an even greater threat

one of my most longstanding interests when it comes to alternate history is a succsessful hundred days. the problem being of course that you couldn't make up a more untenable position for a returning dictator to be in.

so, I've recently hit upon a rather novel idea, What if a different enemy, one more dangerous than an over the hill bonaparte rears its ugly head for britain to deal with, and napoleon is able to reclaim a measure of his former office by siding with his former enemy?

the trouble then is figuring out who might pose a threat great enough that britain would give up its rivalry to put down, and how do you put them in place without changing things so drastically that there is no deposed french emperor trying to make his return.
 
one of my most longstanding interests when it comes to alternate history is a succsessful hundred days. the problem being of course that you couldn't make up a more untenable position for a returning dictator to be in.

so, I've recently hit upon a rather novel idea, What if a different enemy, one more dangerous than an over the hill bonaparte rears its ugly head for britain to deal with, and napoleon is able to reclaim a measure of his former office by siding with his former enemy?

the trouble then is figuring out who might pose a threat great enough that britain would give up its rivalry to put down, and how do you put them in place without changing things so drastically that there is no deposed french emperor trying to make his return.

Given how long the various powers had been fighting Napoleon and how bitter the conflict had been that is a very tall order.

One thing does come to mind. Instead of returning in 1815 he is delayed for another year or two. The tension over the future of Saxony and Poland causes conflict between the western powers [Britain, Austria and Royalist France] and the eastern ones [Prussia and Russia]. Although unlikely, have some way that the eastern powers start winning heavily. Then possibly Napoleon returns to rescue the situation, throwing the enemy forces out of France and a de-facto alliance between Napoleon and Britain to finally drive the enemy back. Think its a bit unlikely that the two eastern powers could prove that powerful but only thing I could think of.

Steve
 
well, one way that might happen is if war breaks out close to winter, and the prussians use the break in the fighting to try and whip the russian army into shape. of course that's still a bit of a streach.

a more down to earth idea I suppose would be if a storm in the english channel prevented wellington and the british forces from reaching the netherlands in time.

I don't know though, something just tells me that that would'nt work.
 
one of my most longstanding interests when it comes to alternate history is a succsessful hundred days. the problem being of course that you couldn't make up a more untenable position for a returning dictator to be in.

so, I've recently hit upon a rather novel idea, What if a different enemy, one more dangerous than an over the hill bonaparte rears its ugly head for britain to deal with, and napoleon is able to reclaim a measure of his former office by siding with his former enemy?

the trouble then is figuring out who might pose a threat great enough that britain would give up its rivalry to put down, and how do you put them in place without changing things so drastically that there is no deposed french emperor trying to make his return.

You might have just hit upon the biggest catch-22 of the hundred days right here. Napoleon's best (arguably only) chance to hold onto his throne in 1815 is probably to have some sort of falling out within the Coalition that makes it harder to defeat him and/or for his presence to be accepted, if only grudgingly. The problem with this, however, is that his return had a galvinizing effect on his former rivals, who immediatly united in opposition to him.

I'm not really sure how you can make somebody more repulsive to the crowned heads of europe than napoleon, either. There wasn't much love lost for the emperor in Vienna or Berlin when he was overthrown. Any acceptance of Napoleon is probably going to be made for reasons of realpolitic.

No matter what, Napoleon almost certainly needs to fight in 1815. it only takes one opponent to make a war, after all, and somebody is going to challenge him. His best hope is probably that he can win out, at least initially. After a few victories, certain powers may be more inclined to take his return as a fait acompli, and perhaps might see him as a useful counterbalance to the possibility of somebody else establishing themselves atop europe (ex: Britain or Austria backing him in the face of russia).

Given how long the various powers had been fighting Napoleon and how bitter the conflict had been that is a very tall order.

One thing does come to mind. Instead of returning in 1815 he is delayed for another year or two. The tension over the future of Saxony and Poland causes conflict between the western powers [Britain, Austria and Royalist France] and the eastern ones [Prussia and Russia]. Although unlikely, have some way that the eastern powers start winning heavily. Then possibly Napoleon returns to rescue the situation, throwing the enemy forces out of France and a de-facto alliance between Napoleon and Britain to finally drive the enemy back. Think its a bit unlikely that the two eastern powers could prove that powerful but only thing I could think of.

