Good job! An Islamic Empire in the Middle East and an impending Muslim Mongol Empire.
I wait with bated breath.
I wait with bated breath.
ATL Dark ages map
- Thread starter Hermanubis
- Start date
Nice update
Early Suez Canals are very popular in Alternate History, I thinkmidgardmetal said:
Looking forward to itmidgardmetal said:Next update - over the weekend, or Monday.
G.Bone said:
Definitely not a Ghengis Khan proper... what I was thinking about is more like having the Mongols focus all of their energy and power on China, to where within a few centuries China is very different from the one we know. Essentially I am looking for a more outward-looking China with different religion, and some real imperial ambitions throughout the world - not to mention China that is more open to technological innovation. In other words, I am thinking a more successful Kublai Khan (rather, an equivalent of him) and his dynasty.
Teeth Of The Hydra
Before I go into this update, one thing needs to be explained. Due to much confusion regarding the ATL religion named "Islam", I believe a name change for it may be necessary, to avoid both the confusion with OTL religion of the same name, as well as to not let any preconception about said religion one may have color the idea of what it is in ATL.
Thus, many thanks to Leo Caesius for suggesting an alternate name that would still make sense in the context of the TL. From now on, and with respect to the previous updates, any references to ATL "Islam" should be replaced to references to a religion called al-Din (pronounced ad-DEEN), which in Arabic means "The Religion", and would make sense with the people who believe theirs is the one true faith.
Therefore, the al-Din and the Islam in ATL are one and the same. Now, on with the update:
883 - The first Mongol raids into China are dismissed as nothing more than minor nuisanse - after all, the Chinese Emperor commands a numerous army, and could hide behind the walls of his well-fortified cities. Things do get serious enough within a short period of time where the Emperor sends a large army contingent to do a preemptive raid on the Mongols. This "preemptive raid" goes only to prove that the Mongols are much stronger opponent than any the Chinese have ever encountered. The Chinese army is slaughtered, and, to add insult to injury, Mongols retaliate, striking northern China and spreading devastation all around.
884 - In Constantinople, Leo V begins a massive building program, renovating much of the city that had been neglected by many of his predecessors. In a meanwhile, he is rather concerned with restoring some of the provinces that had been Imperial territory in the centuries past. By now, his eyes are centered on the Vandal state of Nea Vandalor, which occupies a relatively small stretch of land between Egypt and the Western Empire's possessions. His reasons for wanting to occupy Nea Vandalor are twofold, one, the glory of his Empire, two, a need to have a base from which to strike into either Egypt or the African territories of the Venetians should any problems with either nation arise.
885 - The kingdom of Nea Vandalor owes its continued existense to the desire of the Venetians to keep a buffer state between themselves and Egypt. In the days when relations between the two Roman Empires were much better, and they considered themselves a part of unique, inseparable entity, the Eastern Romans allowed this state of affairs to continue, especially considering that the Western Romans brought Nea Vandalor under their protection - the protection that has been recently withdrawn as a part of an agreement between Claudius V and Leo V. Thus, the Vandals appear to be an easy prey, not able to resist the onslaught of the Imperial army, and not possessing the manpower or resources to do significant damage. However, the Vandal nation is ruled by one Otto, a recently enthroned king of some vision and talent. Knowing all too well that not only he is locked between major powers and the desert, but that one of those very powers desires the land his kingdom is built on, he is rather desperate for any means of salvation. These means come in shape of a Norse mercenary, who casually mentions about the Norse exploits to the West, and about the new lands they had found. Despite the fact that most of those lands so far are rather worthless in terms of resources and ability to sustain large population, Otto is intrigued. Maybe, he hopes, the Pillars of Hercules are not the edge of the world, and there may yet be a way to save the Vandal nation from becoming one of the many Roman provinces. Secretly, he commissions an expedition to the West, disguising it as a trading mission to avoid its potential destruction by the Venetians. Using the new developments in ship design made in Venice and borrowing more than a few tricks of the trade from the Norse, the Vandals are able to construct three vessels, which are relatively ocean-worthy, and are able to operate beyond the confines of the Mediterranean.
886 - The Vandals receive an ultimatum from Constantinople to either accept a Byzantine governor and give up their independence, or to be destroyed. Many of the young Vandal nobles despise the very idea of surrender, preferring to go down in a blaze of glory; however, Otto is well aware that resistance is rather futile, and instead of rebuffing the Byzantines, all he could hope to do is to damage their forces enough - and infuriate them enough in the process - to where the eventual conquest would be not only more brutal, but more oppressive on any Vandal survivors. Besides, there are some good news to report - out of the three vessels sent out, two were lost to storms and navigational problems, however, one did return with tales of islands that seemed like paradise, strange creatures, and strange people inhabiting them. Otto believed he found his solution. In the general assembly of the Vandals, he addressed his subjects, telling them that they may yet shake off the chains of Roman oppression, and found a new, greater Vandalor - Magna Vandalor he calls it, the Great Vandalor, beyond the ocean. Alternatively, they may stay behind and fight, knowing their cause is doomed. Many of the Vandals present vow to join their king in a difficult travel many may not be able to survive - yet still, many decide to remain and fight on. Otto, in a meanwhile, tried to get his hands on any kind of a ship he could - resulting in a motley flotilla of some hundred ships being assembled, some relatively modern, but some barely able to float. Under the cover of the night, the Vandal fleet sails west, miraculously bypassing many Venetian and Byzantine patrols, and setting course into the unknown. The remaining Vandals' fate could be told quickly. The Byzantines show no mercy in subjugating the kingdom, relocating many of the survivors to the Caliphate frontier, while settling some others in Thrace and Macedonia. All traces of the Vandals in the Old World have been completely removed.
887 - Despite losing almost two thirds of the fleet, Otto himself among the casualties, the remainder of the Vandal host reaches an island that appears to offer ideal conditions for rebuilding. They name the island Ottonia, in the name of the monarch that led them on their perilous journey. The island is OTL's Cuba, located strategically to be able to expand into the mainland just a short travel beyond. In Constantinople, Leo V celebrates a triumph, looking for his next conquest to the northwest. Despite being fellow Orthodox Christians, the Bulgars do occupy many of the ancestral Imperial lands - this state of affairs, he believes, may not continue. Previously the Aquitainian and Venetian influence would have left these thoughts just that - thoughts; however, Aquitaine fell into civil war after disputed succession, and Claudius V of the Western Empire has his hands tied battling the Senate in the realm of political influence. Thus, he is free to interfere as much as he would like. He, however, did not account for one potential rival - the Kievan Russians, whose prince Svyatopolk has been determined to extend his already massive dominions to the south. As the Byzantines sweep into Bulgaria, so do the Russians. Leo manages to reach an agreement with the Russians, dividing the Bulgar lands into two sections - however, this only whets Svyatopolk's appetite.
889 - Leo V Paleologus dies of fever, leaving a three year old son Andronicus. Due to the new monarch's minority, the regency is assumed by the Patriarch, who maneuvers around the Empress Irine and the Senate. The Empress suspects that the Patriarch plans to murder young Andronicus IV, and to install his own younger brother to the throne instead - thus, she appeals for help to the commander of the army, Nicephorus Acropolites. Nicephorus arrives in the capital, where he proclaims himself the protector of the young Emperor's rights. Shortly thereafter, he marries Irene, and is crowned Nicephorus III in Hagia Sophia - his coronation being part of an agreement between them to ensure the survival of Andronicus IV.
