Best POD for southern victory

Kingpoleon

Banned
Doubtful. Both armies were completely tired, never mind the fract that the retreating union troops wopuld run into an army force of fresh army troops roughly the same size who were guarding Washington, and which was growing steadily by the week.


No. It would be impossible for Lee to take Washington, being that the city by 1863 was one of the most heavily defended places on the planet by that time.

Plus, he actually has to destroy the Army of the Potomac before he could even go near washington.


""If Davis had convinced the CS congress...." yeah, going to need a source on this about Davis actually wanting to free the slaves and also watning to make a case of it to congress.






WHAT?
Yes, I know. Should I delete the rest besides the POD and add an explanation? The only thing is I rather like the rest of the story, but I'll remove it if you think I should.
 

Congressman

Banned
Lincoln makes it about slavery after Fort Sumter, and the border states leave

Lincoln once said "I don't know what side God is on, but thankfully we have Kentucky" because he believed that Missouri and Maryland would leave

Without these states, it becomes impossible to invade the south.
 
Lincoln makes it about slavery after Fort Sumter, and the border states leave

Lincoln once said "I don't know what side God is on, but thankfully we have Kentucky" because he believed that Missouri and Maryland would leave

Without these states, it becomes impossible to invade the south.

I dunno about Kentucky, TBH, but it seems highly unlikely Missouri OR Maryland would just up and join the C.S.A. with *that* late of a POD; there were way too many Unionists in both states, and not enough strong Confederate sympathizers in either. In fact, it's even more possible that East Tennessee would have stayed in the Union, making things even tougher for the Confeds.
 
Some of my favorite Civil War PoDs -- personally, I'm a fan of the Lost Orders (oldie but a goodie).

One concept that's been on my mind of late -- in TLs where the CSA wins the Civil War, for example (similarly, where the CP wins WWI, etc), there ought to be some major differences on how and when their victory is achieved. For example, a fairly early PoD that preempts the Emancipation Proclamation (like my aforementioned favorite) stands a much better chance of preserving slavery in the new nation than, for example, an 1864 PoD would.
 
There are only two realistic PODs for a Confederate victory. The first is foreign intervention, for which the Trent Affair is obviously the most likely option. The other is a better showing by the Confederates in 1864, leading to a collapse of political will in the North and Lincoln's electoral defeat in that year's presidential election and a negotiated peace by the incoming Democratic administration.

They'd have to be doing REALLY good for that to happen; as in sipping iced tea in Philli good. As things stood, McClellan (or whoever) being swarn in to office in March would be the worst President in the history of the universe if he negotiated when the CSA had at most six weeks of life left. Given that he's a glory hound at heart, he'd prosecute it to the end and take all the credit. Even if the CSA still had six months to go he would. Or a year. Remember, just because a candidate makes a promise doesn't mean it'll be kept.

Now if Maryland and Kentucky were occupied, that'd be a different matter.
 
I wonder if this POD could turn into a three way war, with Mexico trying to retake some of its losses. I'd imagine the US would focus on the CSA, so I could see some Mexican gains. In particular, would they have a chance to regain Texas in the eventual peace?

Well my thought on the matter is that it would make acceptance of a foreign ruler more palatable so Nappy III and his Maxinilliam scheme would work out far better if the cards lined up to make that still happen.

If not, well whoever is currently in charge of Mexico will probably get a wink and a nudge from the Confederacy to reclaim their lost territory since there is so little the US could do about it, and it would further stretch Union resources.

However, there is little chance of getting back California or Texas in a peace deal, put mildly too many non Catholic white people who have a very different view on the matter and the CSA wouldn't sell out Texas.
 
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