Aztec Empire timeline (rough draft)

[Psychomeltdown]

My Time Line 1453 - 1502

1453 Christopher Columbus dies of a childhood disease a pity…

1478 Axayacatl leads a huge army of 30000 Aztecs and allies against the Tarascans to the West. In a twist of Fate Axayacatl and the army wins, they smash the Tarascans at their frontier and then keep pushing deeper into Tarascan territory.

This is not a Flower War, this is a war of conquest, the Aztec have already conquered many other nations and now they’re looking after wealth and power. Plus they can’t have a powerful rival on their sides.

1480 the Tarascan emperor asks for peace. They know they are conquered and they submit to Aztec rule and offer tribute in the form of wealth and slaves.

Axayacatl is hailed the greatest warrior and Emperor in ages. He takes the Tarascan warriors and expands the boarders of his domain, conquering all nearby nations and making the Aztecs the most powerful partner in the Triple Alliance.

1481 Axayacatl dies and is replaced by Ahuitzotl, Tizco dies in this universe, a victim of the Tarascan War.

1482 Ahuitzotl has a lot to surpass, his brother conquered the powerful Tarascans, and now Ahuitzotl looks to the rest of the world as his to crush and squeeze of tribute. Think of him as an Alexander the Great in the making, his need to outshine his brother pushes him to rapidly expand his empire, basically taking control of the Triple Alliance and almost making the other partners into subjects.

1486 The Tarascans are suffering from bad harvests and can’t provide the necessary tribute to the Aztecs. Instead they come bearing a different tribute, on the backs of a few dozen slaves they carry strange weapons that gleam like beaten gold but are stronger than anything they have.

Ahuitzotl’s warriors are leery of this weapon. They scoff at it, saying that the obsidian swords are far better than these pathetic weapons the Tarascans send their way. Ahuitzotl isn’t impressed but he has a war to fight and it the tribute doesn’t bear out, then he can always crush the Tarascans again.

He gives these weapons to his most honored warriors, legends in their own right. One such is a Jaguar Knight called Blood Eagle, he is leery of the weapon, but is honored by the gift of a bronze sword and shield from the emperor. He becomes known as Blood Eagle the Invincible as he tears a hole in the ranks of a barbarian army, spreading fear and terror as the Gods Blessed Aztec warrior who’s blows smash through shields and bodies and who’s shield shatters wood and obsidian.

Ahuitzotl hears this news and in his mind dances the images of bronze armored warriors conquering the world for him. Immediately he orders the Tarascans to make as many of these bronze weapons as they can, exempting them from the honor of feeding the gods if they push everything to making more.

1498 Portuguese ships spot land as they travel across the Atlantic Ocean. They see nothing but deserts and move on, giving this barren land the name Hy-brasil. Nothing interesting here, they head home, after all they now have a way around Africa to trade with the Far East.

1502 The world lies at the Aztec’s feet from the northern deserts, to the Western Sea, to the boarders of the jungles to the south and the shores of the Eastern Sea. Most nations have fallen or surrendered to the might of the Aztec and the terror of their army keeps all nations in line. Ahuitzotl is hailed a great conqueror and dies happily. Montezuma is named the new ruler of the Aztec Empire

Note: with the advance of bronze the Aztec have begun major efforts to harness this new tech. They’ve basically turned all of Tarascan into a giant bronze making area, sending slaves and smiths there to make these weapons. To protect their interests, the Aztecs have completely taken control of the Tarascans lands. They don’t trust them and bronze is a vital war asset. The Aztecs begin establishing a centralized empire, they see how well it works and under Ahuitzotl they copy and use it on newly acquired nations.

Tools of bronze are also being used, the technology is not under lock and key, the Mayans to the south get a hold of the weapons and for years there are bloody wars in the Mayan lands. For the first time the Aztec are hampered by unfamiliar battleground and rough logistics.

 

[MK5]

Quetzalcoatl was a pacifist diety who only accepted flowers as sacrifices. With an admixture of Buddhism perhaps his cult could be rejuvinated and become a force in an Aztec empire. I dont see the priests of Tezcatipoca bieng very happy about it though. Religious civil war perhaps?

I agree that an Aztec empire without largescale human sacrifice just wouldn't be Aztec. Maybe if the Chinese could convince them that the sun isn't fueled by human blood..

 

[Tetsu]

Quetzalcoatl was a pacifist diety who only accepted flowers as sacrifices. With an admixture of Buddhism perhaps his cult could be rejuvinated and become a force in an Aztec empire. I dont see the priests of Tezcatipoca bieng very happy about it though. Religious civil war perhaps?