891 - The full might of the Mongol horde sweeps into China, eradicating any opposition. Driven by both the desire of conquest as well as the religious fervor, the Mongols slaughter everything in their way, resulting in millions of dead. As the terrified Chinese, both noble and commoner, flee south for their lives, the Mongols establish a new Empire on the territories formerly under Chinese control. The Mongol Khan Batu takes the title of the ruler he has defeated, and proclaims himself to be the Emperor of China, the chosen of God, the defender of faith of al-Din.
892 - In Venice, an old archivist goes through the centuries-old records, categorizing them to be properly catalogued in the Imperial library, when something catches his eye. He sees a mention of a device called aeoliphile, built in Roman Egypt seven centuries ago. Luckily, the archivist's favorite pasttime is constructing mechanical contraptions, many of which end up as toys for his younger children and grandchildren. Intrigued, he decides to give it a try, and to build a miniature one at home. If nothing, it would prove to be a good way to distract his youngest grandchild from interfering with the adults' business. While doing its fair share in distracting said grandchild, it also caught attention of the boy's father, a supervisor at mining operations. Even though the aeolophile is not very practical, and has very limited use, the man reasoned that with sufficient improvements, it could make his subordinates' job quite a bit easier. Thus, he sets to work, and comes up with a new and improved version of the engine, the one that actually could replace much manual labor. Over the next century, the age of the steam engine will come into full force.
893 - The Caliphate's expansion is by now grinding to a halt. Despite it taking over most of India, and the Mongols' conversion to al-Din, the Mongols are not willing to happily hand over the power to Caliph and walk to the side. Rather, they are empire builders themselves, creating a first time in Caliphate's history where there was another power following the faith of al-Din not recognizing political or religious claims of the Caliph. In China, the Mongols take over larger and larger chunks of the territory, completing their conquest by the end of the decade. Instead of pillaging and destroying everything in their way, however, they decide to settle in China en masse, permanently altering the balance of power there.
894 - The Russian prince Svyatopolk invades Byzantine territories, requiring Nicephorus III to take to the field. The battle, fought at Varna near the Black Sea coast, is a total Byzantine victory. The Russians, tired and battered after waves of Byzantine assaults, sue for peace, promising to vacate the Byzantine territory, asking only for enough provisions to make it home. Next year, the Russian ambassadors will arrive in Constantinople, negotiating a commercial treaty. From there on, the Russian ambitions would be centered elsewhere.
895 - Claudius V of the Venetian Empire, feeling mortally sick, abdicates the throne, asking the Senate to choose his successor, which they gladly do. They choose the one Giovanni da Vinci to be the next Emperor, and he is dutifully crowned in Venice. The new Emperor comes from a distinguished senatorial family, and his election sets the precedent of the Senate choosing the Emperor, rather than any kind of hereditary succession principle.
897 - The Vandal settlement in Ottonia thrives, despite initial difficulties. Several expeditions are sent to explore the mainland, returning with tales of many wondrous things, and of great riches. Many a young Vandal noble decide to try their luck on the continent, where the devastation caused by European diseases, steel and gunpowder weapons allows many to establish semi-independent principalities, all owing allegiance to the High King at Ottonia, but, due to low manpower available to the Vandals, practically independent in every respect. What the Vandals do not know is that the Norse longships by now have located what we know as Newfoundland. Calling the new island (for they believe it to be one) Vinnland, the Norse follow the shore south, eventually finding OTL's New England area, and establishing settlements there.
898 - Aquitaine and Frankia are by now somewhat recovered from civil strife, and establish renewed efforts to expand the kingdom. Through a complicated series of events, one Erik II establishes himself at the throne of Denmark, and conducts an alliance with the Aquitainian king. What makes Erik different from his predecessors is the fact that he is a Christian, and is very insistent in proselytizing among his subjects. The result is a civil war, which sets Erik and his supporters, mostly the merchants, the commoners, and many of the lower and middle classes, against the old pagan aristocracy. The pagan aristocracy of Denmark loses after a climactic battle at Copenhagen, making Erik's methods of converting his population more and more heavy-handed. Thus, by 900 there is a steady stream of Norse immigration from Denmark and rapidly Christianizing Norway and Sweden to the lands west - many of the refugees making it to Vinnland, strengthening the settlement there to become a viable state of its own.
899 - A Vandal explorer discovers the Mayan civilization on Yucatan peninsula. Awed by their perceived power and level of what he termed as "barbaric sophistication", the explorer decides that peaceful relations must be followed, as these organized, developed people are nothing like the relatively primitive tribes his people had encountered beforehand.
900 - The kingdom of Vinnland is established, with the capital in Odinheim. The new High Kings of Vinnland are a proud and defiant breed, seeking to spread their faith by sword, if needed, among the local native tribes. Being that the Vikings' religion and society emphasize martial values, many of the local tribes are more often than not willingly accepting the ways of the foreigners who, after all, are warriors like themselves, willing to respect warrior values. Thus, the kingdom of Vinnland in the following years develops an identity much different from that of the original European Norse.
Next installment - either later on today, or tomorrow.
Before I go into this update, one thing needs to be explained. Due to much confusion regarding the ATL religion named "Islam", I believe a name change for it may be necessary, to avoid both the confusion with OTL religion of the same name, as well as to not let any preconception about said religion one may have color the idea of what it is in ATL.
Thus, many thanks to Leo Caesius for suggesting an alternate name that would still make sense in the context of the TL. From now on, and with respect to the previous updates, any references to ATL "Islam" should be replaced to references to a religion called al-Din (pronounced ad-DEEN), which in Arabic means "The Religion", and would make sense with the people who believe theirs is the one true faith.
Therefore, the al-Din and the Islam in ATL are one and the same. Now, on with the update:
883 - The first Mongol raids into China are dismissed as nothing more than minor nuisanse - after all, the Chinese Emperor commands a numerous army, and could hide behind the walls of his well-fortified cities. Things do get serious enough within a short period of time where the Emperor sends a large army contingent to do a preemptive raid on the Mongols. This "preemptive raid" goes only to prove that the Mongols are much stronger opponent than any the Chinese have ever encountered. The Chinese army is slaughtered, and, to add insult to injury, Mongols retaliate, striking northern China and spreading devastation all around.
884 - In Constantinople, Leo V begins a massive building program, renovating much of the city that had been neglected by many of his predecessors. In a meanwhile, he is rather concerned with restoring some of the provinces that had been Imperial territory in the centuries past. By now, his eyes are centered on the Vandal state of Nea Vandalor, which occupies a relatively small stretch of land between Egypt and the Western Empire's possessions. His reasons for wanting to occupy Nea Vandalor are twofold, one, the glory of his Empire, two, a need to have a base from which to strike into either Egypt or the African territories of the Venetians should any problems with either nation arise.
