Anglo-Prussian Union... What happens next?

I stumbled across this in a search for an earlier post:

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=99456&highlight=Reign+Griffin&page=2

and this:

https://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/showthread.php?t=29722&highlight=%22Queen+Sophia%22

My question is:

Following a series of events that links Great Britain and Prussia in Personal Union via Sophia and Frederick...

...what happens next?

Frederick the Great becomes King of Great Britain and Prussia and you take it from there...

War of the Austrian Succession? American Revolution? And beyond into the 19th Century. German Unification impossible?
 
Much of it will depend on where he was raised, and where he chooses to have his main home. I am assuming that it is personal union, and not a joining of the two countries.

If he stays mainly in Prussia then the course of events will be similar to OTL, but I suspect the British Army will be better organised and would have a reliable officer corps who are trained properly so would be better in a war. This would effect the ARW, on the other hand I can see the Navy being even more poorly done by in non war times than in OTL as the money is spent on the army instead.

When Napoleon comes along he MAY think twice about attacking Prussia given that it will be supported by Britain, and the King will flee to UK if it looks like Prussia will be lost. This will give the Prussians a rallying point.

If he moves to Britain then I can see the Prussian Parliment being granted more power and prehaps some more liberal policies coming in to encourage the non military middle classes.

Scientifically I am fasinated by the possibilities of British and German scientists working more closely as the worlds two most industrial powers could geshult into an earlier Industrial Revolution and all that brings.
 
I can't really see how the two can hold together long term. The monarchy is going to treat one place or the other as their primary possession, at which point the ruling classes in the other are going to get fed up and want to get a new King. Britain's view of constitutionalism is likely to mean the problem occurs there first. The American colonies will likely feel even more neglected and a revolution there is close to a certainty, in my opinion.
 
Remember that as a result of the unions with Hanover and the Netherlands, Parliament had already passed laws controlling the following things:

1 - The monarch can't make Britain go to war to defend a continental possession of theirs unless Parliament votes to join the war on their own initiative.
2 - The monarch cannot leave the British Isles without Parliament's permission.
3 - The monarch must return to the British Isles within one year of having been allowed to leave.

Each of these is going to hamper any union between the two states and make it undesirable for the royals. It's also going to be very hard for the monarch to favour Berlin over London unless they are a very active traveller - and chances are Parliament would react negatively to not being preferred over Prussia and would respond by seeking to strengthen their control over all legislative function in Britain.
 
At this time, France and Austria still were the strongest power on the continent, and Britain will rather ally with Austria then with France. So Maria Theresia will have Prussia as an ally - and Prussia may not gain Silesia, but other areas instead. Saxony?
 
At this time, France and Austria still were the strongest power on the continent, and Britain will rather ally with Austria then with France. So Maria Theresia will have Prussia as an ally - and Prussia may not gain Silesia, but other areas instead. Saxony?

I imagine a Franco-Austrian alliance would emerge if faced with an Anglo-Prussian union.
 
I imagine a Franco-Austrian alliance would emerge if faced with an Anglo-Prussian union.

I'd rather go with Max Sinister here, because Prussia before Frederik the Great was not a Great power at all, and after him it was considered the weakest great power. It's only after Napoleon messed up central Europe and the Prussians happened to gain those lands that would later prove most valuable during industrialization that Prussia gained in status. And even in the 1866 and 1871 wars most contemporaries did consider Prussia the weaker side. IMHO, we tend to overestimate Prussian power considerably. In fact, Prussia before gaining Silesia was not that more powerful than Saxony, Hannover or Bavaria. And that's why a Anglo-Prussian union would see the king in Britain, not in Berlin, and mostly interested in serving Britian, not Prussia.

To conclude, I think Prussian expansionism would be limited. Nevertheless, Britain can use the Prussian army in its own interest - for example in Northern America or against France. That's quite an effect.
 
I'd rather go with Max Sinister here, because Prussia before Frederik the Great was not a Great power at all, and after him it was considered the weakest great power. It's only after Napoleon messed up central Europe and the Prussians happened to gain those lands that would later prove most valuable during industrialization that Prussia gained in status. And even in the 1866 and 1871 wars most contemporaries did consider Prussia the weaker side. IMHO, we tend to overestimate Prussian power considerably. In fact, Prussia before gaining Silesia was not that more powerful than Saxony, Hannover or Bavaria. And that's why a Anglo-Prussian union would see the king in Britain, not in Berlin, and mostly interested in serving Britian, not Prussia.

