Best Dutch interwar fleet

Several years we (a couple authors/historians and myself) on a couple other boards discussed some "What if's" that bear on this one. I had become aware that a Dutch firm was awarded the contracts for scrapping a fair number of HSF vessels, and BADLY wanting a TL wherein the old HSF ships were NOT scrapped but rebuilt, and then sent on a roughly 1-4 basis (1 in Holland, normally being rebuilt or in reserve) with the others (Capital ships) in the DEI. After a lot of research and PM between us, there was really no possibility of it. Everyone wanted these ships gone, the contracts apparently prohibited such an event happening, plus by the time the ships got to Holland they had been subjected to a lot of neglect and most of the non ferrous metals and other valuables stripped out.
That in turn, brought up the other possibility. The RN has for quite a long time been fond of sending naval missions to other nations, accomplishing not only a military function, but also an economic and diplomatic one. The consensus was that the RN, prior to the WNT, would have been amenable to selling just about whatever they had, after being refurbished, at essentially scrap prices. That tends to integrate the other nation in all those areas with Britain. This in fact, is what the Dutch should have done IMO. Tie themselves to the RN's coattails as much as possible, for while this means possibly getting involved in a conflict, it also protects you to a degree from an aggressive other nation, such as Japan.
Alternatively, major units could have been built abroad, with others (possibly) being built at home. Smaller units could have been built in Dutch yards. The OTL plans the Dutch had were good, combined arms plans well thought out but they lacked heavy ships and enough of everything else. Aircraft, subs, minelayers and sweepers, along with a decent squadron of heavy ships, complemented by better defenses ashore would have been a much tougher nut to crack for the Japanese.
 
Several years we (a couple authors/historians and myself) on a couple other boards discussed some "What if's" that bear on this one. I had become aware that a Dutch firm was awarded the contracts for scrapping a fair number of HSF vessels, and BADLY wanting a TL wherein the old HSF ships were NOT scrapped but rebuilt, and then sent on a roughly 1-4 basis (1 in Holland, normally being rebuilt or in reserve) with the others (Capital ships) in the DEI. After a lot of research and PM between us, there was really no possibility of it. Everyone wanted these ships gone, the contracts apparently prohibited such an event happening, plus by the time the ships got to Holland they had been subjected to a lot of neglect and most of the non ferrous metals and other valuables stripped out.
That in turn, brought up the other possibility. The RN has for quite a long time been fond of sending naval missions to other nations, accomplishing not only a military function, but also an economic and diplomatic one. The consensus was that the RN, prior to the WNT, would have been amenable to selling just about whatever they had, after being refurbished, at essentially scrap prices. That tends to integrate the other nation in all those areas with Britain. This in fact, is what the Dutch should have done IMO. Tie themselves to the RN's coattails as much as possible, for while this means possibly getting involved in a conflict, it also protects you to a degree from an aggressive other nation, such as Japan.
Alternatively, major units could have been built abroad, with others (possibly) being built at home. Smaller units could have been built in Dutch yards. The OTL plans the Dutch had were good, combined arms plans well thought out but they lacked heavy ships and enough of everything else. Aircraft, subs, minelayers and sweepers, along with a decent squadron of heavy ships, complemented by better defenses ashore would have been a much tougher nut to crack for the Japanese.


Now you have me really ASB thinking. Pull a Baden inland and scuttle it in a canal. Instant fortress.
 
The Is are always interesting in discussions because they show that value isn't always in the biggest guns.

Short version.
They can beat up Treaty cruisers and force the bad guys to commit a full battle cruiser.
They are coal fired so you don't need to build up an oil supply to run them. This can be an issue in the boondocks, though I acknowledge the DEI has a good local supply of oil.
They don't need the long dry docks of a more modern BC like a Cat. Again an issue in the boondocks.

Put simply they are well suited to operating away from Europe. Exactly what is needed in the DEI.

Probably the biggest thing against them is there are reports that their turbines are worn out. That is a potential deal breaker.


Look. I agree that the Is are obsolete and old. But with a little bit of work they are competitive with cruisers, WNT or not, up until the mid 30s and can be bought cheaply. Perfect? No. But they will do the job on a budget.
Just before the First World War the Dutch considered building 9 battleships to defend their Netherlands East Indies, later reduced to four to cut costs and then cancelled altogether with the outbreak of war. My proposal sits between the two has the benefit of dramatically reducing costs and the time frame. The four Orions provide an instant battle squadron that is the equal of any in the Pacific. Lion and Princess Royal are two battlecruisers that, with improvements, can dominate heavy cruisers and hold their own against the Kongo class. I'd even put in a bid for the Tiger when it's retired in 1931.
 
In the years leading up to 1914 the Dutch government spent between 20-30 percent of their budget on defence. They modernized the New Holland Waterline and in 1874 started the construction of the "Stelling van Amsterdam" (Fortress Amsterdam), a national redoubt consisting of forty-two fortresses and an inundation system around the nation’s capital.

The initial Dutch Naval plan was for 9 ships (20,000 tons, 8x14" guns, 4 Based Europe, 5 NEI) as part of a 93 ship expansion. The plan was to stretch out for 33 (1947!) years and include 6 AC (perhaps the Java CLs), 8 DD, 8 TB and 8 SS laid down within 5 years. The estimated expenditure was £3.8m per year (double present expenditure). In late 1913 the navy bill was amended to 5 (4 +1 Reserve) 21 000 or 25 000 ton ships (25m Guilders each), 6 1,200 ton 'torpedo cruisers', 8 500 ton DD, 44 300 ton TB, 22 280 ton SL and 6 AM.

The favored battleship design appears to be either a Blohm & Voss design at 26 000 tons and 8 350mm in twin turrets and possibly 23 knots speed or a similar Germaniawerft design one. The Germaniawerft design is more likely as there as already a close working relationship with the Dutch navy and the Java class cruisers were built to a Germaniawerft design.

It was hoped to order in October 1914, lay down in Dec 1914 and deliver in early 1917. B&V guaranteed to deliver the first ship in 27 months and that Dutch yards could probably assist with the construction. Krupp also reserved the right to subcontract B&V and also deliver in 27 months. B&V were about to start building the Ersatz Victoria Louise (Mackensen) and the design for the Dutch probably included the same size guns (350 mm or 13.8") and turrets as the German ship.

The Dutch economy took a £200-250m hit from the war without being a combatant. While lacking building capacity, the local builders didn’t want the risk of building a battleship. The Dutch have a strong naval tradition and the third most valuable colonial empire to defend. The NEI would be a natural acquisition under pre-war 'peaceful penetration' activites where Germany gains access to resources, markets and possibly political control without war. The Dutch were benevolently neutral favouring the Germans such as copying and passing on von Spee’s signals, supplying coal through to accepting the Kaiser in asylum and rejecting handing him over at the end of the war.

Increasing the naval expenditure to £3.8m per year puts the Dutch Navy close to Australian ambitions of £20m in construction over 20 years and ships budgeted at about £2.1m each. The Dutch fleet would probably be 6 ships +1 reserve with the extra 2 ships built in the mid 20's. Manning with Europeans will be difficult and the ships were designed for segregating crews in mind.
 
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