I agree that an Aztec empire without largescale human sacrifice just wouldn't be Aztec. Maybe if the Chinese could convince them that the sun isn't fueled by human blood..

A small religious civil war does happen in my timeline, but mainly, the emperor's loyal guards (the Chinese change his mind about the human sacrifices and other things) quietly assassinate the rebellious high priests.

And a comment on the "Aztecs without human sacrifice just wouldn't be Aztec" note... well, look at the Romans. They had frequent blood sport matches, with pretty unwilling opponents. Plenty of civilizations have bloody pasts that they grow out of.

 

[Mr.Bluenote]

And a comment on the "Aztecs without human sacrifice just wouldn't be Aztec" note... well, look at the Romans. They had frequent blood sport matches, with pretty unwilling opponents. Plenty of civilizations have bloody pasts that they grow out of.

Yes, you're right, but the Roman Gods were not bloodthirsty cravers of sacrifice! I don't think that we have any civilization that have demanded sacrifices, religious or otherwise, that have grown out of that nasty little habit by themselves, have we?!

Having Aztecs without their distict culture (incl.the sacrifices, yes) would make them very non-Aztec in my view. That would be like a Nazi-Germany without the intense hatred of percieved sub-humans etc etc. It would be a shame to let our understanding of right, wrong and morality influence the way we write a ATL.

Best regards!

- Mr.Bluenote.

 

[Psychomeltdown]

Aztec Timeline 1505 - 1528

1499 Vasco da Gama returns to Portugal after successfully rounding Africa. He is richly rewarded and named as Admiral of the Indian Ocean.

1500 Pedro Ãlvares Cabral, heading for the Cape of Good Hope steers his ships too far west and spot land. They see nothing but deserts and move on, giving this barren land the name Hy-brasil. Nothing interesting here, they head home, they are on a mission to head for India and enforce Portuguese interest there.



1505 Mayans begin setting up trade with the populations of Cuba. Using bronze tools they make ships large enough to sail to and from Cuba and still make a profit.

1508 A Portuguese ship crashes near the Yucatan Peninsula, three men survive. One, 18-year-old Pedro carries smallpox, the other two die of injuries.

The Great Plague: Nearly a third of the population dies over the next two decades as smallpox tears through the Aztec Empire. The High Priests see this as a sign that Huitzilopochtli was angered with the small wars of expansion and conquest that Montezuma was doing.

1509 the Mayan War begins as Montezuma and the Aztec armies push south and begin conquering the Mayans and any other tribes that they find. The Mayans do not fight ‘fair’ as the Aztec see it, they are fighting for their lives and they try to take as many Aztec as they can, this leads to the Aztec dealing with them harshly. Any Mayan city that submits will be allowed to survive, any that resists will be completely destroyed and all the population enslaved or killed. This is a time of great expansion; by 1516 the Aztecs control all the land south to the Columbian Mountains.

1514 Portuguese ships begin bringing setting up small outposts in south eastern Brazil, they are there to collect brazilwood. Portuguese ships begin exploring southern South America, the exploration is half hearted and occasional, they’re just there to collect the valuable wood and return home.

1515 Montezuma dies of Measles. Cuauhtémoc is named heir to the Aztec Empire, after Cuitlahuac dies in the Mayan Wars. Cuauhtémoc is a warrior of ample experience spending his whole life fighting for the Aztec Empire, he is also considered the best Emperor in this new age of conquest and expansion.

There is a problem now. All the lands of have been conquered, there seems nothing left to conquer and the hunger of Huitzilopochtli needs to be satisfied. The Mayans point east and say there are large islands there. They offer them boats, anything to make them look elsewhere for tribute.

1517 Small scouting missions are sent east, they come back bearing tales of large islands and large populations. Cuauhtémoc decides that this is where they need to expand. The Empire is weakening as they sit still and the great armies are getting restless, they need to keep moving.

A major ship building effort takes place. This is where Pedro comes into play, he was nothing more than a seaman, but his rudimentary knowledge of shipbuilding was greater than the Mayans. He had basically become assimilated, married and had children, and fought against the Aztec. Now he protects his family by making ships for the Aztec to take their notice elsewhere.

1520 The invasion of Cuba begins as the New Fleet crosses the Eastern Sea. Pedro has managed to supply the Aztec Navy with ships that share a close resemblance to Viking knarrs.

