Anyone Read "Tears of the Sun"?

Dave Howery

I did, and I posted a thread on it here days ago that was widely ignored, so I'm guessing not many have read it. IMO, they're milking this series to damn much, and this is one book too many...
 

MerryPrankster

Dave Howery said:
I did, and I posted a thread on it here days ago that was widely ignored, so I'm guessing not many have read it. IMO, they're milking this series to damn much, and this is one book too many...
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As Stirlingdraka said in your thread, two more books planned.

And at DragonCon, Stirling said he's got plans for "Erik the Strong" (in post-Change Maine--he was the founder of the neo-Viking culture) and a Change novel in Australia with John Birmingham.
 

Birmo

Didnt know Steve had spoken publicly about this. But yes. We've had a few chats. FWIW I'm luvin TotS
 

Beauhooligan

I just finished the book, well really last week, and thought it was an excellent read and a full follow through in the series. Steve did something in this book that he has not previously done. In this book he has set aside the massive set-piece battles he is known for, and concentrated on developing characters, most significantly that of Lady Tiphanie d'Ath. Prior to this book I had thought of Lady Tiphanie as many things, but I never thought I would come to understand and even appreciate her. Lady Death, as she is known, was hoping to be an Olympic gymnast until the Change (6:15 PM PST, March 17, 1998) a sudden worldwide event that alters physical laws so that electricity, gunpowder, and most other forms of high-energy-density technology no longer work, and 99% of humanity dies, and leaves her with no future. As she reflects, she was already too tall to be an Olympian. Instead she becomes an assassin for Lady Sandra Arminger (wife of Norman Arminger, Chief of the Portland Protective Association and all-round mordant, evil guy) during the War of the Eye. In this volume we find out more about Lady Tiphanie, more than I supposed possible. If I was young and fit, and we were of the same age during the Change, I'd try and offer her a partnership; I'd hit em, she'd finish em, fair trade above expense in gold; no sex. Strictly business, seven figures minimum. I go along with her keeping her Princess Delhia, while I'd be chasing every skirt that, remarkably, was very much like Her Princess. We'd kill anyone, anytime, but at premiere rate. :D

This story also sees the death of one of the original, and rivaling for the most original, primal, characters from Dies the Fire. I'm a tough old guy folks, but I read the Hobbit and LOTR when I was between 10 and 11, that would be in 1962-63. I loved, and still love that story. It's a story of rebirth and resurrection, of exploration and self sacrifice, redemption and renewal; as good as any I've have come across. But, who am I to criticize?

S.M.S. is continuing to produce a well developed, culturally significant, alternate history of Earth. He has multiple characters playing across the expanse of North America; from Oregon to Iowa to Norrheim in Maine, to Nantucket and beyond, and more importantly, all the way back to crown Montival.
 
Thande

Thande

Donor
MerryPrankster said:
Too much food description and not enough battles, although it wasn't a bad book overall.
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Although I don't agree with a lot of Stirling's views, I respect his ability to write about food and nature in a way few authors outside Tolkien are capable of. You Americans don't appreciate the value of a good food-porn writer, but it's a part of our culture and I always enjoy it in his books (well, the ones that don't involve cannibalism).

I say this even though I found out yesterday (hilariously) that Stirling has trolled AH.com on TVTropes.
 
Thande

Thande

Donor
Georgepatton said:
Oh? What's this now?
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If you look at the article on the Peshawar Lancers, someone has added a reference to the efforts by people like Analytical Engine and General Finley (IIRC) on AH.com to come up with more realistic versions of the idea, and Stirling totally justifying-edited them :D You can tell it's him because no-one else uses -hyphens- for -emphasis-, it made his posts distinctive back before he was banned here.
 

Mad Missouri

Thande said:
If you look at the article on the Peshawar Lancers, someone has added a reference to the efforts by people like Analytical Engine and General Finley (IIRC) on AH.com to come up with more realistic versions of the idea, and Stirling totally justifying-edited them :D You can tell it's him because no-one else uses -hyphens- for -emphasis-, it made his posts distinctive back before he was banned here.
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I don't think thats really surprising. For awhile Stirling was really against FanFics on sites he couldn't control. I think he once claimed on Stirling.com that his lawyer or agent or someone like that told him that allowing FanFics in his world was a bad idea. And he really did have a axe to grind against anything AH.com. When Ian banned him he had a rant about it on Stirling.com.
 
Thande

Thande

Donor
Mad Missouri said:
I don't think thats really surprising. For awhile Stirling was really against FanFics on sites he couldn't control. I think he once claimed on Stirling.com that his lawyer or agent or someone like that told him that allowing FanFics in his world was a bad idea. And he really did have a axe to grind against anything AH.com. When Ian banned him he had a rant about it on Stirling.com.
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I can understand his position on fanfiction, I have a similar view myself, but it's not like the AH.com projects are using his characters or story or anything, they're just being inspired by the basic setting in the same way that Stirling himself was inspired by early 20th century science fiction when writing his inhabited-Venus scenario and by Flashman and Kipling when writing the Peshawar Lancers itself. And like Stirling the AH.com writers are acknowledging that inspiration in those works.
 
modelcitizen

modelcitizen

enough with the faux Vikings etc.

let's go back to Nantucket and the two Hollard dynasties in the Middle East, that sounds more fun to me.
 