885 - The kingdom of Nea Vandalor owes its continued existense to the desire of the Venetians to keep a buffer state between themselves and Egypt. In the days when relations between the two Roman Empires were much better, and they considered themselves a part of unique, inseparable entity, the Eastern Romans allowed this state of affairs to continue, especially considering that the Western Romans brought Nea Vandalor under their protection - the protection that has been recently withdrawn as a part of an agreement between Claudius V and Leo V. Thus, the Vandals appear to be an easy prey, not able to resist the onslaught of the Imperial army, and not possessing the manpower or resources to do significant damage. However, the Vandal nation is ruled by one Otto, a recently enthroned king of some vision and talent. Knowing all too well that not only he is locked between major powers and the desert, but that one of those very powers desires the land his kingdom is built on, he is rather desperate for any means of salvation. These means come in shape of a Norse mercenary, who casually mentions about the Norse exploits to the West, and about the new lands they had found. Despite the fact that most of those lands so far are rather worthless in terms of resources and ability to sustain large population, Otto is intrigued. Maybe, he hopes, the Pillars of Hercules are not the edge of the world, and there may yet be a way to save the Vandal nation from becoming one of the many Roman provinces. Secretly, he commissions an expedition to the West, disguising it as a trading mission to avoid its potential destruction by the Venetians. Using the new developments in ship design made in Venice and borrowing more than a few tricks of the trade from the Norse, the Vandals are able to construct three vessels, which are relatively ocean-worthy, and are able to operate beyond the confines of the Mediterranean.
886 - The Vandals receive an ultimatum from Constantinople to either accept a Byzantine governor and give up their independence, or to be destroyed. Many of the young Vandal nobles despise the very idea of surrender, preferring to go down in a blaze of glory; however, Otto is well aware that resistance is rather futile, and instead of rebuffing the Byzantines, all he could hope to do is to damage their forces enough - and infuriate them enough in the process - to where the eventual conquest would be not only more brutal, but more oppressive on any Vandal survivors. Besides, there are some good news to report - out of the three vessels sent out, two were lost to storms and navigational problems, however, one did return with tales of islands that seemed like paradise, strange creatures, and strange people inhabiting them. Otto believed he found his solution. In the general assembly of the Vandals, he addressed his subjects, telling them that they may yet shake off the chains of Roman oppression, and found a new, greater Vandalor - Magna Vandalor he calls it, the Great Vandalor, beyond the ocean. Alternatively, they may stay behind and fight, knowing their cause is doomed. Many of the Vandals present vow to join their king in a difficult travel many may not be able to survive - yet still, many decide to remain and fight on. Otto, in a meanwhile, tried to get his hands on any kind of a ship he could - resulting in a motley flotilla of some hundred ships being assembled, some relatively modern, but some barely able to float. Under the cover of the night, the Vandal fleet sails west, miraculously bypassing many Venetian and Byzantine patrols, and setting course into the unknown. The remaining Vandals' fate could be told quickly. The Byzantines show no mercy in subjugating the kingdom, relocating many of the survivors to the Caliphate frontier, while settling some others in Thrace and Macedonia. All traces of the Vandals in the Old World have been completely removed.
887 - Despite losing almost two thirds of the fleet, Otto himself among the casualties, the remainder of the Vandal host reaches an island that appears to offer ideal conditions for rebuilding. They name the island Ottonia, in the name of the monarch that led them on their perilous journey. The island is OTL's Cuba, located strategically to be able to expand into the mainland just a short travel beyond. In Constantinople, Leo V celebrates a triumph, looking for his next conquest to the northwest. Despite being fellow Orthodox Christians, the Bulgars do occupy many of the ancestral Imperial lands - this state of affairs, he believes, may not continue. Previously the Aquitainian and Venetian influence would have left these thoughts just that - thoughts; however, Aquitaine fell into civil war after disputed succession, and Claudius V of the Western Empire has his hands tied battling the Senate in the realm of political influence. Thus, he is free to interfere as much as he would like. He, however, did not account for one potential rival - the Kievan Russians, whose prince Svyatopolk has been determined to extend his already massive dominions to the south. As the Byzantines sweep into Bulgaria, so do the Russians. Leo manages to reach an agreement with the Russians, dividing the Bulgar lands into two sections - however, this only whets Svyatopolk's appetite.
889 - Leo V Paleologus dies of fever, leaving a three year old son Andronicus. Due to the new monarch's minority, the regency is assumed by the Patriarch, who maneuvers around the Empress Irine and the Senate. The Empress suspects that the Patriarch plans to murder young Andronicus IV, and to install his own younger brother to the throne instead - thus, she appeals for help to the commander of the army, Nicephorus Acropolites. Nicephorus arrives in the capital, where he proclaims himself the protector of the young Emperor's rights. Shortly thereafter, he marries Irene, and is crowned Nicephorus III in Hagia Sophia - his coronation being part of an agreement between them to ensure the survival of Andronicus IV.
891 - The full might of the Mongol horde sweeps into China, eradicating any opposition. Driven by both the desire of conquest as well as the religious fervor, the Mongols slaughter everything in their way, resulting in millions of dead. As the terrified Chinese, both noble and commoner, flee south for their lives, the Mongols establish a new Empire on the territories formerly under Chinese control. The Mongol Khan Batu takes the title of the ruler he has defeated, and proclaims himself to be the Emperor of China, the chosen of God, the defender of faith of al-Din.
892 - In Venice, an old archivist goes through the centuries-old records, categorizing them to be properly catalogued in the Imperial library, when something catches his eye. He sees a mention of a device called aeoliphile, built in Roman Egypt seven centuries ago. Luckily, the archivist's favorite pasttime is constructing mechanical contraptions, many of which end up as toys for his younger children and grandchildren. Intrigued, he decides to give it a try, and to build a miniature one at home. If nothing, it would prove to be a good way to distract his youngest grandchild from interfering with the adults' business. While doing its fair share in distracting said grandchild, it also caught attention of the boy's father, a supervisor at mining operations. Even though the aeolophile is not very practical, and has very limited use, the man reasoned that with sufficient improvements, it could make his subordinates' job quite a bit easier. Thus, he sets to work, and comes up with a new and improved version of the engine, the one that actually could replace much manual labor. Over the next century, the age of the steam engine will come into full force.
893 - The Caliphate's expansion is by now grinding to a halt. Despite it taking over most of India, and the Mongols' conversion to al-Din, the Mongols are not willing to happily hand over the power to Caliph and walk to the side. Rather, they are empire builders themselves, creating a first time in Caliphate's history where there was another power following the faith of al-Din not recognizing political or religious claims of the Caliph. In China, the Mongols take over larger and larger chunks of the territory, completing their conquest by the end of the decade. Instead of pillaging and destroying everything in their way, however, they decide to settle in China en masse, permanently altering the balance of power there.
894 - The Russian prince Svyatopolk invades Byzantine territories, requiring Nicephorus III to take to the field. The battle, fought at Varna near the Black Sea coast, is a total Byzantine victory. The Russians, tired and battered after waves of Byzantine assaults, sue for peace, promising to vacate the Byzantine territory, asking only for enough provisions to make it home. Next year, the Russian ambassadors will arrive in Constantinople, negotiating a commercial treaty. From there on, the Russian ambitions would be centered elsewhere.
895 - Claudius V of the Venetian Empire, feeling mortally sick, abdicates the throne, asking the Senate to choose his successor, which they gladly do. They choose the one Giovanni da Vinci to be the next Emperor, and he is dutifully crowned in Venice. The new Emperor comes from a distinguished senatorial family, and his election sets the precedent of the Senate choosing the Emperor, rather than any kind of hereditary succession principle.