There has been a slight adjustment to religious doctrine, one that the High Priests aren’t happy with. There have been no real expansion in the last decade, the Mayans were the last and the smaller tribes aren’t worth the effort. The War God still needs to be fed, but Cuauhtémoc has seen the sudden drop in food production and wares begin produced. He a religious man, but he also has to make sure that his empire is running smoothly.

With a lot of soul searching and talks with various priests, Cuauhtémoc gives the announcement that they are easing back on the sacrifices. They say the Great Plague was sent because Huitzilopochtli was not happy that they were not going to war, not because of the lack of sacrifices. They need to go to war to satisfy the god and the only place left to them is the Carib Islands. Huitzilopochtli does not strike him dead and all goes well, the news is met with silent relief. Great human sacrifices will only be held after great victories and battles. For the remainder of the time they’ll be a fairly tolerable level of sacrificing, nothing extreme.

The Aztec use the tactics they have used against the Mayan, surrender and get a little sacrificed, resist and get slaughtered. The tribes of the Carib Islands are not prepared for nothing like the organized might of the Aztecs, plus they’ve been dealing with the effects of diseases and such.

1521 Enterprising merchants on the pacific side of the Aztec Empire build boats and sail south. Making contact with other tribes and trading. They come across the Inca, a nation that has been savaged by smallpox, measles, and other diseases. They are willing to trade. Regular trade routes begin to be established.

1526 A large Aztec raiding party comes across a strange ship near a Taino village in what would have been Haiti. The raiding party is lead by a glory hungry young noble, he sees a chance to do something great, so he jumps them and manages to capture the ship. The Taino village submits, they know what will happen if they resist, they even help in capturing the Spanish sailors who have been accepting Taino hospitality.

The Governor of the newly conquered lands hears of this strange vessel and he doesn’t know what to do with it, nor with the captured people. So he decides to send them onward. Cuauhtémoc is told of a great ship captured. Interested he heads out to the Eastern Sea and sees this ship first hand, in modern day Veracruz, lets call it Ahuitzotl Port. There he meets the thirty crewmen that have been captured with the ship. They have been treated well, and are basically unsure how to deal with their captivity.

Again this is where Pedro shows up. He’s become the foreman of the Aztec ship building center, master of Ahuitzotl Port and its surrounding area. He sees these men and is shocked to see more Europeans coming here. There is a discussion as to what to do with these men, the Priest are all for sacrificing them. Pedro steps in and tries to save the lives of fellow Christians.

He manages to convince Cuauhtémoc to forgo killing them; they are the crew of a working ship, something that the Aztec will need. They have knowledge that the Aztec lacks. Cuauhtémoc is not really sure, so he decides that he’ll kill one in three, just to satisfy the gods. With Pedro’s help, Cuauhtémoc keeps the skilled ones alive; the others are put to death. Then he tells them to make better ships and heads back to his capitol. The remaining Spanish crew is terrified and they quickly fall in line, the Spanish carvel becomes the basis for all ships that are going to be built. The ship’s smith gets to work setting up a forge and Pedro manages to get people looking for iron ore.

1528 Iron ore is found and with Cuauhtémoc permission Pedro and his smith begin smelting iron. As a gift for the complete conquering of Cuba and Haiti, Pedro sends Cuauhtémoc a long sword and a suit of chain mail.

 

[Mr.Bluenote]

(...) surrender and get a little sacrificed (...)

And get a LITTLE sacrificed?! Hehe, that's mean, and quite funny, I'd say!

Anyway, it's good and interesting. It deal with the disease-thingy and give the Aztec access to technology, but it's not overdone. Very good, Psychomeltdown (may I just call you Psycho?! ).

Regards and all!

- Mr.B.

 

[Psychomeltdown]

Sacrificing will always be apart of the culutre, it took the Spanish completely conquerng, subjagating, and then viciously scouring out any sign of paganism to finally suppress it. Plus its war, gotta feed the gods.

The people were used to getting fed to the gods, an honor, as long as it was kept at a reasonable level then they'd be fine with it.

 

[David S Poepoe]

"1508 A Portuguese ship crashes near the Yucatan Peninsula, three men survive. One, 18-year-old Pedro carries smallpox, the other two die of injuries.

The Great Plague: Nearly a third of the population dies over the next two decades as smallpox tears through the Aztec Empire. The High Priests see this as a sign that Huitzilopochtli was angered with the small wars of expansion and conquest that Montezuma was doing."

I think you have a very poor idea about how contagion spreads. In order the a truly great number to die off there are to be a period of prolonged and continued contact. You don't get it from the scenario you are suggestion. Smallpox is just one of the diseases that decimated the native population.