Steve

A few problems with this scenario. For one thing, would Napoleon really wait this long to return? Could he? I can't remember if the allies were actively planning to remove him from Elba, but there certainly were rumors to that effect. For another, I don't know how feasible his return would be during wartime unless the war went exceptionally badly for the french (although that would be quite the scenario). I don't know if Russia/Prussia could be so successful, but it certainly is possible, especially if their only direct opponents are Austria and possibly Bourbon france.
 
A few problems with this scenario. For one thing, would Napoleon really wait this long to return? Could he? I can't remember if the allies were actively planning to remove him from Elba, but there certainly were rumors to that effect. For another, I don't know how feasible his return would be during wartime unless the war went exceptionally badly for the french (although that would be quite the scenario). I don't know if Russia/Prussia could be so successful, but it certainly is possible, especially if their only direct opponents are Austria and possibly Bourbon france.

Atreus

I didn't say it was a good scenario. Just the best I could think up. As you say its very, very difficult finding a scenario where Napoleon could be seen as a 'least worst' option.;) Especially for Britain.

Possibly the only chance of an ally amongst the major powers for a Napoleonic France might be Austria, given the family connection. Even then its pretty far fetched.

In terms of Napoleon not moving in 1815 it could be that some problem prevents him. Say illness or the early outbreak of war. [He's not likely to be seen as a returning hero if he prompts a civil war while France is fighting off a foreign invasion]. That might also give a reason why the allies don't seek to depose him. [Hadn't heard of that before although I had read that France hadn't been supplying a promised subsidy].

Steve
 
Atreus

I didn't say it was a good scenario. Just the best I could think up. As you say its very, very difficult finding a scenario where Napoleon could be seen as a 'least worst' option.;) Especially for Britain.

Possibly the only chance of an ally amongst the major powers for a Napoleonic France might be Austria, given the family connection. Even then its pretty far fetched.

In terms of Napoleon not moving in 1815 it could be that some problem prevents him. Say illness or the early outbreak of war. [He's not likely to be seen as a returning hero if he prompts a civil war while France is fighting off a foreign invasion]. That might also give a reason why the allies don't seek to depose him. [Hadn't heard of that before although I had read that France hadn't been supplying a promised subsidy].

Steve

Steve

It is rather difficult to think of who would be most likely to support Napoleon. Personally, I wonder if Austria wouldn't be the least likely to support Napoleon, although arguably of the major powers they have the most to gain by supporting him (certainly they didn't care much for their relation). Maybe Russia? Alexander didn't like Napoleon, but he did find it possible to cooperate at times, and they may benefit from an alliance with a resurgent bonapartist france. Britain, as odd as it may seem, might be a good option, if they see a greater threat of, say, Russian hegemony in europe, and Napoleon can convince them of his sincerity (IIRC the british were the least ideological of the coalition).

I'll have to do some checking, but if I remember correctly the idea of Napoleon being deposed and either killed or removed (to, irony of ironies, St. Helena) was at least being floated in Vienna. Certainly rumors to that effect probably reached Elba. As for Napoleon himself, the best way to hold him on the island may be a war involving france, at least unless it goes too poorly (after that, it is easy to imagine him returning to save his nation...). One wonders, though, if there is no war (or if there is), how long he will be willing to sit back and let time pass him by (or how long he will feel secure in doing so...).

Atreus
 
You might have just hit upon the biggest catch-22 of the hundred days right here. Napoleon's best (arguably only) chance to hold onto his throne in 1815 is probably to have some sort of falling out within the Coalition that makes it harder to defeat him and/or for his presence to be accepted, if only grudgingly. The problem with this, however, is that his return had a galvinizing effect on his former rivals, who immediatly united in opposition to him.

that's the nail right on the head.

one rather small change that could do it would be to have russia somehow buy ottoman neutrality during the napoleonic wars thus creating the possibility of a russian-prussian-turkish trifecta if the congress of vienna boils over.

a stranger move might be to make a more powerful united states thhat could at least take up british attention even if it weren't allyed to france.
 
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