still built ITTL. However, rather than being built to bring the SNLE up to a force of 6 ships it was decided that given the age of and non-standard design of Gymnote it was more cost effective to build a new ship armed with the M-4 missile, rather than rearm her with the missile.
Alternative Agosta class Submarines
They were built as SSNs and were additional units of the Rubis class in all but name.
Alternative Clemenceau class Aircraft Carriers
Three ships built to the larger PA58 design. That is two instead of the OTL Clemenceau & Foch. The third was built instead of the OTL PA58 which was cancelled in the late 1950s. They were laid down 1955-59, launched 1957-61 and completed 1961-65. The last ship replaced Arromanches, which became the nuclear testing flagship in 1966 in place of De Grasse.
Each ship operated 20 F-8E(FN) Crusaders and 40 Etendard IVM/P plus a mix of up to 20 fixed-wing aircraft and helicopters for AEW, ASW, SAR and VERTREP or a smaller number of more capable aircraft. If it was the former the Aeronavale purchased 252 F-8E(FN), 582 Etendard IVM/P and 192 Zephyr trainers, but not necessarily 480 Alizes.
Edit 08.11.23
The numbers should be 126 F-8E(FN), 291 Etendard IVM/P and 96 Zephyr trainers, but not necessarily 240 Alizes. That is there were 50% more ships and each ship carried double the number of aircraft so 3 times as many aircraft were required. Except, that I multiplied the OTL numbers by 6 instead of by 3.
Alternative Charles de Gaulle class Aircraft Carriers
Note from Page 145 of Jane's Fighting Ships 1982-83 (No note in 1980-81 & I didn't have access to 1981-82)
"On 23rd September 1980 the Defence Council decided to build two nuclear-propelled aircraft carriers of 32-35,000 tons to replace Clememceau in 1990 and Foch some years later. First ship, Bretagne, to be laid down at Brest in 1983. The second to be named Provence. Aircraft complement, 30-40. Funds for preliminary work at Brest in 1981 estimates."
By the time Jane's Fighting Ships 1986-87 was published the first ship (with the provisional name of Richelieu) was to be laid down in 1986. However, her completion had been put back from 1990 to 1995 and the replacement for Foch was to be completed some years after that. The first ship had been ordered (on 4th February 1986) and the second ship was to be ordered in 1990.
However, the first ship wasn't laid down until 1989, launched (as Charles de Gaulle) until 1994 and completed in 2001 after starting sea trials in 1999.
ITTL France was rich enough to afford to build 3 Charles de Gaulle class ships in the 1980s. The first ship was laid down in 1983 and completed in 1990. The other two ships were completed by the end of 1995. 3 nuclear powered versions of the OTL PA2 design will replace them in the 2020s.
Alternative Cruiser De Grasse
IOTL the OTL De Grasse was suspended in 1946, resumed in 1951 and completed in 1956. She was converted into the nuclear testing flagship 1964-66 and according to Wikipaedia was used for six testing campaigns between 1966 and 1972. She was decommissioned in 1973 and was sold for scrap on 25 January 1974.
ITTL she was still suspended in 1946, but by 1951 it was decided that it would be better to build a brand-new ship from the keep up. The Nouveau De Grasse was laid down at Brest in 1951, launched in 1953 and completed in 1956 to the same design as Colbert.
She wasn't converted to a command ship 1964-66 IOTL. Arrmoanches had this refit instead. According to the TTL version of Wikipaedia Arromanches was used for six testing campaigns between 1966 and 1972. She was decommissioned in 1973 and was sold for scrap on 25 January 1974.
Meanwhile, De Grasse continued to operate as a conventional cruiser until she was rebuilt into a guide missile cruiser 1968-70. She was rebuilt along the lines of Colbert in her OTL (and TTL) 1970-72 refit. ITTL De Grasse wasn't paid off in 1973, but continued in service until the end of the Cold War.