 

[Psychomeltdown]

'Most often, the virus is transmitted through particles that are released into the air when an infected person coughs, sneezes or simply talks. But it can also spread through direct contact such as kissing or through contaminated bed linen and clothing. Inhaling a single virus particle may be enough to cause infection. Smallpox has the potential to spread rapidly — an epidemic could conceivably start with one infected individual. Once symptoms develop, there's no effective treatment for smallpox and no known cure, but a vaccine is available that can protect against the disease.
MayoClinic.com



Trade networks between the two areas, Maya and the other portions of the Aztec empire would allow the transmission of the disease. there'd e still a lot of dying, but the survivors would be immune and they're be a gap between the arrival of other european disease, they weren't all hit with smallpox, measles, common cold, bubonic plague and all that stuff at oncem but over time.

The Portuguese are in south America, their disease filter toward the Aztecs, or when they make contact with people who trade with aztecs, they spread disease. the transmission is not one way either, american diseases also strike at the eruorpeans. the wider travels, quicker trade routes, and heavy populations all make for new diseases popping up, ones that europeans have never been hit with. just as syhpillis hit europe hard, so might these new diseases.

Plus Pedro didn't die, he fell ill, was taken care of, infected the family taking care of him, which in turned infected a passing trade carvan, which in turn brought the disease to the Aztec Empire, which hit with devestating effect.

 

[cow defender]

there was a priest, Quetzalcoatl, of the god of the same name who tried to ban human sacrifices. Quetz. resembles the christ god in many forms, the people believed hewas a man (of lighter skin too), he is a creatorgod, he gave the people everything associated with civilization (music, cities, etc). maybe with a littleculturaldiffusion, quetzalcoatl can becomeeven morechristlike and have hisfollowers stage a religious revolution. couldmake forinteresting events and developments.

by the way sorry, my space barismessed up.

 

[Psychomeltdown]

Cultural diffusion can go both ways too. Aztecs could convert to Christianity and vice versa, but I don't think they'll be much in the way of cultural exchange in the beginning. The two cultures are too alien for one another. There's going to be a war between them, no matter what. the two sides just believe in things that in their time and age they can't grasp the other's motivations and really don't want to.

The Aztecs have conquered all of centeral America, they are at their strongest, they are the biggest, strongest nation in their world. what do they want to know of weak gods from across the sea. their Gods have made them strong and powerful, all other nations are nothing more than potential tribute bearers and sacrifices.

The Europeans think the same way also. Their world is the heart of civilization, anything else and everyone else are heathen barbarians that need to learn the word of God and conquered. God, Gold, and Glory...

Any changes in the Aztec relgion, especially something as big as stopping sacrificing people, would take a long time to even be introduced. it was apart of their religion, their lives, they saw nothing evil about it, honorable and sometimes a burden, sure, but something that needed to be done.

It would probably take defeat after massive defeat to shake the foundations of their religion. When they see that the gods have abandoned them or thier are weaker than the gods of their enemies. Plus the preists had too much of a vested interest in human sacrifice. And it was too much of a major driving force for the warriors and their social mobility. This was a time where they still believed that the gods walked the earth and had a hand in the shaping of the world.

Until they saw the europeans storming their beaches, their subjects rising in revolt,and their armies falling apart, then they'll begin thinking thier religion isn't the best in the world anymore.

As for any religious rebellion, they'd be treated as any other rebellion. If they rebel they're going to have to have the major support of the populace, cuz if they lose, then they'll just be so many more slaves and sacrifices for the gods. think of the Romans and their presecution of any religious sects that even so much thought of rebelling, they've be crushed and all of that faith would be looked on with suspicion. only more so, since I would think the Aztecs would not be shy or squemish about depopulating a whole area and sacrificing every man, woman and child to reaffirm their belief and their power over their empire.

I give it a hundred or more years before they begin thinking over changing aspects of their religion, especially if they continue unhampered in their conquests and capturing of sacrifices for the gods.

 

[cow defender]

ahh i concede...

 

[sikitu]

Just a minor remark on the Chinese. While it is true that they made several large scale ocean expeditions in the early 15th century (actually having the most powerful fleet in the world then), all this was stopped before the middle of the century and the ships were scrapped. The country became focused on itself and isolated itself from the outside world. Thus, there NEVER can have been a Chinese expedition in the 16 th Century. However, the 1421 idea might work. It is just the details that need to be worked out.