897 - The Vandal settlement in Ottonia thrives, despite initial difficulties. Several expeditions are sent to explore the mainland, returning with tales of many wondrous things, and of great riches. Many a young Vandal noble decide to try their luck on the continent, where the devastation caused by European diseases, steel and gunpowder weapons allows many to establish semi-independent principalities, all owing allegiance to the High King at Ottonia, but, due to low manpower available to the Vandals, practically independent in every respect. What the Vandals do not know is that the Norse longships by now have located what we know as Newfoundland. Calling the new island (for they believe it to be one) Vinnland, the Norse follow the shore south, eventually finding OTL's New England area, and establishing settlements there.
898 - Aquitaine and Frankia are by now somewhat recovered from civil strife, and establish renewed efforts to expand the kingdom. Through a complicated series of events, one Erik II establishes himself at the throne of Denmark, and conducts an alliance with the Aquitainian king. What makes Erik different from his predecessors is the fact that he is a Christian, and is very insistent in proselytizing among his subjects. The result is a civil war, which sets Erik and his supporters, mostly the merchants, the commoners, and many of the lower and middle classes, against the old pagan aristocracy. The pagan aristocracy of Denmark loses after a climactic battle at Copenhagen, making Erik's methods of converting his population more and more heavy-handed. Thus, by 900 there is a steady stream of Norse immigration from Denmark and rapidly Christianizing Norway and Sweden to the lands west - many of the refugees making it to Vinnland, strengthening the settlement there to become a viable state of its own.
899 - A Vandal explorer discovers the Mayan civilization on Yucatan peninsula. Awed by their perceived power and level of what he termed as "barbaric sophistication", the explorer decides that peaceful relations must be followed, as these organized, developed people are nothing like the relatively primitive tribes his people had encountered beforehand.
900 - The kingdom of Vinnland is established, with the capital in Odinheim. The new High Kings of Vinnland are a proud and defiant breed, seeking to spread their faith by sword, if needed, among the local native tribes. Being that the Vikings' religion and society emphasize martial values, many of the local tribes are more often than not willingly accepting the ways of the foreigners who, after all, are warriors like themselves, willing to respect warrior values. Thus, the kingdom of Vinnland in the following years develops an identity much different from that of the original European Norse.
Next installment - either later on today, or tomorrow.
Great stuff- a bunch of quibbles and questions-
1)
I really like the usage of 'said' in this sentence. I've tried to re-use the word 'akin' in the usage 'like' in my stories and it's very comforting that such usage is being re-used.
2)
I'm curious if you've surfed SHWIF on google and come across the Empty America TL by Doug Hoff. He's got the same situation as you do but in different variations.
-
So the local tribes are or to the religion? Common sense would dictate that while some of the virtues held by the warriors would be accepted while otehrs would not. It's just the phrasing of this sentence that has me puzzled- especially the "willing to respect warrior values" part. Is it that bits and pieces of the religion are accepted while others are not?
Also- is the "pagan" world of the Vikings will become broken into seperate sects? (i.e. this church is for Freya, this church is for Thor, etc, etc)
3.
= to OTL's da Vinci? Will there be a Leonardo about?
4. Is it time for another map????
Overall, great segment. I await for more-
1)
I really like the usage of 'said' in this sentence. I've tried to re-use the word 'akin' in the usage 'like' in my stories and it's very comforting that such usage is being re-used.
2)
I'm curious if you've surfed SHWIF on google and come across the Empty America TL by Doug Hoff. He's got the same situation as you do but in different variations.
-
-
So the local tribes are
or to the religion? Common sense would dictate that while some of the virtues held by the warriors would be accepted while otehrs would not. It's just the phrasing of this sentence that has me puzzled- especially the "willing to respect warrior values" part. Is it that bits and pieces of the religion are accepted while others are not?Also- is the "pagan" world of the Vikings will become broken into seperate sects? (i.e. this church is for Freya, this church is for Thor, etc, etc)
3.
= to OTL's da Vinci? Will there be a Leonardo about?
4. Is it time for another map????
Overall, great segment. I await for more-
G.Bone said:
Thank you!
Unfortunately I am not too familiar with the TL in question - my idea was to create a world that develops quite differently, and to create a viable Vinnland - probably not the most original idea as to how to get it, but IMO it would be the most plausible.
--
So the local tribes are
Also- is the "pagan" world of the Vikings will become broken into seperate sects? (i.e. this church is for Freya, this church is for Thor, etc, etc)
Generally, the local tribes are receptive enough of the pagan Norse religion to have quite a few converts - and because the natives already have an established culture and society, the Norse would be quite willing to overlook that the natives tend to identify Odin, Thor, and the others with their own native deities. Rather, a curious trend will eventually appear where the Norse colonists will start to identify the Great Spirit with Odin, and pretty much state that the natives believe in the same gods, under different names, with much cultural interexchange.
As for the separate sects, I would imagine that it is somewhat likely, considering that the Norse will want to have as little central government control as possible, and as such, depending on which god(s) a particular noble is adhering to, that god(s) worship would be promoted in his domain. With less central authority, there would be very little in the way of enforcing worship of certain deities over the others.
There would be no relation to OTL's da Vinci, rather, I was thinking of coming up with a recognizable name with OTL overtones, but this time meaning someone completely different. By now, if there would even be someone named Leonardo da Vinci, it would be a completely different person from the one we all know
The use of the name was mostly to illustrate the length which separates the old Roman Imperium and the new "Venetian" Roman Empire, which is as far removed from Imperial Rome as XIIth century Byzantium would have been.Thank you! IMO another map right now could be quite good, especially if it would show the non-European civilizations - the spread of the Caliphate in India, the Vandal kingdom in Cuba, the Norse kingdom in Newfoundland, the Mongol Chinese Empire, and the still-surviving Chinese remnant in the south of China. Thank you for your help!
^Nice update, seems things are really moving ahead much faster then OTL, Technology wise (careful, or you’ll end up in Sci-Fi territory !)
!)Super55 said:^Nice update, seems things are really moving ahead much faster then OTL, Technology wise (careful, or you’ll end up in Sci-Fi territory
Heh... the idea is that the Dark Ages in Europe are not nearly as long, or as "dark" as in OTL because the "barbarian" successor kingdoms of the Roman Empire do not take hold, except for OTL France, Germany, and parts of Spain. Rather, the Goths in Italy are incorporated into the Empire, transforming it to something different.
The one thing I want to do in the future of this TL is to come up with an ideas on alternate technology development, as opposed to what we usually see as linear tech development in OTL. Thus, it may be possible to have a civilization that uses mechanical computers, rocket-powered semi-jet planes, steam-powered naval vessels, with the soldiers that use both gunpowder weapons and swords about the same, as long as they are not facing massive steam-powered mechs, but that yet has to learn about immunization, or about electricity.
Not to say this is exactly what I was going for, but rather alternate technological progress as opposed to faster one - certain things get invented much faster than in OTL, but some other things may not get invented for a while. Also, a more technologically advanced civilization ends up depending on its technology and social structure that comes with it more than a less advanced one - and as such, advanced civilizations are subject to perils (often of their own making) that less advanced, less populous civilizations may bypass.
In other words, there might be some ways in which the world of this ATL may seem "sci-fi"-ish further down the line (I am thinking 1500s-1600s), but in some aspects, this TL may be less advanced than our own, and may encounter another set of dark ages of its own making.
Thank you for all your comments, I'll try to get the next update up today, if I get time.
I did something like this. I was still using swords and had planes and steam ships long before gunpowder was being actively used. It all comes down to necessity and inspiration. If history had had someone to continue to develop the Baghdad battery we may have had the light bulb in a time when the most sophisticated weapon was still the sword.
