Best case scenario for mid-east

Wendell

Calgacus said:
Thanks for sparing me the need to go look that up! I think the precise rule was specifically brought in as a response to the war of 1967 (although it was particularly directed at Sinai I think). Or to put this differently, Wendell, would the US have been justified in annexing Iraq in 2003?
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The U.S. would have no reason to annex Iraq nor any desire to do so, regardless of what facets of international law have to say on the matter.
 

Wendell

Calgacus said:
From Wiki: "Similar to Jordan's treatment of Jewish holy sites, numerous Muslim holy sites (mosques and cemeteries) under Israeli rule in West Jerusalem fell into disuse and suffered from neglect. Some were destroyed due to Israeli development projects. For example, the Muslim cemetery in Mamila area was damaged due to the construction of Independence Park in the center of Jerusalem...[O]ne justification that was offered [for the increasing demolition of mosques] was to "[spare] Arab citizens sorrow..."

Admittedly not as bad as what happened under Jordanian government orders, but it still counts.
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So, now it's Israel's fault that Muslim site went unused by Muslims?

How many of said sites destroyed in construction projects were destroyed deliberately?
 

Wendell

Derek Jackson said:
The Charter of the United Nations 1945

Also I think the Locarno or Kellog Briand pact of the 1920s starting a war of aggression is illegal. The fact that Germany signed and never left the 192? treaty was, if memory serves, a part of the basis for the Nuremberg charges of crimes against Peace.

Under German law (and by the way the US Constitution) treaties become part of domestic as well as international law.


It is not clear that acquiring lands gained in a defensive war (though it is at least disputable whether that was the character of Israel's actions in 1967) was illegal.

However there are lots of provisions in various conventions about how occupying forces are supposed to act which Isreal has not followed.
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If you knew the first thing about international law, you'd know that parties not subject to an agreement cannot be held to said agreement. Thus, the Kellogg-Briand Pact (which I think is no longer legally binding, but I may be wrong) has no standing in issues regarding Israel.


Where does this issue arise in the U.N. charter?
 

Calgacus

Wendell said:
The U.S. would have no reason to annex Iraq nor any desire to do so, regardless of what facets of international law have to say on the matter.
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That does not really affect this question, which is a hypothetical one. Would they have been justified in doing so, had they wanted to?
 

Wendell

Calgacus said:
That does not really affect this question, which is a hypothetical one. Would they have been justified in doing so, had they wanted to?
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The question is an absurd one because, short of ASB intervention, the U.S. would not have had such an interest.
 

Wendell

Calgacus said:
Do you understand the word "hypothetical"?
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I do, however, as hypotheticals go, this is a lousy one.


As absurd as your hypothetical is, the U.S. would be justified in annexing or administering land it invaded indefinitely if it so chose. To do so, however, is absurd and not even s thought taken seriously by anyone with regard to Iraq.
 

Calgacus

Wendell said:
I do, however, as hypotheticals go, this is a lousy one.


As absurd as your hypothetical is, the U.S. would be justified in annexing or administering land it invaded indefinitely if it so chose. To do so, however, is absurd and not even s thought taken seriously by anyone with regard to Iraq.
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Honestly, this is like butting my head against a brick wall. Plainly the US would not want to annex Iraq, but you have finally answered my question at least. In your opinion, might makes right, and the winner can do pretty much what they please. Thankfully not all of the world thinks as you do, otherwise we'd be in a sorry state.
 

Wendell

Calgacus said:
Honestly, this is like butting my head against a brick wall. Plainly the US would not want to annex Iraq, but you have finally answered my question at least. In your opinion, might makes right, and the winner can do pretty much what they please. Thankfully not all of the world thinks as you do, otherwise we'd be in a sorry state.
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It's not that right makes right. It's that nation-states, being sovereign entities, should be expected to act in their own self-interest, as that is their sovereign right.
 

Wendell

Keenir said:
how can you tell?
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It was his assertion, so it's his accusation to prove, not mine to disprove.


As far as how I can tell? How about the Israeli Judiciary halting projects that it knows or understands could damage a holy site?
 

Keenir

Banned
Wendell said:
It was his assertion, so it's his accusation to prove, not mine to disprove.
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don't pretend to have a halo over your head.

As far as how I can tell? How about the Israeli Judiciary halting projects that it knows or understands could damage a holy site?
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no, I mean, how can you tell if its being damaged accidentally or deliberately?
 

Wendell

Keenir said:
don't pretend to have a halo over your head.
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:rolleyes:


no, I mean, how can you tell if its being damaged accidentally or deliberately?
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Is someone speeeding a bulldozer over a random historic site for which they have no alternative use, or is someone operating a crane in which there was a snag, and the goods being moved fall on a sight?
 

Grimm Reaper

I notice the shameful and cowardly willingness of so many to shirk analysis of the brutal mistreatment of Greater Bulgaria's rightful borders at the Congress of Berlin continues...
 

Keenir

Banned
Wendell said:
Is someone speeeding a bulldozer over a random historic site for which they have no alternative use, or is someone operating a crane in which there was a snag, and the goods being moved fall on a sight?
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I'm transporting pipes or planks or somesuch, and - oh noes, I just "accidentally" broke a window.
(as an example)
 
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