Mad Missouri

modelcitizen said:
enough with the faux Vikings etc.

let's go back to Nantucket and the two Hollard dynasties in the Middle East, that sounds more fun to me.
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Never going to happen. Sterling is making lots of money with the pagan/wiccan/knight world books right now. And that's what it's really about. As long as that series sells well that's what he will write. If I had to bet money I'd guess there will be a few more books after the Maine Viking book set in this world and when/if those don't sell well enough then it's on to a different subject.
 
modelcitizen

modelcitizen

Mad Missouri said:
Never going to happen. Sterling is making lots of money with the pagan/wiccan/knight world books right now. And that's what it's really about. As long as that series sells well that's what he will write. If I had to bet money I'd guess there will be a few more books after the Maine Viking book set in this world and when/if those don't sell well enough then it's on to a different subject.
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I remember reading somewhere (I think it was an Amazon chat thingy) where Stirling said he would write a (iirc) Peshawar Lancers sequel if he was offered a book deal on it.

So... who wants to pitch in and make him an offer to complete a Draka prequel (and inter-quel?) series, a Peshwar Lancer-based series, and another trilogy to follow ISOT/On The Oceans Of Eternity/In The Waves Of Time etc? (Okay, it's ISOT, Against the Tide of Years • On the Oceans of Eternity)


edit: if we of the above-noted sentiment play and win lotto in our respective areas, we can band together to do some kind of incorporated entity of intent, maybe even some kind of a nonprofit outfit, call it "Council for Support and Perpetuation of Stuff We Want to Read," maybe even pay ourselves salaries if we sell I mean distribute enough books.
 
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MerryPrankster

modelcitizen said:
enough with the faux Vikings etc.

let's go back to Nantucket and the two Hollard dynasties in the Middle East, that sounds more fun to me.
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I think he did say something about a return to Nantucket, although I can't recall the details.

You can always read the short story "Blood Wolf" he wrote that's set 50-odd years after the fall of Walker.
 
Petike

Petike

Is he still writing that series ? :eek:

I hope it will be his undoing. He needs to learn a lesson.

Thande said:
I say this even though I found out yesterday (hilariously) that Stirling has trolled AH.com on TVTropes.
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Did he delete and rewrite the page for Her Diamond Heart ?

EDIT : Nevermind, I didn't notice you mentioned The Peshawar Lancers.
 
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EnglishCanuck

EnglishCanuck

Too long for its worth. I was unimpressed as much of the action took place off screen. The villains manage to do something really villainous and tactically savy and we don't get to see it! COME ON! This character development was also too little to late, especially after he so easily abandoned some VERY choice tidbits early on let me name a few...
1. When Mathilda believes she has caught Rudi cheating in Richmond, hand waved a almost literally a chapter later. All he did was say "No i wasn't" and she believed him! Chauvanism much!?
2. Any in depth mention of what Ingolf suffered while in the clutches of the CUT. I found this very irritating as it deprives us of some crucial insight into his experience and character and it takes away from the villany of the CUT as a whole.
3. Singe being pissed off because Rudi is a bastard. Again this is given some time but seriously hand waved. Singe could have caused a significant stir by refusing to support the Kingdom. So we miss out on good plot development and some cool political back dealing there, instead we are treated to the VERY old story of the Lieus betrayal. That was almost painful to read as we knew exactly what would happen before it even happened. The book seemed to me like one loooooong series of flashbacks.
4. Again not enough screen time with the Villains and lots of of screen evil. Seriously!

All in all the story has started to peter out for me, this seemed like a very long delaying tactic to make money. With a name like Tears of the Sun i expected more, like you know maybe a climactic death of a few major characters and a huge slap to Rudi's face of some sort. But nope a long series of meh. Once again i am simply drawn into looking at the world and how it develops, the characters are but view points into an intruiging and originally AH. Love the world, starting to detest the story.
 

MerryPrankster

What clever bit of villainy got done off-screen? I objected to battles taking place off-screen, but I don't remember any especially-clever enemy gambits.

1. When did this happen? I don't remember it.

3. Given how long it's been since Signe has tried to mess with Rudi and the fact she's even depicted as participating in neo-pagan rites with Juniper, her suddenly going at Rudi again would be a bit out-of-left-field.

About character deaths, SPOILERS

Astrid dies in the commando raid on Boise.

However, I agree 100% in that there was far too much exposition on the fall of Mary Liu. I would have rather seen more battles.
 
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