The Butcher Of Aquitaine
As the Xth century comes about, things are starting to shape up nicely...
901 - The Venetian Empire is finally successful in subduing the Visigoths in Iberia all the way up to the Aquitainian frontier. By now, the Venetians control all of the territories of the old Western Roman Empire minus Gaul, Germannia, and Britain. The parallel is not lost on Giovanni I, who believes that by now, centuries-long process of reconquest might be getting close to completion. By now thirty one years old, he believes it is his life's work to bring the rebel provinces back into the fold - never mind the fact that said provinces had been independent kingdoms for centuries. The main problem is, of course, the resources, and the manpower necessary for such a task. With Iberia still not fully pacified, and North Africa being poorer, and sparcely populated, unlike in the days of the old, Giovanni knows he can only rely on limited manpower of Italy, and on mercenaries - the latter, being inherently unreliable in his mind, are not suited for the task. However, the Aquitainian Empire does have an Achilles heel - its feudal nature and the relative power of the nobles are the cracks that Giovanni intends to drive his strikes through. He hopes that he can play on the divisions within the Aquitainians themselves to eliminate the ancient enemy of the Venetian Empire once and for all. Thus, he openly allies with some of the prominent feudal lords of Aquitaine and Frankia, promising them lands and wealth in return for their allegiance. Not surprisingly, the Aquitainian response is what one may expect - and just what Giovanni wanted.
902 - Using an army of both Italians and mercenary Norse and Lombards, Giovanni captures the southern Gaul without much resistance - in fact, by a liberal use of carrot-and-stick style diplomacy, he ensured that the local nobles swear their allegiance to him, then being left undisturbed. The rest of the population of Frankia does not seem to care much - in their minds, they are simply exchanging one overlord for the other. It is at Toulouse that the Venetians encounter the most serious resistance - a loyalist group of barons holed up in the castle, and decreed that they shall not submit to a Roman tyrant. The Roman tyrant's bombards and cannons were happy to prove them wrong.
903 - As Andronicus IV reaches adulthood in Constantinople, tensions are high between him and his supposed guardian, Nicephorus III. Soon, there is rioting in the streets, as both the populace and the Senate are polarized into factions supporting each. Andronicus' supporters claim that Nicephorus' time as a regent is over, and thus he must abdicate the throne and retire into private life. Nicephorus, after fourteen years on the throne, is understandably angered, and retorts that while young Andronicus was playing with his toy soldiers, he had been busy saving the Empire from threats external and internal. When the Empress Irine tries to meddle, she finds the hard way that both parties do have one thing in common - they have very little appreciation for her, as both agree Irine tries to take on the power that should be rightfully theirs. Thus, as Irine speeds up on her way to "honorable retirement" (which just happens to be on an island of Proti, in a "large, luxurious monastery" belonging, ironically, to a particularly austere and, shall we say, "unworldly" order of monks), an uneasy temporary peace sets in. In a meanwhile, the Frankish and Aquitainian army assembles in Gaul, commanded by Aquitainian king Henry in person. Giovanni I tries not to give battle, instead, methodically taking cities and towns one by one, and concentrating his forces where he believes the Franks would not dare to attack him - especially considering that many of the Frankish barons are by now openly allying themselves with Venetians.
904 - An uneasy peace in Constantinople is broken as a plot is revealed to murder Nicephorus. While there is no direct proof, all fingers point at Andronicus, who refuses to take blame. As both Emperors' supporters take to the streets, the fighting rages on. The fighting is the worst Constantinople had seen in centuries, and when the fires start, they not only add insult to injury, but devastate large portions of the city. Finally, Nicephorus manages to sneak out a loyal servant with orders to the army officers to enter the city, which, with help from the inside, they do. This is when things get from bad to worse. The military slaughters supporters of both parties indiscriminately, which results in pretty much the entire population of Constantinople battling the Byzantine soldiers. While Nicephorus does manage to restore some degree of order, the damage has been done, and young Andronicus, who managed to sneak out of the city using a secret passageway out of the palace, is quick to accuse him of massacre. Andronicus assumes personal command of the Army of Thrace, and marches on the capital, intending to depose "the usurper" once and for all. Nicephorus, unfortunately for him, is calamitously unprepared, while Andronicus' propaganda successfully agitates the population of the capital and much of the local military against him. Thus, he decides that abdication may yet save his life, and the doors of a monastery close behind a rather reluctant monk "Matthew". Unfortunately for him, Andronicus decides that it is better to be safe than sorry, and has Nicephorus' eyes put out before sticking the old man back into his cloister.
905 - Giovanni's maneuvering resulted in Aquitainian and Frankish forces being split in two, as his army now controls the corridor between Aquitaine proper and Frankia, all the way to the Atlantic Ocean. King Henry's army attempts to break through from Frankia into Aquitaine to reinfoce the defenders there, finally being able to force a battle. The engagement is not as much a disaster for Venetians as an embarrasment - however, Giovanni does have to pull back and to replenish some of his forces. Henry claims victory, and proceeds to make an example of several captive Frankish barons who switched sides earlier. For the rest of the Gaulish War, incidents of feudal barons switching sides got to an all-time low.
906 - A Kievan prince Yaroslav succeeds in uniting enough of the Russian principalities to where he begins to style himself Veliki Kniaz (Grand Prince). By now, Christianity begins to spread into the Russian lands, which are still predominantly pagan. The cause of Christianity is greatly helped by Yaroslav's favorite wife Svetlana, who adopts the religion, and is able to convince her husband to allow the Christians to continue unmolested.
907 - After licking his wounds Giovanni I returns to Gaul with a new army that consists both of veterans of his previous campaigns, and fresh recruits. This time around, he believes Aquitaine itself is where his enemy is the weakest - removing the main powerbase of Henry from the contest will bring, he believes, the trembling Frankish barons to the point of revolt. Henry knows this well, too, and wastes no time in calling his army up for a decisive battle. Under the walls of the capital of Aquitaine, Bordeaux, the battle is joined by some fifty thousand Franks and Aquitainians, and around forty thousand Venetian Romans. At first, things seem to be going well for Henry, until his forces wander into a carefully prepared ambush where Giovanni used what he believes to be a battle-winning weapon - "the flute of Pan", which is a series of handguns and small cannon tied together, resembling the musical instrument of the ancient god (incidentally, the OTL version of the weapon is known as the "Organ gun"). The result is a rapidly firing stream of death that is unlike anything the Franks had seen before. Its major advantage is that the "flute" could be operated by a small crew, therefore allowing for a battery of these weapons to be operated by small, easily hidden regiment. The Franks break and rout, as the Venetians are in hot pursuit. Thousands of Franks and Aquitainians, including the king Henry's son and heir Phillip, make it for the relative safety of Bordeaux, while the rest of the army flees for their lives. What they don't realize is that being holed up in a city is a Bad, Bad Idea (tm). When the food runs out, they have to start eating the horses. When the horses run out, it is on to dogs and cats. When there are none of those left, it is the flesh of the dead. By the time the Franks were looking at each other hungrily and debating who should be drawing the shortest straw, Venetian bombards mercifully breached open the gates of the city. It is here that Giovanni's most famous and most ignominous action occurs. He orders the entire male population of Bordeaux, including all of the Frankish and Aquitainian soldiers, put to death as an example to any who may resist the Roman power, selling the women and children into slavery. It is said that the slaughter lasted three days, and the Romans only stopped after their horses walked knee-deep in blood. Upon hearing the news, king Henry fell into deep depression, and died, signalling the beginning of the end of the war.