Alternative Cruiser Jeanne d' Arc
This was an enlargement of the OTL Jeanne d' Arc. This was to allow for more powerful machinery. SHP was increased from 40,000 IOTL to 80-90,000 ITTL to allow in increase in maximum speed from 26.5 knots to 32-33 knots so she could operate with the aircraft carriers. As planned IOTL she was completed with a Mascura SAM launcher in A position and had 2 DRBR 51 fire control radars. The larger hull might have also allowed a larger hangar & flight deck and the ability to carry more cadets and commandos.
Alternative Suffren class Destroyers
Not really an alternative because the design was the same as OTL. The change is that 6 were built instead of 2. The 4 extra ships were built in place of Anconit and the 3 Tourville class destroyers.
IOTL only 3 Mascura SAM systems were built, that is one system for the rebuilt Colbert and 2 for the Suffrens. ITTL 15 systems were built, that is 6 for the 3 PA class aircraft carriers (2 per ship), 3 for the cruisers and 6 for the Suffren class. That isn't exactly mass production, but the larger production run, should reduce the unit costs so that the total cost of the 15 systems built ITTL was less than five times the total cost of the 3 systems built ITTL.
Alternative T47 Destroyer Rebuilds
IOTL 4 ships of this class were rebuilt into guided missile destroyers in the 1960s. They received a single Mk 13 launcher (fed bay a magazine holding 40 Tatar or Standard MR missiles) and 2 SPG-51B fire control radars and the SENIT naval tactical system.
The OTL Mascura SAM was of similar size to the American Terrier/Standard ER family of missiles. ITTL the French developed a smaller version that was equivalent to the American Tatar/Standard MR family of missiles and it was ready in time to be fitted to all 12 T47 destroyers in the 1960s in place of the 4 Tatar conversions of OTL.
Alternative C70AA Frigate
IOTL the French planned to build 4 ships of this type, which would be fitted with Mk 13 launchers and SPG-51 radars taken from the 4 T47 destroyers. (However, Jane's Fighting Ships 1975-76 says 6 C70AA were planned.) However, it was decided not to build the third and fourth ships after the Americans decided to terminate production of the Standard SM-1MR missile.
ITTL the French planned and built 12 ships of this type, which were be fitted with "Small Mascura" launchers and fire control radars taken from the 12 T47 destroyers. They were also built at a faster rate than OTL. Under Plan Bleu of 1972 all 24 C70 frigates were to have been completed by 1985 and ITTL they were. IOTL only 9 ships of the class (2 AA and 7 AS) were built and the last one was not completed until 1991.
12 ASW version of the C70 were also built by 1985 ITTL, which with the 12 AA versions and 6 Suffren class meant that the French Navy had the 30 destroyers that it was supposed to have in 1985 under Plan Bleu. They also had the 35 avisos planned, which consisted of the 9 E59 class and 26 instead of 17 A69 class.
Alternative Ouragan class TCD
IOTL Arromanches became a helicopter carrier in 1968 and served in that role until 1974, but ITTL she became the nuclear testing flagship in 1966, was paid off in 1973 and was sold for scrapping in 1974. ITTL some of that lost capability was retained by building a third Ouragan class TCD.
However, these ships were twice as big as the OTL class. Displacements were: 11,600 tons, light; 17,000 tons, full load; and 30,000 tons when fully immersed.
The crew as also doubled from 239 to 478, but they could also carry 700 troops normally and 940 for short periods. The capacity of the dock was also doubled to 4 large landing craft of the EDIC type or 36 loaded LCMs plus 3,000 tons of material and equipment handled by four 35 ton cranes (or two 70 ton cranes).
The OTL ships had a platform for four heavy helicopters. The TTL ships had a platform that could accommodate at least eight heavy helicopters.
They were to have been replaced by the Foudre class. The OTL version of Jane's Fighting Ships 1986-87 says that the planned paying off dates were 1990 and 1993, but in the end they weren't retired until 2007. It also says that 3 Foudre class were to be built, but in the end only 2 ships of this class were built.
ITTL 3 Foudre class ships were built to replace the Ouragan class, but in common with OTL the Ouragan class were run on until the middle of the 2000s. The TTL Foudre class ships were much bigger than the OTL and were effectively the Mistral design with 1980s electronics.
