ATL Naval Development

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In OTL Jackie Fisher repeatedly recognized the trends in naval matters in advance of nearly everyone, from the all-dreadnaught fleet to the first carriers to be built. However, his proposed attack in the German High Seas fleet involving HMS Furious and other newly built carriers was not scheduled to take place until 1919 and thus was cancelled due to that most inconvenient armistice.:p

Assume that Fisher and others pushed the envelope and an attack was launched, perhaps in summer of 1918, and did damage to the Germans with bombs or torpedos far out of proporation to the aircraft lost.

What changes does this portend for naval forces in the period up to WWII and beyond?
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
Most navies realized the value of aircraft carriers and invested heavily in them in the inter-war period. But the British did not do so to the extent of the Americans and the Japanese- they still saw carriers as adjuncts to capital ships, rather than capital ships themselves. Perhaps with this POD, the British would have put more emphasis on carriers, which would have interesting reprecussions vis-a-vis the Japanese.
 

MrP

Banned
Cancel the Dardanelles so Fisher doesn't lose credibility. Not too hard to do. Or have the Dardanelles properly supported by the Army. Either's fine. He and Churchill hang around. Got your forward push. Range and payload of early torpedo bombers is still a problem, I think.
 

Anaxagoras

Banned
MrP said:
Cancel the Dardanelles so Fisher doesn't lose credibility. Not too hard to do. Or have the Dardanelles properly supported by the Army. Either's fine. He and Churchill hang around. Got your forward push. Range and payload of early torpedo bombers is still a problem, I think.

Better yet, have the Navy not chicken out in the Dardanelles and force their way through to COsntantinople without Army support. Fisher and Churchill will be the greatest way heroes of the conflict.
 
Grimm Reaper said:
In OTL Jackie Fisher repeatedly recognized the trends in naval matters in advance of nearly everyone, from the all-dreadnaught fleet to the first carriers to be built. However, his proposed attack in the German High Seas fleet involving HMS Furious and other newly built carriers was not scheduled to take place until 1919 and thus was cancelled due to that most inconvenient armistice.:p

Assume that Fisher and others pushed the envelope and an attack was launched, perhaps in summer of 1918, and did damage to the Germans with bombs or torpedos far out of proporation to the aircraft lost.

What changes does this portend for naval forces in the period up to WWII and beyond?

The main problem was that until late 1918 they didn't have any conventional aircraft capable of carrying a torpedo. In 1914 there was an attempted naval airstrike against Cuxhaven using floatplanes.

I think the Royal Navy did recognize the capabilities of carrier launched aircraft, but was completely emasculated by the decision to grant the newly created Royal Air Force authority over all aircraft and pilots. Also the Royal Navy's early lead in carrier aviation became stymied primarily due to the carriers it retained thru the 1920s and early 30s.
 
Anaxagoras said:
Better yet, have the Navy not chicken out in the Dardanelles and force their way through to COsntantinople without Army support. Fisher and Churchill will be the greatest way heroes of the conflict.

The post war world would be changed so completely as to make differences in British naval doctirine seem minor.

If we keep the minor change, with the British sinking the German fleet in early 1918 via naval aviation, then the RAF may never be formed. If the British then decide to go the carrier route much more strongly than OTL, particularly if combined with a higher status for the navy - a great victory behind it, then as said above, the Japanese are likely to have a difficult time of it later on.
 
David S Poepoe said:
The main problem was that until late 1918 they didn't have any conventional aircraft capable of carrying a torpedo. In 1914 there was an attempted naval airstrike against Cuxhaven using floatplanes.

The RN did have a suitable torpedo bomber by 1918, the Sopwith Cuckoo.
 

perfectgeneral

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revive/necropost?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sopwith_Cuckoo
Throughout 1917, Commodore Sueter proposed plans for an aerial torpedo attack on the German High Seas Fleet at its base in Germany.[6] The carriers HMS Argus, HMS Furious, and HMS Campania, and the converted cruisers HMS Courageous and HMS Glorious, would have launched 100 Cuckoos from the North Sea.[6] In September 1917, Admiral Sir David Beatty, commander of the Grand Fleet, proposed a similar plan involving 120 Cuckoos launched from eight converted merchant vessels.[7]
The early conversion of merchant vessels makes this plan even better. Add the existing carriers to the MACs for 150+ Cuckoos?
150x 18 inch Mk.IX(?) torpedo
18 inch Mark VIII

  • 45cm diameter
  • Year: 1913
  • Role: Submarines and aircraft (Note: During World War II and after the Mk.VIII was a 21 inch torpedo)
  • Warhead: 320 lb (150 kg) TNT
  • Propulsion: Wet heater
  • Performance: 35 knots (65 km/h; 40 mph) for 2,500 yd (2,300 m)
220px-Sopwith_Cuckoo.jpg
sopwith_cuckoo-300px.png

Sopwith_Cuckoo-1.jpg
 
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CalBear

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AHHHH....

Violating the long dead!!!!!

Kill it with fire!!!!

Or at least lock it.
 
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