908 - The Mongol rule over China is solidified. The Khan-Emperor is now looking for a next target of expansion, and finds it just within sights. The islands of Nippon, or Japan, are rich and well developed, and despite the Japanese warriors' willingness to defend their islands to the death, would prove to be no match for the Mongol dragoons and Chinese handgunners employed in enormous numbers. With this in mind, the Mongols start building a great invasion fleet, which will take two years to complete.
909 - The Khazar Kaganate is facing a crisis. With the Kaganate's position in between regional and major powers of Kievan Rus, Arab Caliphate, and Byzantine Empire, its opportunities for expansion are rather limited, especially considering its ever-growing population. Thus, the Kagan looks to the steppes in the East. By now, the Khazar society has changed quite a bit from their nomadic days centuries ago. The Khazars have all the beginnings of a true state, borrowing many of the Arab and Byzantine social institutions, as well as much of the military technology. As such, the Kagan believes that orderly, organized expansion is the key to growing the Khazar state, as well as provide space for his people to settle on. Although they may take centuries to fully blossom, the beginnings of great Khazar Siberian Empire are sown.
910 - The Venetians have been busy mopping up remaining Frankish resistance in Gaul for the last three years. Despite the brutal massacre at Bordeaux that earned Giovanni I the nickname of "The Butcher Of Aquitaine", in victory the Venetians are generally rather accomodating, allowing many of the Frankish nobles to keep much of their land and ancestral privileges. Of course, wherever these privileges are in direct conflict with the Imperial authority, the "hierarchy of order" is reinforced, leading to the Franks becoming apparently loyal subjects in record time. Upon return to Venice, Giovanni I gives himself a triumph, proclaiming to the Senate and the citizens that he has restored Roman rule in Gaul. In a meanwhile, the Mongol attack into Japan starts, with the Mongol army landing on the northern island. The subjugation of Japan will take an entire decade, with periodic rebellions springing up for years afterwards, but ultimately the Mongol juggernaut proves to be too much for the Japanese to stop.
912 - The Norse kingdom of Vinland grows considerably, incorporating the natives - the weaker tribes as slaves, the stronger, more warlike tribes as equals, providing they acknowledge the Norse gods and pay them proper respect. In Cuba, the Vandal kingdom incorporates the native tribes by frequent intermarriage and assimilation - the outright large-scale conquest outside of setting up of small principalities is hard due to relatively small numbers of the Vandals. As such, the Vandal kingdom is more influenced by the Mayans and the other native cultures, giving back the knowledge of iron, and Christianity. While the Mayan Empire does not convert to Christianity for another three decades, smaller states around it and lesser tribes do, leading to the virtual political isolation of the Maya and to the Vandal-led alliance of Christian states of this new land rising to prominence. The one direction the Vandals do not explore in, however, is the east, for this is where those that persecuted their ancestors are, still plotting to eradicate every trace of the Vandal nation - or so they believe. Thus, the Vandals of Ottonia institute the Eastguard, a group of patrol ships designed for speed and armed with cannons and rockets. Their mission - to intercept any intruding ship that wanders too far into the new world, and to capture or destroy it. Over the years, the design of the Eastguard ships is improved, making them easier to hide in the ocean by partially submerging most of the ship's structure. The early experiments on hiding the entire ship underwater are unsuccessful, partially due to the lack of adequate propulsion - the actual submarines are still many years away; however, the advancements in ship design techniques learned by the Vandals are priceless.
913 - The Empire of Axum covers most of East coast of Africa, with the trading posts and colonies established as far east as Australia. Due to large amounts of cultural and technological exchange between the Axumites and nations of Europe, they are just as technologically advanced as both Roman Empires, and the Caliphate, whereas Axumite traders' travels take them through many parts of the world, ensuring that most news of foreign lands have passed through at least one Axumite. As much as the Byzantines try to match the mercantile profits of Axum, they could only watch in awe at the great trading empire that originally initiated in Ethiopia. Unfortunately, news and trade goods are not the only things carried by the Axumite naval merchants. An outbreak of the plague in China is spread to most corners of the civilized world through a combination of Dini pilgrims, Mongol conquerors, and Axumite traders. In 913, the plague strikes India. In 914, it reaches Ethiopia. In 915, the plague hits Alexandria, from where it spreads to most of Europe.
915 - The plague kills the Venetian Emperor Giovanni just as he plans to execute an expedition to Britain, attempting to retake that land for his Empire. The Senate chooses Giovanni's nephew Michael to take the throne as Michael IV.
916 - The large outbreak of the plague ends, although not until causing some devastating results. North Africa, Gaul, Anatolia, Italy, and Greece are all depopulated, with misery reaching gigantic proportions. The Khazars, however, seem to show more resistance to the plague, resulting in fewer deaths. Therefore, their expansion to the steppes in the east proceeds unimpeded as their immediate neighbours struggle with the aftermath of the plague.
Next installment - tomorrow.
As the Xth century comes about, things are starting to shape up nicely...
901 - The Venetian Empire is finally successful in subduing the Visigoths in Iberia all the way up to the Aquitainian frontier. By now, the Venetians control all of the territories of the old Western Roman Empire minus Gaul, Germannia, and Britain. The parallel is not lost on Giovanni I, who believes that by now, centuries-long process of reconquest might be getting close to completion. By now thirty one years old, he believes it is his life's work to bring the rebel provinces back into the fold - never mind the fact that said provinces had been independent kingdoms for centuries. The main problem is, of course, the resources, and the manpower necessary for such a task. With Iberia still not fully pacified, and North Africa being poorer, and sparcely populated, unlike in the days of the old, Giovanni knows he can only rely on limited manpower of Italy, and on mercenaries - the latter, being inherently unreliable in his mind, are not suited for the task. However, the Aquitainian Empire does have an Achilles heel - its feudal nature and the relative power of the nobles are the cracks that Giovanni intends to drive his strikes through. He hopes that he can play on the divisions within the Aquitainians themselves to eliminate the ancient enemy of the Venetian Empire once and for all. Thus, he openly allies with some of the prominent feudal lords of Aquitaine and Frankia, promising them lands and wealth in return for their allegiance. Not surprisingly, the Aquitainian response is what one may expect - and just what Giovanni wanted.
902 - Using an army of both Italians and mercenary Norse and Lombards, Giovanni captures the southern Gaul without much resistance - in fact, by a liberal use of carrot-and-stick style diplomacy, he ensured that the local nobles swear their allegiance to him, then being left undisturbed. The rest of the population of Frankia does not seem to care much - in their minds, they are simply exchanging one overlord for the other. It is at Toulouse that the Venetians encounter the most serious resistance - a loyalist group of barons holed up in the castle, and decreed that they shall not submit to a Roman tyrant. The Roman tyrant's bombards and cannons were happy to prove them wrong.