To conclude, I think Prussian expansionism would be limited. Nevertheless, Britain can use the Prussian army in its own interest - for example in Northern America or against France. That's quite an effect.

But bear in mind during the ARW, Britain was already powerful enough to see such divergent powers as the French and the Dutch unite against her. If you add to that empire more substantial European holdings plus an impressive, even if not great power, army, people will get concerned. The French and Austrians united in the Seven Years War in OTL anyway.
 
Frederick may be able to hold the union together through force of personality. His ruling style of enlightened despotism will leave a sour taste with the British parliament. Assuming the OTL Seven years war occurs Prussia may be in a position to acquire Saxony with British support. On Frederick's death the the UK could pass to his primary heir with the continental possessions passing to the next in line.
 
But they didn't seperate Hannover from Britain for quite a long time. (Mentioning it, it makes a nice addition for Prussia.)
 
Except that if America's revolutionary sentiment coincides with British uprest, America's fervor might be more directed at the Prussian King than at Britain per se. So in the immediate term the American Revolution might actually be anglosphere wide and cement ties between America and the Mother Country rather than the reverse. In the medium term you are probably only putting off the break for a few decades, unless . . . the circumstances of the Anglosphere Revolution (or of the few extra decades of good feelings you've bought) create or lead to the creation of constitutional forms that satisfy sufficient Americans

I can't really see how the two can hold together long term. The monarchy is going to treat one place or the other as their primary possession, at which point the ruling classes in the other are going to get fed up and want to get a new King. Britain's view of constitutionalism is likely to mean the problem occurs there first. The American colonies will likely feel even more neglected and a revolution there is close to a certainty, in my opinion.
 
I am assuming that Frederick the Great (What would we actually be calling him here?) resides in Great Britain but as frequently as allowable visits the continent (making it some sort of royal tradition perhaps?), keeping the union together. I have three questions:

1. Would Der Alte Fritz have officially solidified the union?

2. Would it be possible for him to be married to Princess Augusta of Saxe-Gotha? I'm butterflying away his...erm... alleged genital issues, and hoping for a "George III" analog. (It's always better when America rebels against some form of Mad George, IMHO.)

3. Does German Unification now become impossible down the line with Prussia-Hanover in full and complete union with the UK? I suppose Austria could collect the non Hanover-Prussian states into something resembling Germany-sans-Prussia. OTOH, I'm not entirely certain the inclusion of at least some German States that aren't Austria into the United Kingdom of Great Britain, Prussia-Hanover, and Ireland wouldn't satisfy the continental desire for a Kleindeutscheland, although it would surely lead to war...

BONUS QUESTION!: How long do you suppose until the English language adopts significant elements of Deutsch and vice versa? Would it be in enough time to stave off or alter German nationalist feeling in Prussia-Hanover before the Revolutions of 1848?
 
Frederick may be able to hold the union together through force of personality. His ruling style of enlightened despotism will leave a sour taste with the British parliament. Assuming the OTL Seven years war occurs Prussia may be in a position to acquire Saxony with British support. On Frederick's death the the UK could pass to his primary heir with the continental possessions passing to the next in line.

The primary heir would have been his nephew, Friedrich Wilhelm, Prinz von Preussen, who in OTL became Friedrich Wilhelm II of Prussia. He had two brothers, both of whom predeceased Frederick.

This would have made the next in line Prinz Heinrich, Frederick's brother. But he had no children, so the succession would have gone to their brother Ferdinand and his family.
 
The primary heir would have been his nephew, Friedrich Wilhelm, Prinz von Preussen, who in OTL became Friedrich Wilhelm II of Prussia. He had two brothers, both of whom predeceased Frederick.

This would have made the next in line Prinz Heinrich, Frederick's brother. But he had no children, so the succession would have gone to their brother Ferdinand and his family.

I direct you to my post above.
 
But they didn't seperate Hannover from Britain for quite a long time. (Mentioning it, it makes a nice addition for Prussia.)

Prussia doesn't get that unless there's a Hannoverian War of Succession. That would certainly mess up the war of Austrian Succession.
 
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