An Earlier Panther?

Redbeard

Banned
What Markus said. Sure, the Christie's suspension is good, but it caused significant wear and tear, something that the German economy couldn't cope with. And basically, the Germans didn't need a tank that could run fast on wheels, but was a real oil consumer. The Liberty Engine produced 387HP and was overpowered, high fuel consumption.

Anyway, having the Christie isn't a guarantee that Germany could develop the T-34. IMO the Soviets experimented quite a bit.

The torsion bar suspension of the Pz III (and V and VI) was far superior to the Christie, not at least as it did not take up hull side space and thus limiting the turret ring.

All technology was available to have tank far superior to T34 ready for Barbarossa - but no one knew that was necessary. Perhaps the PoD could be a significant intelligence breakthrough for Wehrmacht - letting them know in details about the T34 and KV 1 programme from its start?

Regards

Steffen Redbeard
 
The torsion bar suspension of the Pz III (and V and VI) was far superior to the Christie, not at least as it did not take up hull side space and thus limiting the turret ring.

All technology was available to have tank far superior to T34 ready for Barbarossa - but no one knew that was necessary. Perhaps the PoD could be a significant intelligence breakthrough for Wehrmacht - letting them know in details about the T34 and KV 1 programme from its start?

Regards

Steffen Redbeard

As others have pointed out,
The intelligence breakthrough is possible, but in the end it's the Germans themselves that decides if the information is to be used.

OTL the Germans encountered heavy French double gun tanks, and you don't see a multi-turreted production tank (except the Maus). So they would actually be more reluctant to use the designs. Why adopt a design that comes from your sworn enemy, and a design that hasn't been tested in the field yet?
 
Perhaps the PoD could be a significant intelligence breakthrough for Wehrmacht - letting them know in details about the T34 and KV 1 programme from its start?
Possible. IIRC, there were T-34s at Nomonhan in '39. All it takes is for Krupp's to say, "Hmm..." & build a T-34-like hull on Pz3/4 running gear, have somebody complain about the front drive sprocket & wonder if the L/48 is enough (rumor about the T-34 being immune to less than the 88 L/56?), & you've got a better tank than the Panther, & before Barbarossa. Add in a bit of handwaving to boost production, =Speer OTL, you can have 50-60,000:eek: built by war's end. Add superior German doctrine & training that's easily equal to over 100,000 T-34s...
 
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Possible. IIRC, there were T-34s at Nomonhan in '39. All it takes is for Krupp's to say, "Hmm..." & build a T-34-like hull on Pz3/4 running gear, have somebody complain about the front drive sprocket & wonder if the L/48 is enough (rumor about the T-34 being immune to less than the 88 L/56?), & you've got a better tank than the Panther, & before Barbarossa. Add in a bit of handwaving to boost production, =Speer OTL, you can have 50-60,000:eek: built by war's end. Add superior German doctrine & training that's easily equal to over 100,000 T-34s...

There were NO T-34s at Nomonhan. The first T-34 came about in 1940, they were going to be sent to Finland for prototype tests but they came too late. It's VERY DOUBTFUL that the Germans will be able to produce 50,000 - they struggled with 8,000. No matter of handwaving is going to make Germany reach those astronomical figures of production.
 
There were NO T-34s at Nomonhan. The first T-34 came about in 1940, they were going to be sent to Finland for prototype tests but they came too late.

Noted. T-26s with a similar hull profile, then?
It's VERY DOUBTFUL that the Germans will be able to produce 50,000 - they struggled with 8,000. No matter of handwaving is going to make Germany reach those astronomical figures of production.

Actually, it isn't. Speer achieved about a 3:1 increase in production, there were 8,870 Pz4s, 6330 Pz5s, 1,355 Pz6s, & 487 Tiger IIs built '39-'45. Given he gets his way in '39 instead of '44, & given the "Pz4.5" takes over all production of these, 50K looks in reach to me...
 
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