903 - As Andronicus IV reaches adulthood in Constantinople, tensions are high between him and his supposed guardian, Nicephorus III. Soon, there is rioting in the streets, as both the populace and the Senate are polarized into factions supporting each. Andronicus' supporters claim that Nicephorus' time as a regent is over, and thus he must abdicate the throne and retire into private life. Nicephorus, after fourteen years on the throne, is understandably angered, and retorts that while young Andronicus was playing with his toy soldiers, he had been busy saving the Empire from threats external and internal. When the Empress Irine tries to meddle, she finds the hard way that both parties do have one thing in common - they have very little appreciation for her, as both agree Irine tries to take on the power that should be rightfully theirs. Thus, as Irine speeds up on her way to "honorable retirement" (which just happens to be on an island of Proti, in a "large, luxurious monastery" belonging, ironically, to a particularly austere and, shall we say, "unworldly" order of monks), an uneasy temporary peace sets in. In a meanwhile, the Frankish and Aquitainian army assembles in Gaul, commanded by Aquitainian king Henry in person. Giovanni I tries not to give battle, instead, methodically taking cities and towns one by one, and concentrating his forces where he believes the Franks would not dare to attack him - especially considering that many of the Frankish barons are by now openly allying themselves with Venetians.
904 - An uneasy peace in Constantinople is broken as a plot is revealed to murder Nicephorus. While there is no direct proof, all fingers point at Andronicus, who refuses to take blame. As both Emperors' supporters take to the streets, the fighting rages on. The fighting is the worst Constantinople had seen in centuries, and when the fires start, they not only add insult to injury, but devastate large portions of the city. Finally, Nicephorus manages to sneak out a loyal servant with orders to the army officers to enter the city, which, with help from the inside, they do. This is when things get from bad to worse. The military slaughters supporters of both parties indiscriminately, which results in pretty much the entire population of Constantinople battling the Byzantine soldiers. While Nicephorus does manage to restore some degree of order, the damage has been done, and young Andronicus, who managed to sneak out of the city using a secret passageway out of the palace, is quick to accuse him of massacre. Andronicus assumes personal command of the Army of Thrace, and marches on the capital, intending to depose "the usurper" once and for all. Nicephorus, unfortunately for him, is calamitously unprepared, while Andronicus' propaganda successfully agitates the population of the capital and much of the local military against him. Thus, he decides that abdication may yet save his life, and the doors of a monastery close behind a rather reluctant monk "Matthew". Unfortunately for him, Andronicus decides that it is better to be safe than sorry, and has Nicephorus' eyes put out before sticking the old man back into his cloister.
905 - Giovanni's maneuvering resulted in Aquitainian and Frankish forces being split in two, as his army now controls the corridor between Aquitaine proper and Frankia, all the way to the Atlantic Ocean. King Henry's army attempts to break through from Frankia into Aquitaine to reinfoce the defenders there, finally being able to force a battle. The engagement is not as much a disaster for Venetians as an embarrasment - however, Giovanni does have to pull back and to replenish some of his forces. Henry claims victory, and proceeds to make an example of several captive Frankish barons who switched sides earlier. For the rest of the Gaulish War, incidents of feudal barons switching sides got to an all-time low.
906 - A Kievan prince Yaroslav succeeds in uniting enough of the Russian principalities to where he begins to style himself Veliki Kniaz (Grand Prince). By now, Christianity begins to spread into the Russian lands, which are still predominantly pagan. The cause of Christianity is greatly helped by Yaroslav's favorite wife Svetlana, who adopts the religion, and is able to convince her husband to allow the Christians to continue unmolested.
907 - After licking his wounds Giovanni I returns to Gaul with a new army that consists both of veterans of his previous campaigns, and fresh recruits. This time around, he believes Aquitaine itself is where his enemy is the weakest - removing the main powerbase of Henry from the contest will bring, he believes, the trembling Frankish barons to the point of revolt. Henry knows this well, too, and wastes no time in calling his army up for a decisive battle. Under the walls of the capital of Aquitaine, Bordeaux, the battle is joined by some fifty thousand Franks and Aquitainians, and around forty thousand Venetian Romans. At first, things seem to be going well for Henry, until his forces wander into a carefully prepared ambush where Giovanni used what he believes to be a battle-winning weapon - "the flute of Pan", which is a series of handguns and small cannon tied together, resembling the musical instrument of the ancient god (incidentally, the OTL version of the weapon is known as the "Organ gun"). The result is a rapidly firing stream of death that is unlike anything the Franks had seen before. Its major advantage is that the "flute" could be operated by a small crew, therefore allowing for a battery of these weapons to be operated by small, easily hidden regiment. The Franks break and rout, as the Venetians are in hot pursuit. Thousands of Franks and Aquitainians, including the king Henry's son and heir Phillip, make it for the relative safety of Bordeaux, while the rest of the army flees for their lives. What they don't realize is that being holed up in a city is a Bad, Bad Idea (tm). When the food runs out, they have to start eating the horses. When the horses run out, it is on to dogs and cats. When there are none of those left, it is the flesh of the dead. By the time the Franks were looking at each other hungrily and debating who should be drawing the shortest straw, Venetian bombards mercifully breached open the gates of the city. It is here that Giovanni's most famous and most ignominous action occurs. He orders the entire male population of Bordeaux, including all of the Frankish and Aquitainian soldiers, put to death as an example to any who may resist the Roman power, selling the women and children into slavery. It is said that the slaughter lasted three days, and the Romans only stopped after their horses walked knee-deep in blood. Upon hearing the news, king Henry fell into deep depression, and died, signalling the beginning of the end of the war.
908 - The Mongol rule over China is solidified. The Khan-Emperor is now looking for a next target of expansion, and finds it just within sights. The islands of Nippon, or Japan, are rich and well developed, and despite the Japanese warriors' willingness to defend their islands to the death, would prove to be no match for the Mongol dragoons and Chinese handgunners employed in enormous numbers. With this in mind, the Mongols start building a great invasion fleet, which will take two years to complete.
909 - The Khazar Kaganate is facing a crisis. With the Kaganate's position in between regional and major powers of Kievan Rus, Arab Caliphate, and Byzantine Empire, its opportunities for expansion are rather limited, especially considering its ever-growing population. Thus, the Kagan looks to the steppes in the East. By now, the Khazar society has changed quite a bit from their nomadic days centuries ago. The Khazars have all the beginnings of a true state, borrowing many of the Arab and Byzantine social institutions, as well as much of the military technology. As such, the Kagan believes that orderly, organized expansion is the key to growing the Khazar state, as well as provide space for his people to settle on. Although they may take centuries to fully blossom, the beginnings of great Khazar Siberian Empire are sown.
910 - The Venetians have been busy mopping up remaining Frankish resistance in Gaul for the last three years. Despite the brutal massacre at Bordeaux that earned Giovanni I the nickname of "The Butcher Of Aquitaine", in victory the Venetians are generally rather accomodating, allowing many of the Frankish nobles to keep much of their land and ancestral privileges. Of course, wherever these privileges are in direct conflict with the Imperial authority, the "hierarchy of order" is reinforced, leading to the Franks becoming apparently loyal subjects in record time. Upon return to Venice, Giovanni I gives himself a triumph, proclaiming to the Senate and the citizens that he has restored Roman rule in Gaul. In a meanwhile, the Mongol attack into Japan starts, with the Mongol army landing on the northern island. The subjugation of Japan will take an entire decade, with periodic rebellions springing up for years afterwards, but ultimately the Mongol juggernaut proves to be too much for the Japanese to stop.
