An Empire of Dreams: A World where the Magic of Star Wars lived on

agreed. would have loved to have seen a thrawn film aslo

I actually never got to reading Thrawn. In fact, despite being a 90s kid, I never encountered him until Star Wars Rebels :p

I knew of him but my library never had those books and as I got older I didn’t care much for the EU books.

And personally, having seen the Rebels’ adaptation of him... controversial opinion but I don’t find him all that intimidating.

Interesting? Yes, mainly how he seems to want to know his enemies, thereby absorbing their relics and culture. But he didn’t seem that masterful of a strategist (but I guess it may be due to Rebels being aimed at kids so Thrawn can’t win too significantly and crushingly) but he also apparently can take on droids with his bare hands too??

Sounds a tad power creep-ish, to me at least :p
 
“It was a measure of Spielberg’s emotional distance from Raiders of the Lost Ark that he so willingly surrendered his independence to work as an employee of Lucas. Spielberg’s pragmatic decision to prove that he could toe the budgetary line by turning out a piece of unabashed commercial entertainment was only possible, however, because of the mutual respect he and Lucas shared. “I generally let Steven do whatever he wants to do,” Lucas said. “I’m very sensitive to the director and what his problems are because I’ve been a director. And Steven takes suggestions. I mean, I offer lots of suggestions and he takes some of them and some he doesn’t take…. Steven does a great deal of homework when he goes into a picture. He’s very organized.”

“Lucas could say no to Spielberg, and Spielberg, humbled by his experiences on 1941, would listen. When they disagreed, Lucas would say, “Well, it’s your movie. If the audience doesn’t like it, they’re going to blame you.” Giving in, Spielberg would joke, “Okay, but I’m going to tell them that you made me do it.”

“Raiders officially was scheduled for eighty-five days of shooting, but Lucas and Spielberg had a secret plan to make it in only seventy-three days. Kazanjian explains that this was done “to challenge Steven to do it on schedule and budget” and to minimize studio interference: “There are times when you’re over a day, but you know you can pick it up somewhere, and the pressure is so great from the studio. George didn’t want that. George had been successful in being able to make his pictures without studios; that was one of the reasons why Raiders and Star Wars were [based] in Europe, because they were farther away from studio control. [Spielberg’s] taste was richer in the shooting than it had been in preparation, but if Steven wanted something else, we took it from someplace else.”

I said to George, ‘It just is too big. We can’t build this thing. It’s going to cost about a million dollars, and we need to make it smaller. We need to do something.’ I had already gone to Steven on that and was vetoed. So I went to George, and George walked into this conference room we were in, I’ll never forget it, and said [sotto voce], ‘OK, listen to what I’m going to do.’ There was the model. He said, ‘Oh, what’s this?’ He picked up the model of the Flying Wing, like he didn’t know that this is the Flying Wing. It had four engines, two on each side. He said, ‘Terrific’—George always talks in short sentences—‘It’s great. Looks super.’ And he broke the ends of the two wings off, taking two of the motors away. He said, ‘How much money do we save if it’s only this big?’”
With that one gesture, they saved $250,000. The film was completed just under its final budget figure of $20.4 million ($400,000 had been added after Harrison Ford was cast.”
—Joseph McBride. Steven Spielberg.

So yeah. If you can have Lucas use Spielberg as a hired hand the movie is going to go off smoothly. I don't think you can drastically change Lucas, but at least Spielberg and Lucas's crack European team can work together.
 
I actually never got to reading Thrawn. In fact, despite being a 90s kid, I never encountered him until Star Wars Rebels :p

I knew of him but my library never had those books and as I got older I didn’t care much for the EU books.

And personally, having seen the Rebels’ adaptation of him... controversial opinion but I don’t find him all that intimidating.

Interesting? Yes, mainly how he seems to want to know his enemies, thereby absorbing their relics and culture. But he didn’t seem that masterful of a strategist (but I guess it may be due to Rebels being aimed at kids so Thrawn can’t win too significantly and crushingly) but he also apparently can take on droids with his bare hands too??

Sounds a tad power creep-ish, to me at least :p
I think the main reason Thrawn wasn’t as intimidating to you is because he’s not as intimidating in Rebels as he is in the books (from what I’ve heard). Here’s a good video about Thrawn I watched a while ago:
 
Thanks.

I am trying to figure out the importance of Howard Kazanjian on Empire and Return IOTL

I’ll likely have to get in-depth with Return’s making-of but any quick online search and nothing really.

I’m trying to find out whether the change in producers was a factor in the... downgrade in things, including acting. But maybe it’s down to the director? Irvin Kershner seemed awfully personal and connective
 
Yeah, Thrawn of the books is one of the best Star Wars characters of all time - the antithesis of so much of the Empire's leaders. Cold, calm, logical, beloved by his men, brilliant tactician, who relies more on cunning and military prowess than doomsday weapons or the dark side.

To use a historical parallel, Thrawn is interesting because he is to the Galactic Republic what Hannibal was to the Roman Republic.

See also Mara Jade, another of the Thrawn trilogies great inclusions, a hard-bitten cynic for the more idealistic Luke to bounce quips off of.

As far as ideas, since we have thankfully avoided making Luke and Leia sisters, make that a twist - "There is another Skywalker", but Luke will need to find her, likely in the future. Luke now can add finding his missing sibling to restoring the Jedi in the future.

Also, since Lucas isn't getting divorced here, we can butterfly away Jedi celibacy.
 
From what I skimmed regarding Return of the Jedi's making and just the final product itself... I can sorta see the cast and crew just kinda uninterested in putting their all into the final film.

It's like everyone just showed up to work just so they can wrap up the trilogy and get done with it. The flatter, hokier acting and the technical downgrade from cinematography to the flat lighting to George going with ARRIFLEX cameras over the better Panavision cameras, using cheaper Kodak stocks, all of this points to a mix of George and co. wanting to penny pich and get this done ASAP.

Also there's the issue with Ford, but also Hamill almost drowned in Empire while Carrie was having substance abuse issues from drugs to alcohol and taking weight loss pills for the slave girl role (which... what the hell, George/Kasdan? I assume they didn't know what Carrie was going through but even then, still sleazy as all hell...)

Hence why, again, I think he and the rest should have taken years of break.
 
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