912 - The Norse kingdom of Vinland grows considerably, incorporating the natives - the weaker tribes as slaves, the stronger, more warlike tribes as equals, providing they acknowledge the Norse gods and pay them proper respect. In Cuba, the Vandal kingdom incorporates the native tribes by frequent intermarriage and assimilation - the outright large-scale conquest outside of setting up of small principalities is hard due to relatively small numbers of the Vandals. As such, the Vandal kingdom is more influenced by the Mayans and the other native cultures, giving back the knowledge of iron, and Christianity. While the Mayan Empire does not convert to Christianity for another three decades, smaller states around it and lesser tribes do, leading to the virtual political isolation of the Maya and to the Vandal-led alliance of Christian states of this new land rising to prominence. The one direction the Vandals do not explore in, however, is the east, for this is where those that persecuted their ancestors are, still plotting to eradicate every trace of the Vandal nation - or so they believe. Thus, the Vandals of Ottonia institute the Eastguard, a group of patrol ships designed for speed and armed with cannons and rockets. Their mission - to intercept any intruding ship that wanders too far into the new world, and to capture or destroy it. Over the years, the design of the Eastguard ships is improved, making them easier to hide in the ocean by partially submerging most of the ship's structure. The early experiments on hiding the entire ship underwater are unsuccessful, partially due to the lack of adequate propulsion - the actual submarines are still many years away; however, the advancements in ship design techniques learned by the Vandals are priceless.
913 - The Empire of Axum covers most of East coast of Africa, with the trading posts and colonies established as far east as Australia. Due to large amounts of cultural and technological exchange between the Axumites and nations of Europe, they are just as technologically advanced as both Roman Empires, and the Caliphate, whereas Axumite traders' travels take them through many parts of the world, ensuring that most news of foreign lands have passed through at least one Axumite. As much as the Byzantines try to match the mercantile profits of Axum, they could only watch in awe at the great trading empire that originally initiated in Ethiopia. Unfortunately, news and trade goods are not the only things carried by the Axumite naval merchants. An outbreak of the plague in China is spread to most corners of the civilized world through a combination of Dini pilgrims, Mongol conquerors, and Axumite traders. In 913, the plague strikes India. In 914, it reaches Ethiopia. In 915, the plague hits Alexandria, from where it spreads to most of Europe.
915 - The plague kills the Venetian Emperor Giovanni just as he plans to execute an expedition to Britain, attempting to retake that land for his Empire. The Senate chooses Giovanni's nephew Michael to take the throne as Michael IV.
916 - The large outbreak of the plague ends, although not until causing some devastating results. North Africa, Gaul, Anatolia, Italy, and Greece are all depopulated, with misery reaching gigantic proportions. The Khazars, however, seem to show more resistance to the plague, resulting in fewer deaths. Therefore, their expansion to the steppes in the east proceeds unimpeded as their immediate neighbours struggle with the aftermath of the plague.
Next installment - tomorrow.
Great stuff as usual but I was really kind of bewildered on how the Khazars manage to get to Siberia when the area in between the "el-Din" Caliphate and Russia. That 'corridor' is kind of small.
Also- I wasn't too sure on how big the settlement that the Vandals have so I gave them Florida. Worthless state anyhow...
Some issues=
-What the heck happened to the Bulgars and that space (see map) between the Danes, Venice, the Bulgars, and Russia?
-How are the Danes different from the Norse? Are they the same?
-Define "most of India" for me- is that South India, most of North India, or North India and most of Afghanistan?
-How much does the southern border of Egypt extend?
Not listed on the map=
-Khazar, obviously, is the dark green color in OTL's Caucaus (sp?)
-The striped (blue & whatever is the Vandals) is their "allies"
-White spaces are unexplored
Also- I wasn't too sure on how big the settlement that the Vandals have so I gave them Florida. Worthless state anyhow...
Some issues=
-What the heck happened to the Bulgars and that space (see map) between the Danes, Venice, the Bulgars, and Russia?
-How are the Danes different from the Norse? Are they the same?
-Define "most of India" for me- is that South India, most of North India, or North India and most of Afghanistan?
-How much does the southern border of Egypt extend?
Not listed on the map=
-Khazar, obviously, is the dark green color in OTL's Caucaus (sp?)
-The striped (blue & whatever is the Vandals) is their "allies"
-White spaces are unexplored
Last edited:
G.Bone said:Great stuff as usual but I was really kind of bewildered on how the Khazars manage to get to Siberia when the area in between the "el-Din" Caliphate and Russia. That 'corridor' is kind of small.
Also- I wasn't too sure on how big the settlement that the Vandals have so I gave them Florida. Worthless state anyhow...
Some issues=
-What the heck happened to the Bulgars and that space (see map) between the Danes, Venice, the Bulgars, and Russia?
-How are the Danes different from the Norse? Are they the same?
-Define "most of India" for me- is that South India, most of North India, or North India and most of Afghanistan?
-How much does the southern border of Egypt extend?
Great job on the map! Thank you for making it!
The Khazars are able to get more into Siberia because the Mongol Empire did not spread nearly as far West as it would have eventually in OTL - they would not reach the Caspian, and would probably be only as far west as Tibet or so.
The Bulgars had been conquered by both the Rus and the Byzantines - the Byzantines get the portion of their dominions south of the Danube, the Russians get everything north of it, and the areas close to Dalmatia stay independent in a state of semi-anarchy. The area that would be roughly OTL Germany is in ATL still mostly pagan, and is populated by tribes of various organization such as the Prussians and the Lithuanians.
The kingdoms of Norway and Denmark are by now separate entities, resulting from a dynastic split - however, they are still populated by people who are very similar ethnically, religiously, and linguistically. The Caliphate controls almost all of Indian subcontinent, with the exception of few areas opposing Ceylon which are independent but practically vassals of the Caliphate - pretty much the area that is attributed to Axum.
Southern border of Egypt goes about as far as it does in OTL modern Egypt, however, instead of OTL modern Egyptian borders, the area of Egyptian influence would be centered around the path of the Nile. As for Florida, the Vandals could definitely have it... I was thinking of writing in a few bits about their encounter with the Seminoles and the Cherokee, who thus form nation-states due to Vandal influence, so the Vandals may only get the coast of Florida, at least due to Seminoles possessing the interior.
All in all, when and if the Venetians or the Byzantines - or anyone else for that matter gets to Americas, they are going to be in for a few surprises...
Not to mention what I have in mind for the future of the Venetian Empire... Nice update, midgardmetal, and nice map, G.Bone.
Just a few things, If the “Venetian” Empire has just reconquered Gaul, then hasn’t the last reason to keep the capital at Venice disappeared? Isn’t it safe for the Emperor to go back to Rome? Also, G.Bone, great map, but the Byzantine Boarder should be along the Danube, but it seems to spill quite a bit into Romania in your map.
Anyway, that’s it, keep up the good work!
Just a few things, If the “Venetian” Empire has just reconquered Gaul, then hasn’t the last reason to keep the capital at Venice disappeared? Isn’t it safe for the Emperor to go back to Rome? Also, G.Bone, great map, but the Byzantine Boarder should be along the Danube, but it seems to spill quite a bit into Romania in your map.
Anyway, that’s it, keep up the good work!
Super55 said:
Thank you! As far as the capital in Venice, by now it has been there for so long to where the entire system of government is located there, and the "Venetians" are reluctant to move. Moreover, it would still be closer to any potential action against the Lombards, Byzantines, and whoever else, and would still be a major naval base, which by now is one of the pillars on which "Venetian" Empire's power rests. What I was thinking of is to have the "Venetians" make Rome the official capital again, but still conduct all business from Venice, which is essentially the same as keeping the capital there.